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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 2:11 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
2013 FR3.5, Will Stevens, Nico Muller, Nigel Melker?


Vandoorne, Magnussen and AFdC more than made up for these three.

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In 2014 the European F3 Champion Marciello could not even make the top 6 in GP2, he actually competed against Sainz in European F3 and the F3 Euroseries in 2012 and beat him both series managing 13 race wins against the 1 race win for Sainz, they both started in single seaters in 2010.


And? Some people just don't translate their performances in the lower series that well towards higher series.
That being said, GP2 is hard to break into for all the wrong reasons. Mostly because you have semi-career GP2 drivers who I wouldn't consider the greatest talents but who, through experience, can get to the top. Palmer is a good example - I don't rate him above a driver like Merhi but he still beat Marciello. So drivers like Palmer, to me, don't really make the GP2 field more impressive.

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FR3.5 Champion Magnussen is now a F1 reject


Unfair comparison. He was replaced by Alonso, which is hardly a shame, and McLaren left it way too late to give him chances elsewhere.

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post 2010 we have GP2 drivers Grosjean, Perez and Madonando in F1 as opposed to just Ricciardo from FR3.5, new entries are Nasr from GP2 and Sainz from FR3.5.


We had Vergne from FR3.5, I would argue he is at least as good as Perez and Maldonado, possibly Grosjean too. I'd dare to put Alguersuari there too.

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Next year in GP2 the pick of the crop will be:-


Another unfair comparison, and you know it. Of course the field this year will be much stronger, we both know how it was going to be and why it changed.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 2:58 pm 
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Still I'm not sure quality of GP2 drivers is much higher than for example Renault 3.5 if at all. My point is that nowadays the most talented drivers are picked before they go to GP2.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 3:09 pm 
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dizlexik wrote:
Still I'm not sure quality of GP2 drivers is much higher than for example Renault 3.5 if at all. My point is that nowadays the most talented drivers are picked before they go to GP2.


For 2015 that's undoubtedly going to be the case. Sure there's talented people in FR3.5 with Rowland, de Vries and Stoneman, but by moving Lynn and Gasly to GP2 where Vandoorne and Marciello were, a big shift has occured. Taken together, the latter 4 drivers do trump the former 3 in my view.

That's the reigning GP3 champ, GP2 vice-champ (champ moved out), FR3.5 vice-champ (champ moved to F1) and a former F3 winner on one side, and FR3.5 third, FR2.0 champ and GP3 runner-up on the other side.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:06 pm 
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mds wrote:
dizlexik wrote:
Still I'm not sure quality of GP2 drivers is much higher than for example Renault 3.5 if at all. My point is that nowadays the most talented drivers are picked before they go to GP2.


For 2015 that's undoubtedly going to be the case. Sure there's talented people in FR3.5 with Rowland, de Vries and Stoneman, but by moving Lynn and Gasly to GP2 where Vandoorne and Marciello were, a big shift has occured. Taken together, the latter 4 drivers do trump the former 3 in my view.

That's the reigning GP3 champ, GP2 vice-champ (champ moved out), FR3.5 vice-champ (champ moved to F1) and a former F3 winner on one side, and FR3.5 third, FR2.0 champ and GP3 runner-up on the other side.


Its always been the case that the best drivers don't usually make it to GP2/F3000. There are very few champions of these series who went on to win multiple F1 races. I think Only 3 in nearly 40 years.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:05 pm 
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mds wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I just want to correct you that Vandoorne put himself into FR3.5,


He joined the McLaren program well ahead of the 2013 FR3.5 season start. McLaren could have placed him in GP2 just as easily as RBR have placed Gasly and Lynn in GP2 a few weeks ago.

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also getting beat in a series is not mastering a series


He'd done enough and with Magnussen gone he was going to be just about the strongest driver in the series with a year of experience to boot. He was always going to learn more in a new environment again.

Yes you are right but Lynn and Gasly raced in a higher series before joining GP2 i have never heard of any driver going from FRenault 2.0 to GP2 before.

Hamilton was also going to be the strongest driver in F3 after all the drivers that beat him moved on but they still held him back much to his annoyance.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:48 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Yes you are right but Lynn and Gasly raced in a higher series before joining GP2 i have never heard of any driver going from FRenault 2.0 to GP2 before.


