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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:14 pm 
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nixxxon wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
kleefton wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I'll say it again, place a merc engine instead of the crap honda one and mclaren would be up there with Ferrari/Merc (at least the one driven by Alonso)


I think most of us want to see that. Unfortunately some people think you can only win with a works engine.

Red Bull - Renault prove that you can be very competitive being the non-official works team
With mercedes however, thats another story...


And Red Bull have the budget.

How good would the Mclaren chassis be if it was designed on a smaller budget?

Oh well
If a team is competitive, keeps on delivering good results, and in general has good management, they can keep on having a pretty good budget like Red Bull. Surely they have been backed by the energy drinks money but still, they dont really lose money in F1


Only once the Red Bull sponsorship has been accounted for.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:17 pm 
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IMO Hamilton has always been cautious into turn one since Japan 2008 when he out braked himself massively. That changed slightly during 2014-16 because it was literally where the race was decided so both of them were a little more risky.

Lewis was out braked by Vettel (although he had a better line) in Bahrain and he was cautious in Russia too. The Mercedes, does however seem very good off the line, Hamilton had a great start in Russia too but lost out due to the contact with Kimi. The troubles of last year seem to have been fixed.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:22 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
lamo wrote:
MasterRacer wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Soooo close! Awesome from Hamilton and Vettel. That's why the championship will come down to those two.

I still don't get why so many people still make it sound like the championship is just between these 2. Hamilton had a really poor weekend 2 weeks ago in Russia. Bottas wasn't helped here at all by the fact he missed most of P3 and had an old engine. While Hamilton had a brand new one which could well have helped.I still think Bottas will be part of the championship fight. I hope he will have a start again like he did in Russia.


It's very clear to me on performance Valtteri would be on pole if it wasn't for his engine woes. I definitely agree he'll run Hamilton very close for the title, and can easily beat him.


How much is the new spec engine worth exactly, I would love to know?

Not that much, but the gap between Hamilton and Bottas will surely have been smaller if Bottas didn't miss most of P3 as well as having a 4 race ond engine. Compared to Hamilton who had a new one. I do certainly think Hamilton is better than Bottas, just not by as much as most seem to think.


Bottas did 7 laps in FP3, Hamilton did 12. He didn't miss much. But you are right, a 4 race old engine vs new one is definitely worth at least a tenth. Not sure why Lewis was so slow in S3 on his final run, but his best sector times must put him 0.4-0.5 ahead of Bottas' best, maybe that is tyre related. i.e. the car couldn't do all those times in one lap, its about when you take the life out of the tyre.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:24 pm 
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lamo wrote:
IMO Hamilton has always been cautious into turn one since Japan 2008 when he out braked himself massively. That changed slightly during 2014-16 because it was literally where the race was decided so both of them were a little more risky.

Lewis was out braked by Vettel (although he had a better line) in Bahrain and he was cautious in Russia too. The Mercedes, does however seem very good off the line, Hamilton had a great start in Russia too but lost out due to the contact with Kimi. The troubles of last year seem to have been fixed.


Tomorrow he should not let Vettel pass.. It is simple.
Sebastian will be aggressive as usual so he better be prepared to touch if necessary.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:30 pm 
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Pullrod wrote:
lamo wrote:
IMO Hamilton has always been cautious into turn one since Japan 2008 when he out braked himself massively. That changed slightly during 2014-16 because it was literally where the race was decided so both of them were a little more risky.

Lewis was out braked by Vettel (although he had a better line) in Bahrain and he was cautious in Russia too. The Mercedes, does however seem very good off the line, Hamilton had a great start in Russia too but lost out due to the contact with Kimi. The troubles of last year seem to have been fixed.


Tomorrow he should not let Vettel pass.. It is simple.
Sebastian will be aggressive as usual so he better be prepared to touch if necessary.


Its a long race, 2 stops, 2 chances to undercut. Track position really isn't that important this year, its the opposite of the Mercedes battle of 2014-16 where it was decided at turn 1.

The leader at the start lost the race 2/4 so far this year and it could have easily been 3/4 if not for the timing on the SC in China.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:35 pm 
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Can somebody link in sector times if they have them? Ideally session best sector times and fastest run times.

