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 Post subject: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 10:00 pm 
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I Think its quite obvious that Palmer
Is costing Renault in the mid-field fight.

If you guys were in charge what would you do?
Give him the rest of the season?
A few more races?

Personally I'd be ringing JEV and giving Palmer 3-5 more races maximum.

Am I being to cynical?


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 11:04 pm 
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Palmer was already unimpressive last year, but that was his debut, and he was at least moderately close to Magnussen some of the time. This season, he's been more than simply unimpressive. This wasn't the first race he's been roughly ten places behind his teammate, although perhaps it was the first one he was actually lapped by Hulk (can't recall that off the top of my head). I'm sure there are a number of other drivers out there who would be delivering points finishes; I think that Renault and Williams are in roughly the same boat in the regard, only at least Williams' second driver still have the excuse of being a rookie.

Were it me, I would be looking to get rid of him as soon as a suitable replacement could be found. Unless he picks up the pace in the next race or two, giving him until the end of the season could even be too much.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 11:04 pm 
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He is up against a consistent known quantity in Hulkenburg and is being shown up badly. We know Hulkenburg is very good, but not elite.

He simply is a level below being good enough for F1 and is perhaps the worst performing on the grid.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 11:28 pm 
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Palmer has to go. No question.

Hulk can score every race with that car, and it's only going to get better. Palmer can't even get it into the top 15 without DNFs ahead of him. If Renault wants to be taken seriously as a top team, and give themselves a real chance to fight for 4th position this year, they need a another driver who can score points. Not just for 2018 - for the rest of this year.

In the battle for the midfield, you just can't afford to have one useless driver.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 11:41 pm 
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Wouldn't be in F1 if it wasn't for his background and certainty didn't deserve a contract renewal. The sooner he is out, the better.
Given its Renault, they wouldn't have any issues attracting a decent replacement.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 12:57 am 
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Alonso back to Renault!

Joking aside, Palmer has been awful. I was surprised they kept him on for a second season in all truth.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 1:55 am 
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Agree on all points above.
The question though remains; how much longer do they give him? And who?

Palmer's problems are compounded by the fact that the less he performs and fails to pick up points in a tight mid field battle, the more likely Renault will throw all the new upgrades on Hulks car to maximize his results... which in turn makes Palmer look even worse.

Like I said I'd be ringing a few FE drivers.. giving Palmer 3-5 races.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 2:02 am 
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Glasnost wrote:
Agree on all points above.
The question though remains; how much longer do they give him? And who?

Palmer's problems are compounded by the fact that the less he performs and fails to pick up points in a tight mid field battle, the more likely Renault will throw all the new upgrades on Hulks car to maximize his results... which in turn makes Palmer look even worse.

Like I said I'd be ringing a few FE drivers.. giving Palmer 3-5 races.

I'd give him no more races - I'd already be looking for his replacement. As soon as I could find a better driver who's available, he'd be out, even if I needed to pay off his contract. Renault is a factory team - they can take the hit.

Personally, JEV would be my choice, but there are a lot of other good drivers out there with F1 experience who could probably jump right into the car and do a better job than Jolyon.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 2:11 am 
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Exediron wrote:
Glasnost wrote:
Agree on all points above.
The question though remains; how much longer do they give him? And who?

Palmer's problems are compounded by the fact that the less he performs and fails to pick up points in a tight mid field battle, the more likely Renault will throw all the new upgrades on Hulks car to maximize his results... which in turn makes Palmer look even worse.

Like I said I'd be ringing a few FE drivers.. giving Palmer 3-5 races.

I'd give him no more races - I'd already be looking for his replacement. As soon as I could find a better driver who's available, he'd be out, even if I needed to pay off his contract. Renault is a factory team - they can take the hit.

Personally, JEV would be my choice, but there are a lot of other good drivers out there with F1 experience who could probably jump right into the car and do a better job than Jolyon.


How about Di Rests? He may have a release clause in his Williams contract if offered a race drive.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 2:48 am 
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The difference between him and Hulk is incredible. He struggles to get out of Q1 while HULK puts it in Q3; p7, p8 every time.

I think the only reason he got the drive this year is Mag said no and Renault didn't want to wste money on drivers while getting the car up to speed aand lots of top driver contracts ending next year , no?

ALO & HuL @ Renault next year could be a new force ?

Have fun :)

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 8:23 am 
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Glasnost wrote:
I Think its quite obvious that Palmer
Is costing Renault in the mid-field fight.

If you guys were in charge what would you do?
Give him the rest of the season?
A few more races?

Personally I'd be ringing JEV and giving Palmer 3-5 more races maximum.

Am I being to cynical?