Well I don't have a name ready but I'm unsure what you're trying to prove.

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Hamilton was also going to be the strongest driver in F3 after all the drivers that beat him moved on but they still held him back much to his annoyance.


Well, Hamilton didn't have as good a first season in F3 like Vandoorne had in FR3.5. That's one difference to start with. Also, McLaren's thoughts about this aren't necessarily still the same as they were 10 years ago.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:23 am 
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mds wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Yes you are right but Lynn and Gasly raced in a higher series before joining GP2 i have never heard of any driver going from FRenault 2.0 to GP2 before.


Well I don't have a name ready but I'm unsure what you're trying to prove.

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Hamilton was also going to be the strongest driver in F3 after all the drivers that beat him moved on but they still held him back much to his annoyance.


Well, Hamilton didn't have as good a first season in F3 like Vandoorne had in FR3.5. That's one difference to start with. Also, McLaren's thoughts about this aren't necessarily still the same as they were 10 years ago.

True about Hamilton, as for the other i was just pointing out that drivers don't go from FRenault 2.0 to GP2 it's considered to be too big a jump

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:38 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
mds wrote:
dizlexik wrote:
Still I'm not sure quality of GP2 drivers is much higher than for example Renault 3.5 if at all. My point is that nowadays the most talented drivers are picked before they go to GP2.


For 2015 that's undoubtedly going to be the case. Sure there's talented people in FR3.5 with Rowland, de Vries and Stoneman, but by moving Lynn and Gasly to GP2 where Vandoorne and Marciello were, a big shift has occured. Taken together, the latter 4 drivers do trump the former 3 in my view.

That's the reigning GP3 champ, GP2 vice-champ (champ moved out), FR3.5 vice-champ (champ moved to F1) and a former F3 winner on one side, and FR3.5 third, FR2.0 champ and GP3 runner-up on the other side.


Its always been the case that the best drivers don't usually make it to GP2/F3000. There are very few champions of these series who went on to win multiple F1 races. I think Only 3 in nearly 40 years.

But there are 9 drivers who came from the series who won multiple races in F1 Alonso, Webber, Hamilton, Rosberg, Montoya, Barrichello, Coulthard, Herbert and Hill.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 1:43 am 
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pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
mds wrote:
dizlexik wrote:
Still I'm not sure quality of GP2 drivers is much higher than for example Renault 3.5 if at all. My point is that nowadays the most talented drivers are picked before they go to GP2.


For 2015 that's undoubtedly going to be the case. Sure there's talented people in FR3.5 with Rowland, de Vries and Stoneman, but by moving Lynn and Gasly to GP2 where Vandoorne and Marciello were, a big shift has occured. Taken together, the latter 4 drivers do trump the former 3 in my view.

That's the reigning GP3 champ, GP2 vice-champ (champ moved out), FR3.5 vice-champ (champ moved to F1) and a former F3 winner on one side, and FR3.5 third, FR2.0 champ and GP3 runner-up on the other side.


Its always been the case that the best drivers don't usually make it to GP2/F3000. There are very few champions of these series who went on to win multiple F1 races. I think Only 3 in nearly 40 years.

But there are 9 drivers who came from the series who won multiple races in F1 Alonso, Webber, Hamilton, Rosberg, Montoya, Barrichello, Coulthard, Herbert and Hill.


Sure, but with champions there is only 3. Montana, Hamilton and Rosberg.

Still 9 in about 30 years is a poor ratio. I will count up the multiple winners in that period and see what the total is.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 2:13 am 
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12 multiple winners who made there debut after 1986 but have never driven in F3000 or gp2. Turns out 9 was better than I thought!


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 2:23 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
mds wrote:
dizlexik wrote:
Still I'm not sure quality of GP2 drivers is much higher than for example Renault 3.5 if at all. My point is that nowadays the most talented drivers are picked before they go to GP2.


For 2015 that's undoubtedly going to be the case. Sure there's talented people in FR3.5 with Rowland, de Vries and Stoneman, but by moving Lynn and Gasly to GP2 where Vandoorne and Marciello were, a big shift has occured. Taken together, the latter 4 drivers do trump the former 3 in my view.