Also, I read somewhere above that the Mercedes engine upgrade is reliability only. I find that a little hard to believe. Has that been confirmed and if so by who?

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:39 pm 
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Some of the posts in here are amazing lol. The way people think never ceases to amaze me. Of course living in the US and watching our political drama play out has numbed me to this a bit...


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 2:43 pm 
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lamo wrote:
Can somebody link in sector times if they have them? Ideally session best sector times and fastest run times.

Also, I read somewhere above that the Mercedes engine upgrade is reliability only. I find that a little hard to believe. Has that been confirmed and if so by who?



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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:06 pm 
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Thanks, that is a great chart.

So Hamilton -0.3 on Bottas, he seemed to be around 0.1 all weekend. The 4 races old engine vs new spec, new engine worth 0.2, 0.3, 0.4?

Does anybody know what engine Bottas actually has in, did he actually take a new engine of the old spec or is he on the original engine?

Interesting that it is the complete opposite to Russia with the Mercedes strong in the end of lap twisty sector. Very odd. They say S3 in Spain is a good indicator for performance in Monaco, so maybe Mercedes won't be in trouble as much as many think there.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:16 pm 
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Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:23 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:28 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


1 possible factor could be due to the slippery conditions of the track. A lot of drivers were having moments but Max is at home in such conditions.

Just a personal guess. Verstappen has been all over Ric this weekend. The same was with the Force India duo. Ocon was all over Perez till qualifying where the tables turned around. Vettel even got over Kimi in qualifying.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:29 pm 
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lamo wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:31 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
lamo wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


Are we seeing a pattern here where the initial top driver gets outdone by the newer / younger driver in the team?

Vettel < Ricciardo
Ricciardo < Verstappen

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:34 pm 
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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:34 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
lamo wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


Are we seeing a pattern here where the initial top driver gets outdone by the newer / younger driver in the team?

Vettel < Ricciardo
Ricciardo < Verstappen

Don't forget Webber < Vettel. It seems you really don't want to be the "old guy" at RBR lol.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 3:45 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
lamo wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


Are we seeing a pattern here where the initial top driver gets outdone by the newer / younger driver in the team?

Vettel < Ricciardo
Ricciardo < Verstappen

Don't forget Webber < Vettel. It seems you really don't want to be the "old guy" at RBR lol.


Not forgetting Coulthard < Webber


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 4:01 pm 
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lamo wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
lamo wrote:
MasterRacer wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I still don't get why so many people still make it sound like the championship is just between these 2. Hamilton had a really poor weekend 2 weeks ago in Russia. Bottas wasn't helped here at all by the fact he missed most of P3 and had an old engine. While Hamilton had a brand new one which could well have helped.I still think Bottas will be part of the championship fight. I hope he will have a start again like he did in Russia.


It's very clear to me on performance Valtteri would be on pole if it wasn't for his engine woes. I definitely agree he'll run Hamilton very close for the title, and can easily beat him.


How much is the new spec engine worth exactly, I would love to know?

Not that much, but the gap between Hamilton and Bottas will surely have been smaller if Bottas didn't miss most of P3 as well as having a 4 race ond engine. Compared to Hamilton who had a new one. I do certainly think Hamilton is better than Bottas, just not by as much as most seem to think.


Bottas did 7 laps in FP3, Hamilton did 12. He didn't miss much. But you are right, a 4 race old engine vs new one is definitely worth at least a tenth. Not sure why Lewis was so slow in S3 on his final run, but his best sector times must put him 0.4-0.5 ahead of Bottas' best, maybe that is tyre related. i.e. the car couldn't do all those times in one lap, its about when you take the life out of the tyre.


Oh, right. Sorry, I didn't realise how little Hamilton did. But at leased what he did will have been planned. I do think that Bottas still did a fine job again today though. Lets see what happens tomorrow.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 4:03 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
lamo wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


Are we seeing a pattern here where the initial top driver gets outdone by the newer / younger driver in the team?

