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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:51 pm 
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This topic is so offensive that I just didn't read anything else.

:thumbdown: :thumbdown:


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:13 pm 
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Massa is lucky to have such a good seat. His overall performance these past few years has been very mixed.

Im sure he got the 2013 contract on the basis that he would be a team player. He is the #2 driver in Ferrari, deal with it.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:23 pm 
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chican wrote:
This topic is so offensive that I just didn't read anything else.

:thumbdown: :thumbdown:


lol, eat more and more chicans.... ;)


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:56 pm 
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trento wrote:
nktoofan wrote:
trento wrote:
Massa has already kept his seat. There's nothing much left for Massa to fight but everything for Alonso to lose. It was the right decision. Massa needs to be quick over the course of a season and not just the past few grand prix. If he was in this position (fighting for the title), Alonso would do the same to help him. The hardest part would be having to give the win to Alonso in Brazil if necessary. And that happened in 07 too. Hopefully, he gets up to speed right away in 2013.


I would disagree with you, Alonso will not help him mark my word


It's Stefano who decides, not Alonso.


LOL You can't be this naive, can you?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:00 pm 
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iceman_fan90 wrote:
trento wrote:
nktoofan wrote:
trento wrote:
Massa has already kept his seat. There's nothing much left for Massa to fight but everything for Alonso to lose. It was the right decision. Massa needs to be quick over the course of a season and not just the past few grand prix. If he was in this position (fighting for the title), Alonso would do the same to help him. The hardest part would be having to give the win to Alonso in Brazil if necessary. And that happened in 07 too. Hopefully, he gets up to speed right away in 2013.


I would disagree with you, Alonso will not help him mark my word


It's Stefano who decides, not Alonso.


LOL You can't be this naive, can you?

LOL You can't be this (add your pejorative word), can you?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:11 pm 
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LKS1 wrote:
ManojHS wrote:
nktoofan wrote:
SwSpeed wrote:
Massa is no beggar. He had nothing to say about the demotion.

Ferrari did an gamble because they changed the whole order behind Massa. Massa did a great race, better than Alonso this time around.


That's what everyone saying, if he is good enough to beat Alonso he should also demand respect and equal treatment (maybe not this time but 2013 for sure and should not give in to team's every demand and should race for himself as well.



He wouldn't even dream of demanding equal status. Alonso has Santander it is probably established in his contract that he will get the best internal resources and certain measures will be taken granting him a sure no1 role. Alonso's perspective of the sport is very different, he does not want a driver driving the same car and competing with him.

:thumbup:


But for usage of a common brain... How can you tell that Massa is crap and "crawling on his four to beg a drive" this kind of reasoning is the dumbest ofball dumbnesses.

Ferrari allowed one of their drivers to take over and build a team around him and ignored the other one. This is a stupid choice because the team does have a cance winning the constructor championship because you need 2 cars competing for the points.

Ferrari is lucky to be on second position on WCC if Grosjean would not crash that much this year they would be behind Lotus as a team as well as McLaren have lost on their own troubles. This all is about a lack of being a team.

Last time around when they were a team was 2007 when Kimi clinched his WDC but they were even more a team during Shuey years where they cruised in 1-2 position Every race. In racing you want your preferred guy to get 1st and the second guy2nd to take away points from the competition.

Ferrari has totally failed on this during Alonso-era... They gone all in on WDC, failed and forgot about the WCC which pays the millions... Even morethan Santander

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:04 pm 
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Does anyone believe that Massa had a choice? I strongly suspect the team came to him and informed him that they were going to break the seal on his gearbox in order to benefit Alonso.

And Massa did not go down in disgrace, those who actually watched and remember the weekend know that 1) Massa qualified better than Alonso and 2) he moved up the field more than Alonso did.