That's the reigning GP3 champ, GP2 vice-champ (champ moved out), FR3.5 vice-champ (champ moved to F1) and a former F3 winner on one side, and FR3.5 third, FR2.0 champ and GP3 runner-up on the other side.


Its always been the case that the best drivers don't usually make it to GP2/F3000. There are very few champions of these series who went on to win multiple F1 races. I think Only 3 in nearly 40 years.

But there are 9 drivers who came from the series who won multiple races in F1 Alonso, Webber, Hamilton, Rosberg, Montoya, Barrichello, Coulthard, Herbert and Hill.


Sure, but with champions there is only 3. Montana, Hamilton and Rosberg.

Still 9 in about 40 years is a poor ratio. I will count up the multiple winners in that period and see what the total is.

Well for a start its 30 years in total, 6 of the champions have won at least one race in F1. GP2 itself counts for 10 of those years with 6 of the champions going into F1, 3 of these won at least one race in F1, in total these past 10 years 26 drivers have graduated into F1.

Here are the champions of FR3.5

2005 Robert Kubica
2006 Alx Danielson
2007 Alvaro Parente
2008 Guido van der Garde
2009 Bertrand Baguette
2010 Mikhail Aleshin
2011 Robert Wickens
2012 Robin Frijns
2013 Kevin Magnussen
2014 Carlos Sainz

4 of these Champions made it into F1 although van der Garde did it via 3 seasons of GP2, only Kubica managed to win a race and only Kubica managed to last more than one season thus far in F1.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 2:38 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
12 multiple winners who made there debut after 1986 but have never driven in F3000 or gp2. Turns out 9 was better than I thought!

There is a hell of a lot of drivers that have graduated from F3000/GP2 to F1 as well

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 4:48 pm 
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Some very unhappy people from DTM and others:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/117916


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:11 pm 
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And they have a good point.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:27 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
And they have a good point.

I agree. I'm only surprised it's taken them this long to complain


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2015 8:22 am 
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Rules opened up a little bit -

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/119938

Still far to political.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2015 11:09 am 
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Still I find it wrong that GP2 driver will find it easier to get into F1 than LMP1 driver.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:26 pm 
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dizlexik wrote:
Still I find it wrong that GP2 driver will find it easier to get into F1 than LMP1 driver.


I find it wrong that being European F3 champion gets a super licence but FR3.5 Champ does not. It also means that a driver like Ocan has taken a step down moving to GP3 which is ridiculous.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:56 am 
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15 points for Indy Lights? Might as well give a test ride. Accumulate 300k unless the Indy Light champ gets to ride GP2 or GP3.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 5:36 pm 
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It's all politics and money. Which means it is all Bull Feces!

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:01 am 
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mmi16 wrote:
It's all politics and money. Which means it is all Bull Feces!


Exactly. Can't quite believe they left DTM off first time around, and it still has the same worth as 'indy lights'. Then I remember who is responsible for making these rules, and it all becomes clear.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:26 am 
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Underviewer wrote:
mmi16 wrote:
It's all politics and money. Which means it is all Bull Feces!


Exactly. Can't quite believe they left DTM off first time around, and it still has the same worth as 'indy lights'. Then I remember who is responsible for making these rules, and it all becomes clear.


The F1 strategy group?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:53 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Underviewer wrote:
mmi16 wrote:
It's all politics and money. Which means it is all Bull Feces!


Exactly. Can't quite believe they left DTM off first time around, and it still has the same worth as 'indy lights'. Then I remember who is responsible for making these rules, and it all becomes clear.


The F1 strategy group?


Yes, and the 'world Motorsport council' and both of which have Bernie Eccelstone and Jean Todt in them. Plus, the biggest teams. All of which have their own agendas and reasons for making certain series worth more than others.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:58 am 
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Underviewer wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Underviewer wrote:
mmi16 wrote:
It's all politics and money. Which means it is all Bull Feces!


Exactly. Can't quite believe they left DTM off first time around, and it still has the same worth as 'indy lights'. Then I remember who is responsible for making these rules, and it all becomes clear.


The F1 strategy group?


Yes, and the 'world Motorsport council' and both of which have Bernie Eccelstone and Jean Todt in them. Plus, the biggest teams. All of which have their own agendas and reasons for making certain series worth more than others.


