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I'd much rather watch a race like today than 22 cars in procession at Monaco. Just saying...

I don't think you get the point the OP is making. It isn't about a lack of excitement or anything, it's a lack of talent. There was some really really dumb moves out there today by people who should have known much better.

With the exception of dunderheads like Maldonado F1 seems to have a much higher standard of driving in it's top echelon than IndyCar does.

Why do people always assume naiveness or ignorance are behind someone disliking a series?

Because I refer to it as NASCRAP it's disrespectful to drivers who disrespect the very essence of the sport I grew up loving? Because a Hollywood blockbuster changed the perception of the majority of up and coming drivers who think "rubbin' is racin'" and the powers that be turned a blind eye to it for the same reasons hockey doesn't police, and actually allow fighting? I guess whatever increases ratings huh?

Sorry, NASCAR is a series where drivers add unnecessary risk to an already mightily risky venture because they flat out don't have the skill and talent to pass cars on track cleanly. So instead, let's bump the guy I can't manage to get past and who cares if he goes flying into the wall, or flips multiple times or maybe even sends some debris flying into the stands and place even more peoe in harms way. Yeah, no thanks.

I realize there are some quality drivers in NASCAR and I actually really like many of them, but to turn a blind eye and shrug the shoulders and chalk it up to the now commonplace cop out and simply allow it to continue to be the supposed nature of the beast is flat out wrong. I remember a NASCAR where drivers drove cleanly and skillfully and worked their buts off over dozens and dozens of laps to figure out the guy ahead in order to make fair passes without putting them I to the wall. Guys like Bill Elliot, Dale Earnhardt Sr., Richard Petty, Wally Dallenback, Yarborough, Wallace, Martin, Allison, Kulwicki, Bodine, Marlin, Gant, Labonte, the Waltrips, and many others who drove brilliantly every week without increasing the risk factor by plowing through people. What's more, these guys did it in factory cars modified to race on the track according to specs. Why do I mention this? Because those cars were inherently less stellar than true race cars built from the ground up and they were difficult to drive and easier to lose control of. And I realize they had there share of accidents and pile ups, but it was almost always a slight mistake or misjudgment which is entirely different from what some of these morons are doing today!!!

I'd say it's more "Rose colored glasses" than ignorance or naivety.

Rubbin' is Racin' was around long before "Days of Thunder" and to act like bumping or putting some pressure on another cars rear quarter panel is something new is silly, and you can't get all bent about what the Busch boys are doing while hailing Earnhart Sr., Yarborough, Waltrip as being clean drivers who made all of their passes on merit.

I will agree with you about the old production based cars. When they started to move away from that model is when I lost interest and pretty much stopped watching about 1980, but I don't see a lot of difference between how much contact goes on today and what went on 30 or more years ago.

As usual Indy delivered a great race, cant remember the last boring one but I can remember a few F1 races like that recently. At least these guys have a go at racing and only get ten goes at push to pass instead of every lap

I agree with comments about Power - he moans his donkey off about everyone else, never his fault etc but seems to get away with whatever he does

The worst crash tho was Dixon pushing Justin Wilson into the wall, felt really bad for Justin as im sure he would have won the race, but maybe as he was all over Dixon his eagerness cost him as he could probably have picked his spot to get past better

As usual Indy delivered a great race, cant remember the last boring one but I can remember a few F1 races like that recently. At least these guys have a go at racing and only get ten goes at push to pass instead of every lap

I agree with comments about Power - he moans his donkey off about everyone else, never his fault etc but seems to get away with whatever he does

The worst crash tho was Dixon pushing Justin Wilson into the wall, felt really bad for Justin as im sure he would have won the race, but maybe as he was all over Dixon his eagerness cost him as he could probably have picked his spot to get past better

Can someone tell me what the heck this turn martial is thinking waving a green flag?!?!?!?!?!?

Green flag signifies when it is safe to race, past his point there is no more hazards so from that point on it's safe to race again.

I don't think you get the point the OP is making. It isn't about a lack of excitement or anything, it's a lack of talent. There was some really really dumb moves out there today by people who should have known much better.

With the exception of dunderheads like Maldonado F1 seems to have a much higher standard of driving in it's top echelon than IndyCar does.

To me it looks like he's in the process of pulling it in.

Green flag signifies when it is safe to race, past his point there is no more hazards so from that point on it's safe to race again.

I'm not sure how it's safe to race with those two damaged cars STOPPED on the track just past his vantage point, not to mention the pile up to his right.

But F1 was like this in the past. Schumacher, Senna all were pretty dangerous themselves. Actually, that made F1 really exciting to watch then.

If specdecible is right.... the trouble is BEHIND the green flag, which would mean that the track is clear ahead of it... thereby safe to race.

Maybe what I wrote before was too hard to understand. There are STOPPED cars on EITHER SIDE of the guy waving the flag. Does that make sense?? Or, do you think it's the correct time to be waving a green flag when pretty much all you can see is wrecked cars all over the track?!?!?!!????

