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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:03 pm 
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becker wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
the slot gap just keeps the airflow attached to the flat top of the chassis

Unlikely.



Im interested to know as well :)

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 4:46 pm 
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jammin78 wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
After the false nose pic I suddenly had an urge to download Fawlty Towers. And now your sig lunatic. Weirddd.


I'm actually performing in a Fawlty Towers production tonight through to Sunday! What a coincidence!

haha, What role are you playing?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 1:09 am 
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Just ordered 10m of rubber for 2013.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 1:39 am 
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F12012 wrote:
Just ordered 10m of rubber for 2013.


RBR sponsored by Durex next season?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 2:26 am 
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Mr-E wrote:
F12012 wrote:
Just ordered 10m of rubber for 2013.


RBR sponsored by Durex next season?


Don't RBR have a hole in the front of the nose, not good.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:58 am 
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Ok heres a seemingly crazy one but one thats actually very easy to do. There have been many links which show that a flexible outer skin that is attached to the wing could deflect downward to provide either a lower wing or lower wing angle. But the latter would only be useful at lower speeds for increased downforce so you would want a way to control the amount of flexibility. There are many fluids available now which change viscosity when introduced to an electric current. I had a chance to fool around with some of this stuff years ago and its remarkably instantaneous stuff. Many cars use it today in suspension components to alter ride stiffness. To be honest I first thought about this stuff when the flex wing came up in years past but in this case it would not be at all difficult to do (not withstanding FIA legalities of coarse). Just fill the membrane with this fluid and simply have electrical contacts on the nose cone where it meets the chassis. As long as electricity was being introduced to the fluid it would be stiffer, when it's disconnected as we saw in the pit animated gif it would be flimsier.

Might sound crazy but we've certainly seen crazy stuff in F1 before, and its off the shelf technology that would certainly not be beyond Newey.

OK tin foil hat is going back on now.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:46 am 
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Tin foil hats are permissible if you also have tin foil swords and are at a slumber party with fort building. And the forts should be designed by Adrian, to be as flexible as possible.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:50 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
Tin foil hats are permissible if you also have tin foil swords and are at a slumber party with fort building. And the forts should be designed by Adrian, to be as flexible as possible.
Did you just put tin foil hats and slumber party in the same sentence? I'm impressed.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:51 am 
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I actually just read the rest of your post. Don't you think it would be mighty hard to explain this fluid when the car crashes and leaks everywhere? Or is your next theory that that wasn't water leaking out of Mark's car all over the garage last friday?

Guys please also keep and mind that the most exposed bit of every car throughout a weekend are the noses. They're often just sitting out on the pit lane all day early in the weekend. Probably the worst part of the car to try to do something crazy "out there" with, as everyone can have eyes on it pretty easily.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:52 am 
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tootsie323 wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
Tin foil hats are permissible if you also have tin foil swords and are at a slumber party with fort building. And the forts should be designed by Adrian, to be as flexible as possible.
Did you just put tin foil hats and slumber party in the same sentence? I'm impressed.

My last long term relationship started with tin foil hats at a slumber party. There was a lot of liquor involved though. And someone had frozen garlic bread on their face.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:01 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
tootsie323 wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
Tin foil hats are permissible if you also have tin foil swords and are at a slumber party with fort building. And the forts should be designed by Adrian, to be as flexible as possible.
Did you just put tin foil hats and slumber party in the same sentence? I'm impressed.
My last long term relationship started with tin foil hats at a slumber party. There was a lot of liquor involved though. And someone had frozen garlic bread on their face.
Aah - throw in the word 'liquor' and anything is possible¹. Tin foil hats, slumber party - and frozen garlic bread - it all makes sense now!
¹ disclaimer: I do not intend to belittle any long-term relationship on the basis of the above!

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:09 am 
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It was totally worthy of belittlement. Nice use of the footnote. That's super nerdy. I appreciate that.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:58 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
I actually just read the rest of your post. Don't you think it would be mighty hard to explain this fluid when the car crashes and leaks everywhere? Or is your next theory that that wasn't water leaking out of Mark's car all over the garage last friday?

Guys please also keep and mind that the most exposed bit of every car throughout a weekend are the noses. They're often just sitting out on the pit lane all day early in the weekend. Probably the worst part of the car to try to do something crazy "out there" with, as everyone can have eyes on it pretty easily.



Could be on the first point (give the man a tin hat)

On the second point. There would be nothing to see from the outside. Just as no one noticed the nose was flexible until it was observed flexing when under load or being manually manipulated.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:00 am 
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as for the first pic, that started the discussion - seems to be almost kind of mandatory: http://www.f1zone.net/news/specialists- ... aga/16618/

still interested in that mass-damper story - does anyone have comparison-shots (slowmo) from contender cars - or even better - pics from RBR-nose-cam while riding the curbs - should be nice to see the movement from that perspective...

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:56 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
After the false nose pic I suddenly had an urge to download Fawlty Towers. And now your sig lunatic. Weirddd.


I'm actually performing in a Fawlty Towers production tonight through to Sunday! What a coincidence!

haha, What role are you playing?

Ah just some little extra roles, policeman etc. I was accidentally signed up, I hate acting! Went really well though last night, yay.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 7:06 pm 
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Kravitz just tweeted to say this will be explained on the F1 Show tonight on Sky at 8pm.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 7:48 pm 
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Mr-E wrote:
F12012 wrote:
Just ordered 10m of rubber for 2013.


RBR sponsored by Durex next season?


Well they have Fkd the rest of the teams so why not do it safe?