The corrupt member of this little party is the FIA. Promoting their own (currently non existent!) tiered series to the detriment of others. Red Bull obviously wish to push forward the Renault junior series and Bernie GP2/3.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:06 pm 
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I just realized about Appendix L. Was from January 24, 2013.

Page 4 - Article 5.1.2d.

http://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/ ... 202013.pdf

As far a Indycar drivers go, the 1st 4 drivers who finished in the point standings within the 2 years are eligible.

And within the past 2 years, Helio and Simon do qualify for a superlicense. JPM finished 4th in '14. 2nd this year. Dixon became champ in '13 and finished 3rd in '14. Helio finished 2nd in the standings in '13 and '14. Pagenaud finished 3rd in '13. Power became Champion in '14 and was 4th in '13. Rahal finished 4th this year.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:23 pm 
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Placid wrote:
I just realized about Appendix L. Was from January 24, 2013.

Page 4 - Article 5.1.2d.

http://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/ ... 202013.pdf

As far a Indycar drivers go, the 1st 4 drivers who finished in the point standings within the 2 years are eligible.

And within the past 2 years, Helio and Simon do qualify for a superlicense. JPM finished 4th in '14. 2nd this year. Dixon became champ in '13 and finished 3rd in '14. Helio finished 2nd in the standings in '13 and '14. Pagenaud finished 3rd in '13. Power became Champion in '14 and was 4th in '13. Rahal finished 4th this year.


Not sure what you mean here... If you think that all these drivers automatically qualify for a super licence to drive in 2016, then that's not correct. The drivers that want to obtain a super licence to race in 2016 will have to meet the new requirements.

The 2015 document (updated this August) is to be found here: http://www.fia.com/appendix-l-internati ... nd-conduct

Scroll down to the part "MODIFICATIONS FOR 2016" and you'll find the new section 5. Indy Car gets the same weight as F3, which means only the winner is directly eligible without having to accumulate points from previous years.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:30 pm 
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The changes contain something I hadn't realized before. The 300km test is now one of the requirements that all have to be fulfilled, instead of being a backdoor for allowing just about anyone that hasn't met other performance criteria.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 2:16 am 
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mds wrote:
Placid wrote:
And within the past 2 years, Helio and Simon do qualify for a superlicense. JPM finished 4th in '14. 2nd this year. Dixon became champ in '13 and finished 3rd in '14. Helio finished 2nd in the standings in '13 and '14. Pagenaud finished 3rd in '13. Power became Champion in '14 and was 4th in '13. Rahal finished 4th this year.

Not sure what you mean here... If you think that all these drivers automatically qualify for a super licence to drive in 2016, then that's not correct. The drivers that want to obtain a super licence to race in 2016 will have to meet the new requirements.

They don't qualify automatically anymore, but all except for two of the drivers he named do indeed still qualify on points:

Scott Dixon: 100 pts (1st, 3rd, 1st)
Will Power: 70 pts (3rd, 1st, 4th)
Helio Castroneves: 68 pts (5th, 2nd, 2nd)
Juan Pablo Montoya: 40 pts (2nd, 4th, N/A)

The exceptions are Simon Pagenaud (28 pts) and Graham Rahal (10 pts), who are not eligible.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:21 am 
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Exediron wrote:
mds wrote:
Placid wrote:
And within the past 2 years, Helio and Simon do qualify for a superlicense. JPM finished 4th in '14. 2nd this year. Dixon became champ in '13 and finished 3rd in '14. Helio finished 2nd in the standings in '13 and '14. Pagenaud finished 3rd in '13. Power became Champion in '14 and was 4th in '13. Rahal finished 4th this year.

Not sure what you mean here... If you think that all these drivers automatically qualify for a super licence to drive in 2016, then that's not correct. The drivers that want to obtain a super licence to race in 2016 will have to meet the new requirements.

They don't qualify automatically anymore, but all except for two of the drivers he named do indeed still qualify on points:

Scott Dixon: 100 pts (1st, 3rd, 1st)
Will Power: 70 pts (3rd, 1st, 4th)
Helio Castroneves: 68 pts (5th, 2nd, 2nd)
Juan Pablo Montoya: 40 pts (2nd, 4th, N/A)

The exceptions are Simon Pagenaud (28 pts) and Graham Rahal (10 pts), who are not eligible.