Anyways, when you are part of a "team", and get paid €10m, what other outcome can anyone expect?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:07 pm 
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Massa's performances in the last half of the year have more than merited his driver at Ferrari for 2013. He's found something in himself again, something that has been missing since 2010. Next year will most likely be his last in a top car but if he can continue the kind of form he;s shown late this year then he'll go out on a big high.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:11 pm 
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you guys moaning havent a clue.

it says to me hes very employable as a driver, I said weeks ago massa is a great #2.

if he disobeyed orders he would be out of F1.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:57 am 
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chrcoluk wrote:
you guys moaning havent a clue.

it says to me hes very employable as a driver, I said weeks ago massa is a great #2.

if he disobeyed orders he would be out of F1.


Self respect is above anything else, having said that I also appreciate Massa's temperament, the guy keep his head down and keep calm and cool, if he retaliate he was going to loose his seat and with that one more short at WDC next year.

I would again hope he could stay well ahead of Alonso next year to make the team and Alonso realize that he is a potent force to mess with and despite all the handicaps he could emerge victorious.

I personally like him and Rubens but both the Brazilian are unable to win a single WDC after so many efforts, so hoping that Massa could do it in 2013.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:20 am 
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In the second last race, every driver/team would have done what massa did.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:27 am 
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Massa wasn't too happy about it. But Ferrari effectively ruined his reputation. It's amazing how a team can back you one year then leave you all alone in the next. No respect for the Ferrari snakes at all. He complies with it only because it's the only top seat available to him.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:25 am 
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Let him win next year then maybe we could hear about this story from him


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:59 am 
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Piket87 wrote:
Massa wasn't too happy about it. But Ferrari effectively ruined his reputation. It's amazing how a team can back you one year then leave you all alone in the next. No respect for the Ferrari snakes at all. He complies with it only because it's the only top seat available to him.

Felipe Massa has been backed by Ferrari throughout his entire career.

They got him his first seat at Sauber in 2002. He was ditched for 2003 when Ferrari took him on as a test driver. Ferrari then got him a seat at Sauber again for 2004 & 2005 before hiring him to drive their own cars from 2006 onwards.

No Ferrari backing = No F1 career for Felipe Massa.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:46 am 
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Piket87 wrote:
Massa wasn't too happy about it. But Ferrari effectively ruined his reputation. It's amazing how a team can back you one year then leave you all alone in the next. No respect for the Ferrari snakes at all. He complies with it only because it's the only top seat available to him.


I so agree. Ferrari management is at fault here not supporting the #2 enough and destroying his image.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:21 pm 
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SwSpeed wrote:
Piket87 wrote:
Massa wasn't too happy about it. But Ferrari effectively ruined his reputation. It's amazing how a team can back you one year then leave you all alone in the next. No respect for the Ferrari snakes at all. He complies with it only because it's the only top seat available to him.


I so agree. Ferrari management is at fault here not supporting the #2 enough and destroying his image.

Not just Massa's image but Ferrari's image as well


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:27 pm 
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How does it affect Massas image?

Everyone knows he would have had no say in it.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:00 pm 
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ManojHS wrote:
nktoofan wrote:
SwSpeed wrote:
Massa is no beggar. He had nothing to say about the demotion.

Ferrari did an gamble because they changed the whole order behind Massa. Massa did a great race, better than Alonso this time around.


That's what everyone saying, if he is good enough to beat Alonso he should also demand respect and equal treatment (maybe not this time but 2013 for sure and should not give in to team's every demand and should race for himself as well.



He wouldn't even dream of demanding equal status. Alonso has Santander it is probably established in his contract that he will get the best internal resources and certain measures will be taken granting him a sure no1 role. Alonso's perspective of the sport is very different, he does not want a driver driving the same car and competing with him.


That's why i believe Alonso is overrated by media etc. Alonso needs the #1 status more then any other racer on the grid to win races and why people call Alonso the most complete racer is a mistery to me and don't come with so called out perform the car nonsense because it is nonsense

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:05 pm 
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chrcoluk wrote:
you guys moaning havent a clue.

it says to me hes very employable as a driver, I said weeks ago massa is a great #2.

if he disobeyed orders he would be out of F1.


