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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:10 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Perez wasn't like this in the last 3 years when he partnered Hulk. 1 big factor is that mostly Perez outperformed Hulk & sometimes by a good margin. So there wasn't much friction between the 2.

Perez is genuinely feeling the heat with Ocon. Ocon has gotten upto speed & is nearly matching him to the hundredth's of a second when it comes to lap times. Perez has never feel so insecure, if you wish to put his behaviour in this bracket. If Perez wants to be on radar of a top team, he first needs to beat his team-mate comprehensively which is not happening at the moment & as the season progresses, Ocon will only get more comfortable on the tracks (starting with Spa) that he's already raced on with Manor. Ocon is high on confidence & is being a tight competitor to Perez when it comes to fighting for positions on the grid.

I believe with the Hulk he was more highly rated than Perez before they were teammates and so he had respect for the Hulk and realised just being on his level wouldn't be a bad thing in itself.

Against Ocon he has to show that he is better than a rookie to further his career and he is showing that he will go to any lengths to beat him.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:17 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Perez wasn't like this in the last 3 years when he partnered Hulk. 1 big factor is that mostly Perez outperformed Hulk & sometimes by a good margin. So there wasn't much friction between the 2.

Perez is genuinely feeling the heat with Ocon. Ocon has gotten upto speed & is nearly matching him to the hundredth's of a second when it comes to lap times. Perez has never feel so insecure, if you wish to put his behaviour in this bracket. If Perez wants to be on radar of a top team, he first needs to beat his team-mate comprehensively which is not happening at the moment & as the season progresses, Ocon will only get more comfortable on the tracks (starting with Spa) that he's already raced on with Manor. Ocon is high on confidence & is being a tight competitor to Perez when it comes to fighting for positions on the grid.

I believe with the Hulk he was more highly rated than Perez before they were teammates and so he had respect for the Hulk and realised just being on his level wouldn't be a bad thing in itself.

Against Ocon he has to show that he is better than a rookie to further his career and he is showing that he will go to any lengths to beat him.


Completely agree. Their friction will force Perez out of the team. But not many good options available!

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:37 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Perez wasn't like this in the last 3 years when he partnered Hulk. 1 big factor is that mostly Perez outperformed Hulk & sometimes by a good margin. So there wasn't much friction between the 2.

Perez is genuinely feeling the heat with Ocon. Ocon has gotten upto speed & is nearly matching him to the hundredth's of a second when it comes to lap times. Perez has never feel so insecure, if you wish to put his behaviour in this bracket. If Perez wants to be on radar of a top team, he first needs to beat his team-mate comprehensively which is not happening at the moment & as the season progresses, Ocon will only get more comfortable on the tracks (starting with Spa) that he's already raced on with Manor. Ocon is high on confidence & is being a tight competitor to Perez when it comes to fighting for positions on the grid.

I believe with the Hulk he was more highly rated than Perez before they were teammates and so he had respect for the Hulk and realised just being on his level wouldn't be a bad thing in itself.

Against Ocon he has to show that he is better than a rookie to further his career and he is showing that he will go to any lengths to beat him.


Yes I think he's aware that his career is at somewhat of a cross roads. Losing to a rookie would probably end any chance of a top drive in the near future and he knows it.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:39 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
When Toto Wolff was told about the probability of Wehrlein losing his seat at Sauber, Wolff replied by saying there are interesting things to come!

Wonder what he meant?

http://www.foxsportsasia.com/motorsports/formula-1/news/detail/item308923/wolff-on-wehrleins-future-interesting-things-to-come/

I only see this as Ocon to Renault and Wehrlein to Force India, there are no other seats available to Wehrlein, and I know I keep harping on about this but nationality plays a part as well, Mercedes need a well placed German within the system.

Talking about nationality how much would Renault love to have a talented young Frenchman in their team?


Agin I doubt Ocon going to Renault because:

- Ocon is gelling very well within the team & has come to speed so well hat he's literally matching Perez.
- When FI had the option to choose Ocon or Wehrlein, FI chose the former as the team didn't have much praise for Wehrlein. If they let a charming & good racer like Ocon go & put Wehrlein in his place which most of the team personnel were against, it would put FI on backfoot.
- Kubica is very much poised to join Renault sooner or later.