I didn't rate Palmer at all even in his early days. Still don't rate him and not even showing glimmer signs that he deserves to be here. Not a nice thing to say but if I was in charge of an F1 team with him - I would have given the test driver two weekends. I don't know the contracts though but I wouldnt have resigned him another year....


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 8:44 am 
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I really want to be patriotic and stick up for Palmer, but he's doing nothing to warrant any praise. He was pretty poor last year and was constantly slower than Magnessen (who I don't rare that highly myself anyway) but you give a driver a year to het into the swing of things. This year he hasn't impressed again so far, admittedly against a better team mate for comparison, but really not doing himself any favours.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:21 am 
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He's a bit like Chilton, but with more of an obnoxious and difficult-to-like manner. Poor driver + poor PR, would have loved to have seen his contract negotiations.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:35 am 
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I think his interviewing skills are even worse than his driving skills. While we've all heard of the "Princess Pascal" rumours, even he seems downright pleasant compared to Palmer.

Waste of a perfectly good seat - would've been much nicer if RBR could get one of their development drivers in there instead.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:37 am 
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This is what happens when you're resigned to fielding a line-up that includes your sixth choice driver.

Only winner here is Hulk, who is looking like an absolute star relative to Palmer.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:42 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
This is what happens when you're resigned to fielding a line-up that includes your sixth choice driver.

Only winner here is Hulk, who is looking like an absolute star relative to Palmer.


I'm not even sure of that, since we all know the Hulk is a good driver - we just didn't know this is how bad Palmer is.

Guess this also reflects poorly on KMag and Grosjean - the latter can safely kiss his Ferrari dreams goodbye. About time too, since I don't think he's done anything to merit a Ferrari drive (especially when compared to the likes of Perez/Hulk/Sainz, who might all be available in the next 1-2 years).


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:43 am 
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Badgeronimous wrote:
We know Hulkenburg


I don't know him, who is Hulkenburg?

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:49 am 
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I was expecting good things from him, especially when when Renault retained him, but lets face it, he does not belong there. He does claim sometimes that there is a problem with his car that they can not find, but...


I think Rowland is the reserve driver now Occon has left, give him one race if they are not sure.

@Ennis, I never considered Chilton as that bad a driver. Not top draw, but he knew the team could not afford to repair the car, so was in effect never driving to 100%. We will see next week, cos he has a 15th in the race the alleged best driver in the world is entered in :twisted:


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 12:21 pm 
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He did OK in GP2, and deserved 1 year in F1.

I was surprised he got a second year - maybe there were no better options available?

If it was down to me he'd be long gone - he seems out of his depth in F1.

Personally, I'd like to see Alonso go back there.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 12:31 pm 
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I know there are others drivers that are more deserving, but if it happened to be the case that Maldonado got his sponsers back, I wouldn;t mind him coming back. I'm certain he'd have been better than Palmer last year. Also, his 2015 performance wasn't bad at all. There were plenty of drivers that were much worse than him that season. He also had quite a few stand out races such as Canada and Austria.

I really don't think he'll be a bad option if he's also getting his money as it will help the team. It also may have done him some good having a break from F1. He may come back stronger.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 12:45 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I know there are others drivers that are more deserving, but if it happened to be the case that Maldonado got his sponsers back, I wouldn;t mind him coming back. I'm certain he'd have been better than Palmer last year. Also, his 2015 performance wasn't bad at all. There were plenty of drivers that were much worse than him that season. He also had quite a few stand out races such as Canada and Austria.

I really don't think he'll be a bad option if he's also getting his money as it will help the team. It also may have done him some good having a break from F1. He may come back stronger.

Venezuela is in utter chaos right now civilly and economically. There's no way there's any money for him to pay for Maldonado to go racing and probably nobody willing politically to front the money it even if there was.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 1:28 pm 
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moby wrote:

@Ennis, I never considered Chilton as that bad a driver. Not top draw, but he knew the team could not afford to repair the car, so was in effect never driving to 100%. We will see next week, cos he has a 15th in the race the alleged best driver in the world is entered in :twisted:


Nobody reaches F1 whilst being a 'bad' driver. I do think he was bad by F1 standards though. :) Bianchi showed you can at least have some pace...


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:52 pm 
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I would not keep him for the second part of the season, after the summer break.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 6:54 pm 
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pbchillin wrote:
Alonso back to Renault!

Joking aside, Palmer has been awful. I was surprised they kept him on for a second season in all truth.

Actually I think that's one reason why Palmer will keep the drive for this season because Renault are waiting on Alonso.

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 6:56 pm 
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I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:34 pm 
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nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.



You are being far too generous calling the McLaren a midfield car.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:41 pm 
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moby wrote:
I was expecting good things from him, especially when when Renault retained him, but lets face it, he does not belong there. He does claim sometimes that there is a problem with his car that they can not find, but...


I think Rowland is the reserve driver now Occon has left, give him one race if they are not sure.