Maybe what I wrote before was too hard to understand. There are STOPPED cars on EITHER SIDE of the guy waving the flag. Does that make sense?? Or, do you think it's the correct time to be waving a green flag when pretty much all you can see is wrecked cars all over the track?!?!?!!????

There is also wreckage all around him, bearing in mind its all to obvious that a SC has to be called then i don't understand the green flag at all. Is this a case that the marshalls throw flags as instructed rather than making their own on the spot decisions?

Maybe he is just bringing the green flag in.

IndyCar: Barfield explains his calls and non-calls at Long Beach

Beaux Barfield promised the 2014 Verizon IndyCar season would be dictated more by the race drivers than Race Control and that was certainly evident in Sunday's 40th annual Toyota Grand Prix of Long Beach.

No penalties were handed down for the contact between Will Power and Simon Pagenaud or Justin Wilson and Scott Dixon, which left some competitors and fans scratching their collective heads.

"We said before the season began that we were going to change the way we officiate and take more of a hands-off approach," said Barfield (LEFT). "And I think that's what you saw last Sunday."

Of course the most popular topic on the Long Beach "hit list" was Power putting his former teammate and vacation pal Pagenaud into the tire barriers.

"Myself and the other two stewards (Johnny Unser and Brian Barnhart) looked at the replays and acknowledged that we would have likely called that a penalty last year but it's something we will no longer call," said Barfield. "It was two guys racing hard for position but we didn't see it as malicious."

As for Dixon appearing to shove Wilson into the wall, Barfield explained: "You could say the line that Dixon took into the corner was either slightly defensive or that he left Justin some room on the left. But you can see on the replay that Justin turned back into Scott and he initiated the contact.

"You can also see that Scott was looking hard right and may not have known he (Wilson) was there. But Justin probably wasn't going to make the corner and it was too late for him to do a crossover move because he was too far alongside Dixon."

Asked if it seemed ironic he was defending the 2013 champion who repeatedly called for him to be fired, Barfield replied: "No, because I don't hold grudges, I don't play favorites and that's the way it should be."

When Graham Rahal spun out Wilson at the hairpin, he got a drive-through penalty but, later, when rookie Mikhail Aleshin turned Rahal around at the same place, he got nothing.

"Graham got penalized because he spun Justin before we even went back to green and he was beating on his bumper all the way from Turn 9," explained Barfield. "That was an easy call to make.

"But when Graham got turned he had moved off-line going into the hairpin – maybe trying to dictate Aleshin's exit, I don't know – but when the kid moved back on line he hit Rahal and turned him. If Graham keeps his normal line, it's the Chrome Horn and the rookie gets a penalty."

Race Control's new procedure is that the three stewards decide on whether to call a penalty and it takes a majority vote.

"The rule of avoidable contact has changed – it's now just contact," said Barfield. "That's how we are officiating and we didn't think Will, Scott and Mikhail were negligent or reckless as the newly-worded rules state.

"But the bottom line is that we don't want races to be decided by Race Control. It's up to the drivers to sort things out."

And likely that means dollar signs for Dallara – better make a whole bunch of new front wings for Alabama.

tbh I could watch a Formula 1600 race and see just as good if not better racing. I see and hear indy car fans jump up and yell that the indy car has 'the best racing ever'. But i dont see it, and i dont get excited about it. Lemme explain why i dont get excited about it. In F1, we have different cars that have different strengths and weaknesses, some are good on the straight, some or good in the corners, some are good on breaking, and some are good on acceleration. The Drivers exploit their car's strengths and their opponent's as well as managing their own weaknesses to get past eachother. In Indy Car all the cars are identical, its a spec series. I find that that makes it very difficult to get excited about a battle forming, because we know that theyre the same and have no advantage or weakness over the other. So please explain to me what makes indy car racing so great.

Is it the overtaking? sure theres alot, but its difficult to get excited about it because of what i mentioned earlier.
Is it the Unpredictability? That unpredictability doesnt exist as much as Indy fans say it does. In 2012, 13 of the 15 races were won by Ganassi, Penske, or Andretti. In 2013, 14 out of the 19 races were won by one of those three teams.
Is it the crashes? Anyone who watches racing for the crashes needs to have their head checked.

I see your point, to a point. The only thing spec in Indy these days is the chassis. There are currently 2 engines, Chevy and Honda, so there's a bit of variance in the "spec" there.

Furthermore, what we can for sure ascertain is which drivers are better than others via observing how well they drive throughout the season. If a driver bests the competition, then certainly he's a really good driver. However, theres also the ability of a driver and team to get their setups correct which adds a bit of complexity to the equation, in assessing a driver's ability.

As with most series, you have a clutch of excellent, top tier drivers, some decent ones and then a few that either bought their way in or just made it by the skin of their teeth, but are decent enough to run without much incident. Some of these guys develop into great drivers and some fade away, but that's the case with every series.