I wonder if Toto would make Wehrlein Mercedes' reserve driver.

You can't say that Ocon is gelling with the team when he is at loggerheads with Perez and Perez is very much the cash cow.

Perez has still to sign with Force India and some agreement may come about where Ocon is squeezed out of the team, Mercedes have a problem with Wehrlein and may let Ocon go to solve that problem knowing that Ocon is very much first on Renault's list.

Just because Force India preferred Ocon doesn't mean they wouldn't have taken Wehrlein if he had been the only choice it would still have been a financial desirable agreement for a team that needs to rent it's cars out to pay drivers for FP1 sessions and test sessions.

Also regarding Wehrlein, Wolff's statement that people will be surprised about things to come for next season I don't believe would be as simple as Wehrlein being announced as the Mercedes reserve driver which I believe he has been in the past anyway, that would be more like a backward step for him, it seems more likely to be a scenario like the one I proposed.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:50 pm 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Ocon has shaken Perez. IMO his driving in Canada made things pretty clear, he defended against Ocon as hard as he could and then pretty much waved Vettel by. He didn't care where he finished that race he only cared about finishing ahead of Ocon.

His pushing of Ocon before T2 at Baku just before the crash and his dive into T1 here are just further examples IMO. Someone on Sky said they had spoken to Bob Fernley about it and he said that Ocon winds Perez up because no matter what happens between them he just keeps smiling and that gets under Sergio's skin.

I doubt we've seen the last of the fireworks between them, personally I'm rooting for Ocon in that particular battle.

Indeed Perez accuses Ocon of not being a team player and lacking intelligence but action speaks louder than words and it's Perez who is not the team player as his prime motivation is to beat Ocon to further his career, Ocon out qualified him in Hungary so Perez simply hits Ocon at the start and gets in front, job done.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:58 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Ocon has shaken Perez. IMO his driving in Canada made things pretty clear, he defended against Ocon as hard as he could and then pretty much waved Vettel by. He didn't care where he finished that race he only cared about finishing ahead of Ocon.

His pushing of Ocon before T2 at Baku just before the crash and his dive into T1 here are just further examples IMO. Someone on Sky said they had spoken to Bob Fernley about it and he said that Ocon winds Perez up because no matter what happens between them he just keeps smiling and that gets under Sergio's skin.

I doubt we've seen the last of the fireworks between them, personally I'm rooting for Ocon in that particular battle.

Indeed Perez accuses Ocon of not being a team player and lacking intelligence but action speaks louder than words and it's Perez who is not the team player as his prime motivation is to beat Ocon to further his career, Ocon out qualified him in Hungary so Perez simply hits Ocon at the start and gets in front, job done.


Perez had agreed for a 1 year deal this year with FI, hoping to leapfrog within Ferrari incase Kimi retires or if he's not retained. It looks as good as done that Kimi will be retained for 1 more year so at the end of the next year they can take Ricciardo.

If Perez gets snubbed once again by Ferrari (very likely), he'll probably be stuck in the midfield forever.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 10:17 am 
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pokerman wrote:
mcdo wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Maybe Mercedes let Ocon go because they have a problem finding a seat for Wehrlein?

Ocon is doing well but still getting beat by Perez thus far.

@Poker - 1 factor worth putting into consideration is that most of the races that have taken place so far, Ocon has never ever driven on those tracks. He has on Hungary & in the practice sessions was beating Perez. He also did beat Perez in Silverstone.

The tracks coming after the summer break are familiar to Ocon & I'm expecting an increased performance from him.

I still doubt Ocon would go to Renault.

Don't get me wrong I think Ocon is doing well but would a young Lewis Hamilton be getting consistently out qualified by Perez and beat by Perez in the races?

Lewis Hamilton's rookie season is a ridiculously high standard to hold every new driver up to. It was 10 years ago, time for the fans to take their expectations back down a notch

I've said it elsewhere, Ocon is performing best of the newbies. And I don't think the current batch a particularly bad bunch

Yes Ocon is showing he is deserving of a place in F1 but also thus far we can't say he's a future superstar in the making, perception of who is doing best I think also helps when you are in the best car but having said that Ive been impressed by his maturity and it's being tested at the moment very much by the antics of Perez.