Vettel < Ricciardo
Ricciardo < Verstappen


I think that a couple of times this year, Verstappen looked to be the faster of the 2 through out most of practice and Q1 and Q2 also. Then often Ricciardo gets the better of Verstappen when it matters. Maybe he just made a mistake today? It's not like other drivers never had qualifying sessions that seem well behind their team mates that are usually the otehr way around. Like Hamilton getting beaten by Bottas by nearly half a second last race. We didn't expect that.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 4:29 pm 
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Agree above re Hamilton he isn't really the last to break any more is he and that needs sorting out. Lap 1 turn 1 , not sure about mid race but he seems real cautious into turn 1


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 4:40 pm 
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Andy2402 wrote:
Agree above re Hamilton he isn't really the last to break any more is he and that needs sorting out. Lap 1 turn 1 , not sure about mid race but he seems real cautious into turn 1


This was being discussed over at autosport. Hamilton has only ever DNF'd at turn 1 once in his entire career. 2012 Belgium with the Grosjean collision and that was really just terrible driving from Grosjean that resulted in a race ban. Vettel for example DNF'd twice last season with the first corner collisions and had contact 4 or 5 times in turn one. It is all about risk and reward.

During the 2014-2016 Mercedes battle it was worth a big risk because the race was won at turn 1 hence we saw them kiss a few times but even then I don't think they ever damaged one anothers cars at the start during that entire period.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 4:48 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
lamo wrote:

To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


Are we seeing a pattern here where the initial top driver gets outdone by the newer / younger driver in the team?

Vettel < Ricciardo
Ricciardo < Verstappen

Don't forget Webber < Vettel. It seems you really don't want to be the "old guy" at RBR lol.


Not forgetting Coulthard < Webber


Unless you're Russian and your last name is Kvyat, it seems...

I think there's some truth to the logic of which one is better. In the end, I have little doubt Max is miles better than Coulthard...


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 4:55 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
lamo wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Boy there was really a massive gap between Max and Dan today. Does anyone know why? Usually Dan has been the better qualifier of the two so to see him get pasted like that is a genuine surprise.


To me its been coming, Ricciardo initially blitzed Max in qualifying but the end of last year Max began to beat him. I think the last 8 races were pretty equal in qualifying, 4-4 I think. We haven't really seen them go head to head this year over 1 lap, the last race Verstappen had an issue in Q3 and the others they had one each. I think Max will beat him over 1 lap this year. I only see Max getting stronger and stronger from here.

We'll see. It would be very impressive if Max gains the upper hand over Dan this year in such a comprehensive fashion. Regardless of that though, the gap was more than half a second. That's far too big to be purely about pace.


Sector times suggest Daniel had some problem in sector 3, a small mistake or lack of traction. Maybe onboards will show what happened.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 5:10 pm 
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Andy2402 wrote:
Agree above re Hamilton he isn't really the last to break any more is he and that needs sorting out. Lap 1 turn 1 , not sure about mid race but he seems real cautious into turn 1


To be honest, I think he has worked out that you can't win the race at T1L1, but you can certainly chuck it away there. Trying to be the last of the late brakers every time into T1 is going to bite you eventually.

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 5:19 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
-ZeroGravityToilet- wrote:
kleefton wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I'll say it again, place a merc engine instead of the crap honda one and mclaren would be up there with Ferrari/Merc (at least the one driven by Alonso)


I think most of us want to see that. Unfortunately some people think you can only win with a works engine.


If the lump you want to place in you car is German, forget about it. They'll make sure yours is tuned down in case of danger to their works team.

If it is a French engine you want, you stand a chance (assuming they can come back to their average engine form of the last decades)


How can they make sure that it is tuned down? This is the part I don't understand, first of all Mclaren manufactures the ECU. If you want to talk about tuning software, Mclaren should be able to do that themselves. If they don't then it's their fault.

I mean, if I am a Mercedes customer team and I was feeling like I'm not getting the same engine as the works car, I would go complain to he FIA and make sure that they abide by the RULES. The rule is that the engines supplied to customer teams have to be equal.

Also, from what I've heard all Mercedes engines have to use the same Petronas fuel and lubricants from this year on. There is a rumor that the Mercedes customers do not get the same engine modes as the works car but it cannot be confirmed.

Paddy Lowe said that Williams have access to the same engine modes as Mercedes.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 5:37 pm 
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Flash2k11 wrote:
Andy2402 wrote:
Agree above re Hamilton he isn't really the last to break any more is he and that needs sorting out. Lap 1 turn 1 , not sure about mid race but he seems real cautious into turn 1


To be honest, I think he has worked out that you can't win the race at T1L1, but you can certainly chuck it away there. Trying to be the last of the late brakers every time into T1 is going to bite you eventually.