What IRL is indeed missing are multiple chassis as well as engines to mix things up a bit more but currently, the economic climate won't support that and it seems no other engine manufacturers want in. I'd love to see Toyota and Ford come back, as well as the Mercedes but time will tell if they'll ever invest as much as they did in the 90's to build up a series, only to have the powers that be, drive it right into the ground because they can't look past their egos.

Currently the IRL is an OK series to watch for me and I'm making a conscious effort to follow it more closely, but I'm going in with reservations that I wish weren't there because I want to give it a fair shake. Having JPM driving full time will help.

I think that there are some great drivers in the IRL. I dont deny that at all. Bourdais, Wilson, Power, Sato, Hinch. But the on track product is poor. Some people call it great, but i call it poor. There are alot of silly crashes in the IRL which could have been avoided either from Steward decision or Driver decision. Like last weekend at LB, that crash could have been avoided. There was no way RHR was going to get past unless he was along side immediately coming out of the corner. The crash that killed Wheldon could have been avoided if the IRL didnt want to have a glory run for the old car and fielded less cars. Detroit race in 2012 where the track started to fall apart ruined the on track product. Detroit #2 2013 was full of silly crashes of people making half moves up the inside and clipping the outside car sending them in to a spin. in 2011, they tried to restart a race on a wet track causing several cars to spin out.

I think it is a bit rich to say that Weldon was killed because IRL wanted to have a glory run for the old cars...or because of the number of cars in the field. You don't know that, it is only speculation. That is like saying that F1 would be safer yet if you eliminated Turn 1 at the start of each race. What would you have had the IRL do? Just not race until the new cars were ready? I know of no racing series that would have done that.

Im not saying that that doesnt happen in F1. There are crashes in F1 that are stupid, and shouldnt have happened, Maldonado Bahrain 2014 for example.

IRL cars look awkward on track, especially road tracks. they look better on ovals. They just look badly balanced with that massive, high, fat rear wing and the skinny front wing. They also look slow, the speed trap times and lap times show that they arent slow, but the looks slow on breaking and turn in, in particular. What was great about Champ Car, and whats great about F1 is that they are fast and nimble and are fun to watch going around a track. IRL cars dont produce that, due to the badly balanced looking cars.

Personally... I think the IRL cars look great compared to the F1 "praying mantis" look. I have a hard time accepting that they LOOK slow while "speed trap times and lap times show that they aren't slow" as an argument against IRL cars. In my opinion, the IRL cars look fast, much faster than F1 cars. The low noses, simple front wings instead of multi-stacked wings looking like an automotive "baklava", sleek without a bunch of hung-on aerodynamics, and that "heavy" rear end just completes a streamlined look. Contrast that with spindly looking awkward bodies with all kinds of after-market appearing wings stuck on it and a skinny little spoiler. How does that look fast? The answer... because that is what you are used to, and what you expect to see. How anybody can look at this year's vacuum-cleaner nose Ferrari and criticize the appearance of another open-wheel car is beyond me.

Furthermore, IRL cars dont change. The cars that they race today are exactly the same as they raced in 2012 when they started using that particular car. Before that, the previous car barely changed since they started using them in 2002. Its the same every year. Sure the engines change slightly, from single turbo to twin turbo. But like you said the chassis is the same. What we as viewers see from the outside hasnt changed since 2012. They keep promising Aero-Kits, but I'll tell ya that it wont work, because every aero kit has to be available for every team, which means that every team will end up using the same one as they find out which one is the best and we are right back at square 1. In F1, we have the pleasure of seeing how teams deal with rule changes every year, whether it be the ban of EBD, the 2005, 2009, 2014 aero changes, the 2006, 2014 engine changes, the lower noses, the ban of traction control, the introduction of KERS and ERS, Tyre Changes every year. We also get innovation in F1 every year, double diffusers, F Duct, EBD, Coanda exhaust, the twin tusk nose. Even in Champ Car we saw some innovation as the teams were able to play around a bit. The gills we see on the rear wings above the wing itself was innovated by the Forsythe team in 2004 i think. The IRL gives us nothing to look forward to. Maybe there's something that I missed though.

The need for yearly change is negated by using a spec chassis... which is part of the reason why you can run an IRL team for about a 10th of what it takes for an F1 team. It doesn't bother me at all that IRL doesn't have new nose (actually, judging by the new F1 noses, that is a bonus!!!). All these change can stir up the field as we are seeing this year, but it also adds greatly to the expense. I believe in F1 being the epitome of open-wheel racing, so I don't mind the expense factor, but I also understand the kinds of things that make the sport so expensive and why the little teams are constantly screaming about cost.

The other issue is when those changes contrive to make the cars slower and less exciting... which is a trend we have been seeing in F1. You see the IRL cars as looking slower but being faster. I see the F1 cars looking like a hodpodge and being slower! Those are quite the extremes. While you enjoy seeing how teams deal with rule changes every year, I would enjoy less rule changes and allowing the teams to fully develop what they have before moving on after such short periods of time.

I am not saying that either of us is right or wrong, but certainly things can be seen differently...