@Ennis, I never considered Chilton as that bad a driver. Not top draw, but he knew the team could not afford to repair the car, so was in effect never driving to 100%. We will see next week, cos he has a 15th in the race the alleged best driver in the world is entered in :twisted:

Yes, I also couldn't consider Chilton as a poor driver. He wasn't impressive but he hardly ever made mistakes. At leased not in 2012. If I am correct, Ricciardo is the only driver to have completed every race in a season last year since he Chilton did in 2012.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:47 pm 
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Herb Tarlik wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.



You are being far too generous calling the McLaren a midfield car.

Well, I wont call it a backmarker either, because I'm convinced its a pretty good chassis, and the only problem is the godawful engine


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:50 pm 
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nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 8:09 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...

Hah I'm not as optimistic as you about Renault, I dont think they are putting in so much effort and I dont think they are able to beat Red Bull in the near future. The problem is that if Renault finally produces a good enough engine, Red Bull will most likely be in front of them. RB have shown for many years that they produce a great chasis and for Renault to match them would be very difficult. I would not go there as long as Red Bull have the same engine.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 8:26 pm 
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nixxxon wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...

Hah I'm not as optimistic as you about Renault, I dont think they are putting in so much effort and I dont think they are able to beat Red Bull in the near future. The problem is that if Renault finally produces a good enough engine, Red Bull will most likely be in front of them. RB have shown for many years that they produce a great chasis and for Renault to match them would be very difficult. I would not go there as long as Red Bull have the same engine.

Renault had a lot of house keeping issues to deal with after taking over the team and getting back into F1 as a works team. They had to handle financial issues, update equipment and facilities, hire new staff, etc. I think that by next year, Red Bull will have the same engine in the same way that Williams has the same engine Mercedes has if you follow my meaning. There's a lot that can be exploited if you design the engine and chassis to be in unison with each other.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 8:57 pm 
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and what makes it worse for palmer is that he sat in the pits for a year waiting patiently for his year to come ,but surely they will give him the year out and see , with Alonso not getting many views , from Ferrari or merc , and he must hate the sight of the McLaren swander, so a return to Renault will turn out to be Alonso's only viable option and might turn out to be a pretty good car in its 2nd year as works team status ,but that's what we thought at McLaren Honda - could their 4th year be their year of domination


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:15 pm 
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RaggedMan wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I know there are others drivers that are more deserving, but if it happened to be the case that Maldonado got his sponsers back, I wouldn;t mind him coming back. I'm certain he'd have been better than Palmer last year. Also, his 2015 performance wasn't bad at all. There were plenty of drivers that were much worse than him that season. He also had quite a few stand out races such as Canada and Austria.

I really don't think he'll be a bad option if he's also getting his money as it will help the team. It also may have done him some good having a break from F1. He may come back stronger.

Venezuela is in utter chaos right now civilly and economically. There's no way there's any money for him to pay for Maldonado to go racing and probably nobody willing politically to front the money it even if there was.

To be honest I don't think Pastor would even need to bring any sponsorship with him to be the more attractive option. He was always a quick driver and seemed much less error-prone in his final season. Interestingly he was actually in the paddock in Spain and had a brief interview on Sky TV, although he admitted he hadn't done any racing since leaving F1 and was enjoying having some time off.

Anyway Palmer is not F1 standard. I think we've seen enough and Renault should be looking at other options right now. There are a number of drivers who have left F1 in recent years (Maldonado being one of them) who could do a better job.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:42 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...


I can't imagine Hulk enjoying the prospect of Alonso coming back on board with Renault. Especially not after a year of cementing his place as the leed driver, given his comments of driving for a works team being a dream of his i'd expect that he's quite happy at the moment.
I think of the current field Carlos Saints or even vandorne would be a better fit.
Though i doubt they could snaffle them on a contract.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 10:03 pm 
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Glasnost wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...


I can't imagine Hulk enjoying the prospect of Alonso coming back on board with Renault. Especially not after a year of cementing his place as the leed driver, given his comments of driving for a works team being a dream of his i'd expect that he's quite happy at the moment.
I think of the current field Carlos Saints or even vandorne would be a better fit.
Though i doubt they could snaffle them on a contract.

The problem is that Hulk isn't good enough. Perez was clearly stronger overall when they were teammates and Perez is not a top shelf guy IMO. Hulk is one of the better qualifiers in F1 in my estimation but on race day he's totally average. Sainze would be a good backup plan should Alonso not be interested.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 11:23 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...

Hah I'm not as optimistic as you about Renault, I dont think they are putting in so much effort and I dont think they are able to beat Red Bull in the near future. The problem is that if Renault finally produces a good enough engine, Red Bull will most likely be in front of them. RB have shown for many years that they produce a great chasis and for Renault to match them would be very difficult. I would not go there as long as Red Bull have the same engine.