OK, here is a left field one. That is the RBR that started last. What if the 'rubber' nosebag was instead of what is normally there when it starts first?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:02 am 
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So what was the explanation on the F1 Show? We Americans didn't get to see.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:37 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
So what was the explanation on the F1 Show? We Americans didn't get to see.

When I saw that this thread had been bumped I was hoping that some one had posted something from that as well. Guess we'll have to wait.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 8:21 am 
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It's not bendy, It was just broken from vettel hitting the drs sign.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 10:03 am 
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Ted said that bit of the nose isn't especially strong, it's basically just a cover for the camera pods. Because of this it bent easily when it got damaged by the DRS sign. A bit of a nothingy explaination to me tbh but he knows more than I do.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 10:08 am 
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So it got damaged by polystyrene?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 10:19 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
So what was the explanation on the F1 Show? We Americans didn't get to see.

he basically said its not bending and it just at an angle from the damage ?
which im not buying. .. unless the videos have been manipulated ?


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:00 pm 
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.

That "explanation" is not creditable.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:43 am 
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So they can't get the wing closer to the ground by flexing it so they made the nose flex instead.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:09 am 
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I was watching the latest F1 show and they brought this flexing nose up. They said that due to Vettels incident with Maldo and the DRS board, he had broken the camera casing on the nose causing it to "bend" inside the nose as the mechanic tried to pull off the nose.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:14 am 
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All sounds like a big FIA cover up to me... 8)

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:59 am 
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Danny_Boy99 wrote:
I was watching the latest F1 show and they brought this flexing nose up. They said that due to Vettels incident with Maldo and the DRS board, he had broken the camera casing on the nose causing it to "bend" inside the nose as the mechanic tried to pull off the nose.


No way in hell. Carbon fiber doesnt bend like that and if it were broken it shatters. There is obviously some soft material on the outside of that nose and its not carbon fiber period.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:20 am 
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Four pages of people attempting to find scientific explanations for the bent wing, and the actual reason is that Vettel hit a signpost.

This forum amazes me sometimes... ;)

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:34 am 
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Carbon fiber CAN bend like that. Research it.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:40 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
Carbon fiber CAN bend like that. Research it.


Dude your so full of it. Why wont you provide some proof of carbon fiber being able too bend like plastic...

Your such an expert ay? :lol: not :smug:

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:42 am 
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Emerson.F wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
Carbon fiber CAN bend like that. Research it.


Dude your so full of it. Why wont you provide some proof of carbon fiber being able too bend like plastic...

Your such an expert ay? :lol: not :smug:


have a look at massa's experimental front wing from the end of last year :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:44 am 
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So the nose was broken because Vettel hit a piece of polystyrene? Ok

How does that explain why Webber's nose also flexes when he hits a kerb, in the second pic? Red Bulls are masters of using flex for aero gain, and doing it under the FIA's radar. I think they have something up their sleeve, that might also explain their flexi wings last season.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:46 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
Carbon fiber CAN bend like that. Research it.


I have a carbon fiber bow and it not only bends, but bends at different rates along its length. (no, not due do differing thickness, through design)

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:43 am 
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The nose is, according to the regs, not meant to be flexible.

The video shows something is not right and Sky's programme was rubbish.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:55 am 
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Emerson.F wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
Carbon fiber CAN bend like that. Research it.


Dude your so full of it. Why wont you provide some proof of carbon fiber being able too bend like plastic...

Your such an expert ay? :lol: not :smug:



Carbon fibres stiffness is nothing to do with the carbon. In it's bare state it's a fabric FFS. Comes in a roll and can be cut with a pair of scissors.

It's only after the resin is added it gets all it's strength properties. and depending on the resin and methods used decides it's flexibility or lack off.

Image

Now that looks like bent carbon fibre to me.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:23 pm 
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pg55555 wrote:
.

The nose is, according to the regs, not meant to be flexible.

The video shows something is not right and Sky's programme was rubbish.

.

The first GIF shows them removing a damaged nose. It's bending because there's structural damage, nothing more.

The second GIF is useless as evidence of any sort because the number of colors available in the GIF format means that it can't show all of the shades of yellow needed to render that bit of video correctly, which in turn can make you see something that's not really there. If you weren't looking for a flexing nose in that, you just as easily say that RBR is using a strange photovoltaic paint in the nose to illegally harvest energy for their KERS.

Edit: actually going back and looking at the second one, if you look at the the whole picture instead of focusing on the "bending" part of the nose, you'll see that the the whole thing rises and dips at the same time as the rest of the front of the car. Where if the nose was doing as is being suggested it would stay down when the wheels went over a high spot of the curb, and would rebound by going up when the rest of the front was going down. This is just someone wanting to make something out of nothing, and people will see what they want to see.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:51 pm 
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Emerson - Please see: cf surfboards, orthotics, prosthetics, ski poles, JEV's front wing in India, racing seats...just for starters.

This is about suspension components, but it does include a good introduction to how different types of carbon fiber, different resins, and different methods for layup and design can influence the integrity and behavior of the final product.
http://www.gef.es/Congresos/24/pdf/3-13.pdf

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:30 pm 
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If other teams didnt know about this before, they do now...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 7:05 am 
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Find it very amusing the amount of people who think carbon fibre isn't flexible.
News flash guys; almost all fishing rods these days are made from carbon fibre - all are flexible - some are VERY flexible.

Someone also says it can't break without shattering - wrong again - I have first hand experience of broken carbon fibre. It can break in all sorts of ways. From a clean snap to a million splinters.

How many times have we seen the end fence of a front wing being partially broken and be flapping around as the driver continues?

It's entirely feasible - and actually it's what seems to have happened - for the camera mounting to be partially broken from the nose one one side, so that it can be bend downwards from where it is still attached on the other side.

Tinfoil hats off guys. :)


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