True, I was just responding to this part Placid stated: "As far a Indycar drivers go, the 1st 4 drivers who finished in the point standings within the 2 years are eligible."
That is not correct for drivers that need to get their super licence for 2016.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 7:07 am 
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Revisiting this thread as I've just seen that the FIA have readded a section in the rules for granting a super licence, which basically render the obligation to gather 40 points moot. Read and weep:

Quote:
5.1.6 Except if the applicant qualifies under Article 5.1.7 a) or b), the
F1 Team concerned must show that the applicant has driven at
least 300 km in a representative Formula One car(1) consistently
at racing speeds, over a maximum period of 2 days, completed
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


It's a shame they put this back in the regulations. While it was left out, there was no way of getting into F1 without amassing the 40 points (unless some very specific and well-defined criteria e.g. top Indy Car drivers). Putting it back means wealthy pay drivers unable to collect the points will be able to pay their way back in.

A proper shame, if the system wasn't put together that well initially what with the skewed way of attributing points to series, then this addition properly invalidates it altogether.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 7:49 am 
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mds wrote:
Revisiting this thread as I've just seen that the FIA have readded a section in the rules for granting a super licence, which basically render the obligation to gather 40 points moot. Read and weep:

Quote:
5.1.6 Except if the applicant qualifies under Article 5.1.7 a) or b), the
F1 Team concerned must show that the applicant has driven at
least 300 km in a representative Formula One car(1) consistently
at racing speeds, over a maximum period of 2 days, completed
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


It's a shame they put this back in the regulations. While it was left out, there was no way of getting into F1 without amassing the 40 points (unless some very specific and well-defined criteria e.g. top Indy Car drivers). Putting it back means wealthy pay drivers unable to collect the points will be able to pay their way back in.

A proper shame, if the system wasn't put together that well initially what with the skewed way of attributing points to series, then this addition properly invalidates it altogether.


Basically yet more evidence of Todt's absolute incompetence. He really has been absolutely horrific as head of the FIA. About 100 times worse than Mosley.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:51 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
mds wrote:
Revisiting this thread as I've just seen that the FIA have readded a section in the rules for granting a super licence, which basically render the obligation to gather 40 points moot. Read and weep:

Quote:
5.1.6 Except if the applicant qualifies under Article 5.1.7 a) or b), the
F1 Team concerned must show that the applicant has driven at
least 300 km in a representative Formula One car(1) consistently
at racing speeds, over a maximum period of 2 days, completed
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


It's a shame they put this back in the regulations. While it was left out, there was no way of getting into F1 without amassing the 40 points (unless some very specific and well-defined criteria e.g. top Indy Car drivers). Putting it back means wealthy pay drivers unable to collect the points will be able to pay their way back in.

A proper shame, if the system wasn't put together that well initially what with the skewed way of attributing points to series, then this addition properly invalidates it altogether.


Basically yet more evidence of Todt's absolute incompetence. He really has been absolutely horrific as head of the FIA. About 100 times worse than Mosley.

I'll second that. He's been an absolute disaster


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 9:19 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
I'll second that. He's been an absolute disaster

Thirded. Mosley was extremely corrupt and egomaniacal, but at least he was more than just a limp paper towel of a decision maker. I never imagined someone could go from running the greatest powerhouse team F1 has ever seen to this. Really a bit depressing.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 9:27 pm 
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" or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers." Without a superlicence?????


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 9:37 pm 
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Whether is 1st or 2nd, Pagenaud will meet his requirements. Newgarden and Rahal will have more points. But still far from the requirements.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 2:26 am 
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mds wrote:
Revisiting this thread as I've just seen that the FIA have readded a section in the rules for granting a super licence, which basically render the obligation to gather 40 points moot. Read and weep:

Quote:
5.1.6 Except if the applicant qualifies under Article 5.1.7 a) or b), the
F1 Team concerned must show that the applicant has driven at
least 300 km in a representative Formula One car(1) consistently
at racing speeds, over a maximum period of 2 days, completed
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


It's a shame they put this back in the regulations. While it was left out, there was no way of getting into F1 without amassing the 40 points (unless some very specific and well-defined criteria e.g. top Indy Car drivers). Putting it back means wealthy pay drivers unable to collect the points will be able to pay their way back in.