Renault had a lot of house keeping issues to deal with after taking over the team and getting back into F1 as a works team. They had to handle financial issues, update equipment and facilities, hire new staff, etc. I think that by next year, Red Bull will have the same engine in the same way that Williams has the same engine Mercedes has if you follow my meaning. There's a lot that can be exploited if you design the engine and chassis to be in unison with each other.

Sure, exactly as McLaren-Honda, same could be said of both teams. We will see. I bet Alonso regrets a lot (I mean a lot) leaving Ferrari right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:24 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Glasnost wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
nixxxon wrote:
I dont think Alonso will gain much with this move. From a midfield underpowered car to another a midfield underpowered car.

You have to think about the bigger picture. Do you really think that with Hamilton and Vettel both performing at a high level (and both younger than Alonso) there will be an available seat at either top team next year? Ask yourself this question; would either team be better off teaming Alonso with their top driver instead of Raikkonen/Bottas? I think the answer is obviously "no". It has nothing to do with his skill set; only the fact that he and the other top driver would hurt each other's chances at winning the WDC while the other top team would maximize their top driver's chances.

Most likely, Renault will be the logical choice for Alonso next year. I wouldn't be so quick to write them off either. I actually think they will overtake Red Bull by next year and potentially close up to the top two shortly after that. They are the works team here and their current car is strong enough that Alonso could probably get a couple of podium finishes in it this year. Massive engine upgrades are coming in the very near future...


I can't imagine Hulk enjoying the prospect of Alonso coming back on board with Renault. Especially not after a year of cementing his place as the leed driver, given his comments of driving for a works team being a dream of his i'd expect that he's quite happy at the moment.
I think of the current field Carlos Saints or even vandorne would be a better fit.
Though i doubt they could snaffle them on a contract.

The problem is that Hulk isn't good enough. Perez was clearly stronger overall when they were teammates and Perez is not a top shelf guy IMO. Hulk is one of the better qualifiers in F1 in my estimation but on race day he's totally average. Sainze would be a good backup plan should Alonso not be interested.


That's a good point, Hulk may not be good enough at the "top tier" but for now and for at least next year all they need is solid points scoring drivers. Which at this point, looking at the mid-feild only FI seem ro have two of.

The other problem... what if Alonso and sainz decline or get contracted? Roman? Get a rookie? JEV?


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:59 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
The problem is that Hulk isn't good enough. Perez was clearly stronger overall when they were teammates and Perez is not a top shelf guy IMO. Hulk is one of the better qualifiers in F1 in my estimation but on race day he's totally average. Sainze would be a good backup plan should Alonso not be interested.

If Hulk is totally average, who are the 10 drivers you think are better than him on race day?

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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 10:37 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
The problem is that Hulk isn't good enough. Perez was clearly stronger overall when they were teammates and Perez is not a top shelf guy IMO. Hulk is one of the better qualifiers in F1 in my estimation but on race day he's totally average. Sainze would be a good backup plan should Alonso not be interested.

If Hulk is totally average, who are the 10 drivers you think are better than him on race day?

1. Hamilton
2. Bottas
3. Vettel
4. Raikkonen (maybe being generous here)
5. Ricciardo
6. Verstappen
7. Perez
8. Ocon
9. Alonso
10. Sainze
11. Wehrlein


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 Post subject: Re: Renault & Palmer
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 11:30 pm 
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j man wrote:
RaggedMan wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I know there are others drivers that are more deserving, but if it happened to be the case that Maldonado got his sponsers back, I wouldn;t mind him coming back. I'm certain he'd have been better than Palmer last year. Also, his 2015 performance wasn't bad at all. There were plenty of drivers that were much worse than him that season. He also had quite a few stand out races such as Canada and Austria.

I really don't think he'll be a bad option if he's also getting his money as it will help the team. It also may have done him some good having a break from F1. He may come back stronger.

Venezuela is in utter chaos right now civilly and economically. There's no way there's any money for him to pay for Maldonado to go racing and probably nobody willing politically to front the money it even if there was.

To be honest I don't think Pastor would even need to bring any sponsorship with him to be the more attractive option. He was always a quick driver and seemed much less error-prone in his final season. Interestingly he was actually in the paddock in Spain and had a brief interview on Sky TV, although he admitted he hadn't done any racing since leaving F1 and was enjoying having some time off.

Anyway Palmer is not F1 standard. I think we've seen enough and Renault should be looking at other options right now. There are a number of drivers who have left F1 in recent years (Maldonado being one of them) who could do a better job.

As soon as Maldonado's money ran out he was on his bike, that's all you need to know about his standing in the paddock, the rookie Bottas was asked what did he learn from Maldonado as his teammate and he replied nothing.

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