See Alonso 2012

:(

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 5:41 pm 
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GingerFurball wrote:
kleefton wrote:
-ZeroGravityToilet- wrote:
kleefton wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I'll say it again, place a merc engine instead of the crap honda one and mclaren would be up there with Ferrari/Merc (at least the one driven by Alonso)


I think most of us want to see that. Unfortunately some people think you can only win with a works engine.


If the lump you want to place in you car is German, forget about it. They'll make sure yours is tuned down in case of danger to their works team.

If it is a French engine you want, you stand a chance (assuming they can come back to their average engine form of the last decades)


How can they make sure that it is tuned down? This is the part I don't understand, first of all Mclaren manufactures the ECU. If you want to talk about tuning software, Mclaren should be able to do that themselves. If they don't then it's their fault.

I mean, if I am a Mercedes customer team and I was feeling like I'm not getting the same engine as the works car, I would go complain to he FIA and make sure that they abide by the RULES. The rule is that the engines supplied to customer teams have to be equal.

Also, from what I've heard all Mercedes engines have to use the same Petronas fuel and lubricants from this year on. There is a rumor that the Mercedes customers do not get the same engine modes as the works car but it cannot be confirmed.

Paddy Lowe said that Williams have access to the same engine modes as Mercedes.

Croft and Brundle discussed a good point after that chat though - they have same engine mode, which increases the power by the same ratio... but do Merc and Williams have the same maximum power?

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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 5:50 pm 
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Alonso. What a f*cking legend.

Can he just kiss and make up with Ferrari please.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 5:55 pm 
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lamo wrote:
F1Tyrant wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Vettel will be hounding Lewis all race, will they try to undercut or overcut?

I reckon we'll have more of a race if Vettel jumps Hamilton at the start. Mercedes have the edge in S3 so I expect them to pull away during the race if Lewis is leading. If not, I can see Lewis hounding Seb but not getting enough pace to pull and overtake.


Undercut yes, but there won't be any overtaking tomorrow. Its one of the worst tracks for it. We had cars 1.5 seconds per lap quicker last year unable to pass.


KR is the absolute worst overtaker, must keep that in mind.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 6:04 pm 
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GingerFurball wrote:
Alonso. What a f*cking legend.

Can he just kiss and make up with Ferrari please.


It will not happen because he will get all the credit for any positive result he will achieve there..
In McLaren it can work because Ron's big ego is not there anymore.

His best bet would be to hope for McLaren to ditch Honda for Mercedes.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 6:13 pm 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
lamo wrote:
F1Tyrant wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Vettel will be hounding Lewis all race, will they try to undercut or overcut?

I reckon we'll have more of a race if Vettel jumps Hamilton at the start. Mercedes have the edge in S3 so I expect them to pull away during the race if Lewis is leading. If not, I can see Lewis hounding Seb but not getting enough pace to pull and overtake.


Undercut yes, but there won't be any overtaking tomorrow. Its one of the worst tracks for it. We had cars 1.5 seconds per lap quicker last year unable to pass.


KR is the absolute worst overtaker, must keep that in mind.

I don't think that's even remotely true. It's unclear why you've mentioned him specifically?


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 6:15 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
lamo wrote:
F1Tyrant wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Vettel will be hounding Lewis all race, will they try to undercut or overcut?

I reckon we'll have more of a race if Vettel jumps Hamilton at the start. Mercedes have the edge in S3 so I expect them to pull away during the race if Lewis is leading. If not, I can see Lewis hounding Seb but not getting enough pace to pull and overtake.


Undercut yes, but there won't be any overtaking tomorrow. Its one of the worst tracks for it. We had cars 1.5 seconds per lap quicker last year unable to pass.


KR is the absolute worst overtaker, must keep that in mind.

I don't think that's even remotely true. It's unclear why you've mentioned him specifically?


Because it was Raikkonen unable to overtake Verstappen in 2016 at the front. Why else do you think I'd mention him?