A proper shame, if the system wasn't put together that well initially what with the skewed way of attributing points to series, then this addition properly invalidates it altogether.


MDS, that is a revelation!
It undermines the whole system. And teams that want a driver can just put him an old car and they could get that requirement in a day or at least a weekend.

So a system put in place to ensure you have the best of the best drivers can be side stepped over a weekend with the right connections and a bit of cash.
So much for the end of the pay drivers.
What a joke...

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 5:00 pm 
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Randine wrote:
mds wrote:
Revisiting this thread as I've just seen that the FIA have readded a section in the rules for granting a super licence, which basically render the obligation to gather 40 points moot. Read and weep:

Quote:
5.1.6 Except if the applicant qualifies under Article 5.1.7 a) or b), the
F1 Team concerned must show that the applicant has driven at
least 300 km in a representative Formula One car(1) consistently
at racing speeds, over a maximum period of 2 days, completed
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


It's a shame they put this back in the regulations. While it was left out, there was no way of getting into F1 without amassing the 40 points (unless some very specific and well-defined criteria e.g. top Indy Car drivers). Putting it back means wealthy pay drivers unable to collect the points will be able to pay their way back in.

A proper shame, if the system wasn't put together that well initially what with the skewed way of attributing points to series, then this addition properly invalidates it altogether.


MDS, that is a revelation!
It undermines the whole system. And teams that want a driver can just put him an old car and they could get that requirement in a day or at least a weekend.

So a system put in place to ensure you have the best of the best drivers can be side stepped over a weekend with the right connections and a bit of cash.
So much for the end of the pay drivers.
What a joke...




But it says -test took place or during an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship for Drivers.

If it counts, it has to be an event, and I thought drivers could not compete in these events without the superlicence ?

What am I missing?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 5:43 pm 
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moby wrote:
Randine wrote:
mds wrote:
Revisiting this thread as I've just seen that the FIA have readded a section in the rules for granting a super licence, which basically render the obligation to gather 40 points moot. Read and weep:

Quote:
5.1.6 Except if the applicant qualifies under Article 5.1.7 a) or b), the
F1 Team concerned must show that the applicant has driven at
least 300 km in a representative Formula One car(1) consistently
at racing speeds, over a maximum period of 2 days, completed
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


It's a shame they put this back in the regulations. While it was left out, there was no way of getting into F1 without amassing the 40 points (unless some very specific and well-defined criteria e.g. top Indy Car drivers). Putting it back means wealthy pay drivers unable to collect the points will be able to pay their way back in.

A proper shame, if the system wasn't put together that well initially what with the skewed way of attributing points to series, then this addition properly invalidates it altogether.


MDS, that is a revelation!
It undermines the whole system. And teams that want a driver can just put him an old car and they could get that requirement in a day or at least a weekend.

So a system put in place to ensure you have the best of the best drivers can be side stepped over a weekend with the right connections and a bit of cash.
So much for the end of the pay drivers.
What a joke...




But it says -test took place or during an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship for Drivers.

If it counts, it has to be an event, and I thought drivers could not compete in these events without the superlicence ?

What am I missing?



The bit that comes just before:

Quote:
not more than 180 days prior to the application, either certified
by the ASN of the country in which the test took place
or during
an event counting for the FIA Formula One World Championship
for Drivers.


I assume ASN certification is just a box ticking exercise and straight forward to obtain.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 5:53 pm 
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The Friday licence is not a full superlicence iirc?



Also, I'm glad that clause has found its way back in. I still think the 40 points thing is a stupid idea (though I now appear to be a minority).


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 6:32 am 
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Lentulus wrote:
Also, I'm glad that clause has found its way back in. I still think the 40 points thing is a stupid idea (though I now appear to be a minority).


I still think the 40 points thing, as well as the age limit, was a solution to a problem that didn't exist. And it was horribly skewed initially, which basically killed off FR3.5. This was later corrected a bit but too little too late. I had less issues with the points system since it became a bit more balanced (just a bit), and FR3.5 is dead anyway...

But to now include that clause again is just daft, plain daft. It means that the whole idea of putting the 40 points system in place was for nothing. It also means that FR3.5 has been killed off for nothing. And lastly it also means that the pure pay drivers without much talent have a good way to get into F1 again.

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