So why does Alonso need #1 status in the first place if he is considered the most complete driver like his fans & media claim ?

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Last edited by Guccio on Thu Nov 22, 2012 8:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:11 pm 
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Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Does anyone believe that Massa had a choice? I strongly suspect the team came to him and informed him that they were going to break the seal on his gearbox in order to benefit Alonso.

And Massa did not go down in disgrace, those who actually watched and remember the weekend know that 1) Massa qualified better than Alonso and 2) he moved up the field more than Alonso did.

Anyways, when you are part of a "team", and get paid €10m, what other outcome can anyone expect?


and then again where is Alonso's self respect ?

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:29 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
How does it affect Massas image?

Everyone knows he would have had no say in it.


True he have no say but it affects his image and value

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 9:37 am 
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SwSpeed wrote:
Johnston wrote:
How does it affect Massas image?

Everyone knows he would have had no say in it.


True he have no say but it affects his image and value

I doubt it due to his image and value not being all that high in the first place. And I suspect other teams have noted what a valuable team player Massa can be at times.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 9:43 am 
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Guccio wrote:
ManojHS wrote:
nktoofan wrote:
SwSpeed wrote:
Massa is no beggar. He had nothing to say about the demotion.

Ferrari did an gamble because they changed the whole order behind Massa. Massa did a great race, better than Alonso this time around.


That's what everyone saying, if he is good enough to beat Alonso he should also demand respect and equal treatment (maybe not this time but 2013 for sure and should not give in to team's every demand and should race for himself as well.



He wouldn't even dream of demanding equal status. Alonso has Santander it is probably established in his contract that he will get the best internal resources and certain measures will be taken granting him a sure no1 role. Alonso's perspective of the sport is very different, he does not want a driver driving the same car and competing with him.


That's why i believe Alonso is overrated by media etc. Alonso needs the #1 status more then any other racer on the grid to win races and why people call Alonso the most complete racer is a mistery to me and don't come with so called out perform the car nonsense because it is nonsense

How so? Alonso has won 3 races this season, where Massa finished 15th, 16th & 12th respectively. Not entirely sure how Massa was helping him from so far back.

In fact, you have to go back to Germany 2010 in order to pick out a race that Massa helped Alonso win. Alonso has won 6 GPs since.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 8:07 am 
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Its time for Massa to ram Vettel off the track, he is closer to him and will never get his chance again


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:59 am 
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mcdo wrote:
Guccio wrote:
ManojHS wrote:
nktoofan wrote:
SwSpeed wrote:
Massa is no beggar. He had nothing to say about the demotion.

Ferrari did an gamble because they changed the whole order behind Massa. Massa did a great race, better than Alonso this time around.


That's what everyone saying, if he is good enough to beat Alonso he should also demand respect and equal treatment (maybe not this time but 2013 for sure and should not give in to team's every demand and should race for himself as well.



He wouldn't even dream of demanding equal status. Alonso has Santander it is probably established in his contract that he will get the best internal resources and certain measures will be taken granting him a sure no1 role. Alonso's perspective of the sport is very different, he does not want a driver driving the same car and competing with him.


That's why i believe Alonso is overrated by media etc. Alonso needs the #1 status more then any other racer on the grid to win races and why people call Alonso the most complete racer is a mistery to me and don't come with so called out perform the car nonsense because it is nonsense

How so? Alonso has won 3 races this season, where Massa finished 15th, 16th & 12th respectively. Not entirely sure how Massa was helping him from so far back.

In fact, you have to go back to Germany 2010 in order to pick out a race that Massa helped Alonso win. Alonso has won 6 GPs since.


Have you been sleeping under a rock or something?
We mostly discuss the support of one driver results in no support for the other driver. Massa has been molested by the team. Maybe they realized that this is a team sport and they need to support two drivers all the way through.

Maybe Luca has run out of patience... Still it's Kimi who have the latest champ with the team.

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