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 6:26 pm 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
Zoue wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
lamo wrote:
F1Tyrant wrote:
I reckon we'll have more of a race if Vettel jumps Hamilton at the start. Mercedes have the edge in S3 so I expect them to pull away during the race if Lewis is leading. If not, I can see Lewis hounding Seb but not getting enough pace to pull and overtake.


Undercut yes, but there won't be any overtaking tomorrow. Its one of the worst tracks for it. We had cars 1.5 seconds per lap quicker last year unable to pass.


KR is the absolute worst overtaker, must keep that in mind.

I don't think that's even remotely true. It's unclear why you've mentioned him specifically?


Because it was Raikkonen unable to overtake Verstappen in 2016 at the front. Why else do you think I'd mention him?

Well Ricciardo couldn't overtake Vettel either, so why single Kimi out? It's just a hard track to overtake on, surely?


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 7:24 pm 
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Pullrod wrote:
GingerFurball wrote:
Alonso. What a f*cking legend.

Can he just kiss and make up with Ferrari please.


It will not happen because he will get all the credit for any positive result he will achieve there..
In McLaren it can work because Ron's big ego is not there anymore.

His best bet would be to hope for McLaren to ditch Honda for Mercedes.

That's his best chance to finish 5th. Still won't win anything with McLaren-Mercedes


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 8:00 pm 
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Desert Storm wrote:
Kimi being extremely consistent in not improving on his final run in Q3 where as everybody else does :uhoh:

What? I remember at least Vettel and Hamilton also not improving... :?

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Thank you Nico - You´re the champ!

PF1 Pick 10 Competition 2016: CHAMPION (2 wins, 8 podiums)


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 8:21 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
lamo wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
lamo wrote:
MasterRacer wrote:

It's very clear to me on performance Valtteri would be on pole if it wasn't for his engine woes. I definitely agree he'll run Hamilton very close for the title, and can easily beat him.


How much is the new spec engine worth exactly, I would love to know?

Not that much, but the gap between Hamilton and Bottas will surely have been smaller if Bottas didn't miss most of P3 as well as having a 4 race ond engine. Compared to Hamilton who had a new one. I do certainly think Hamilton is better than Bottas, just not by as much as most seem to think.


Bottas did 7 laps in FP3, Hamilton did 12. He didn't miss much. But you are right, a 4 race old engine vs new one is definitely worth at least a tenth. Not sure why Lewis was so slow in S3 on his final run, but his best sector times must put him 0.4-0.5 ahead of Bottas' best, maybe that is tyre related. i.e. the car couldn't do all those times in one lap, its about when you take the life out of the tyre.


Oh, right. Sorry, I didn't realise how little Hamilton did. But at leased what he did will have been planned. I do think that Bottas still did a fine job again today though. Lets see what happens tomorrow.

Yes, I think even pole would have been his without running wide in the final corner.

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Thank you Nico - You´re the champ!

PF1 Pick 10 Competition 2016: CHAMPION (2 wins, 8 podiums)


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 9:13 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
Because it was Raikkonen unable to overtake Verstappen in 2016 at the front. Why else do you think I'd mention him?

Well Ricciardo couldn't overtake Vettel either, so why single Kimi out? It's just a hard track to overtake on, surely?


Every track is a hard track to overtake on when it comes to Mr. Matias.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 9:14 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
Desert Storm wrote:
Kimi being extremely consistent in not improving on his final run in Q3 where as everybody else does :uhoh:

What? I remember at least Vettel and Hamilton also not improving... :?


Vettel definitely improved and I'm pretty surecHamiltin did.


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 9:19 pm 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
Zoue wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
Because it was Raikkonen unable to overtake Verstappen in 2016 at the front. Why else do you think I'd mention him?

Well Ricciardo couldn't overtake Vettel either, so why single Kimi out? It's just a hard track to overtake on, surely?


Every track is a hard track to overtake on when it comes to Mr. Matias.

seems you have a bit of a bee in your bonnet. As already pointed out, he wasn't the only one. He wasn't even the only high profile one. So the comment's pretty pointless really


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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 9:23 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Desert Storm wrote:
Kimi being extremely consistent in not improving on his final run in Q3 where as everybody else does :uhoh:

What? I remember at least Vettel and Hamilton also not improving... :?


Vettel definitely improved and I'm pretty surecHamiltin did.

Vettel did, Hamilton didn't.


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