It's actually hard to make a complete comparison, Vandoorne is getting thrashed by Alonso but then again Alonso would beat Perez who in turn is consistently beating Ocon.

Meanwhile Wehrlein is beating Ericsson but Perez would also beat Ericsson, and like I say whilst Ocon is in a competitive car both Vandoorne and Wehrlein are in the two worse cars on the grid.

Ocon's drive in Brazil last year doesn't get the praise it should, he had the Manor in positions it had no business being in.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 10:22 am 
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pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
When Toto Wolff was told about the probability of Wehrlein losing his seat at Sauber, Wolff replied by saying there are interesting things to come!

Wonder what he meant?

http://www.foxsportsasia.com/motorsports/formula-1/news/detail/item308923/wolff-on-wehrleins-future-interesting-things-to-come/

I only see this as Ocon to Renault and Wehrlein to Force India, there are no other seats available to Wehrlein, and I know I keep harping on about this but nationality plays a part as well, Mercedes need a well placed German within the system.

Talking about nationality how much would Renault love to have a talented young Frenchman in their team?


Agin I doubt Ocon going to Renault because:

- Ocon is gelling very well within the team & has come to speed so well hat he's literally matching Perez.
- When FI had the option to choose Ocon or Wehrlein, FI chose the former as the team didn't have much praise for Wehrlein. If they let a charming & good racer like Ocon go & put Wehrlein in his place which most of the team personnel were against, it would put FI on backfoot.
- Kubica is very much poised to join Renault sooner or later.

I wonder if Toto would make Wehrlein Mercedes' reserve driver.

You can't say that Ocon is gelling with the team when he is at loggerheads with Perez and Perez is very much the cash cow.

Perez has still to sign with Force India and some agreement may come about where Ocon is squeezed out of the team, Mercedes have a problem with Wehrlein and may let Ocon go to solve that problem knowing that Ocon is very much first on Renault's list.

Just because Force India preferred Ocon doesn't mean they wouldn't have taken Wehrlein if he had been the only choice it would still have been a financial desirable agreement for a team that needs to rent it's cars out to pay drivers for FP1 sessions and test sessions.

Also regarding Wehrlein, Wolff's statement that people will be surprised about things to come for next season I don't believe would be as simple as Wehrlein being announced as the Mercedes reserve driver which I believe he has been in the past anyway, that would be more like a backward step for him, it seems more likely to be a scenario like the one I proposed.


Completely agree with Pokerman. From a financial perspective, Force India's best scenario is retaining Perez and running a Mercedes junior driver in their second seat. I would expect whatever deal they have with Mercedes for Ocon would be the same if they were running Wehrlein instead.

For Mercedes, it is infinitely better to have Wehrlein at FI and Ocon at Renault rather than Ocon at FI and Wehrlein potentially not even on the grid, which seems like it could be the case should (as expected) he find himself squeezed out of Sauber through a combination of Ericsson and Leclerc/Giovinazzi. If Ocon and Perez both remain at FI then the only other option for Wehrlein/Mercedes is going to be Williams, and that would depend on them dropping Massa as they're obviously not going to drop Stroll! Perhaps that is the surprise movement that Toto Wolff is referring to?

On another note, if Toro Rosso do indeed partner with Honda for 2018, should we expect Honda's two most prominent junior drivers (Matsushita and Fukuzumi) to become either part of, or somehow associated with, the Red Bull junior programme? Neither is a particularly standout talent, but besides Pierre Gasly, the Red Bull junior team is looking pretty weak these days.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:21 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
When Toto Wolff was told about the probability of Wehrlein losing his seat at Sauber, Wolff replied by saying there are interesting things to come!

Wonder what he meant?

http://www.foxsportsasia.com/motorsports/formula-1/news/detail/item308923/wolff-on-wehrleins-future-interesting-things-to-come/

I only see this as Ocon to Renault and Wehrlein to Force India, there are no other seats available to Wehrlein, and I know I keep harping on about this but nationality plays a part as well, Mercedes need a well placed German within the system.

Talking about nationality how much would Renault love to have a talented young Frenchman in their team?


Agin I doubt Ocon going to Renault because:

- Ocon is gelling very well within the team & has come to speed so well hat he's literally matching Perez.
- When FI had the option to choose Ocon or Wehrlein, FI chose the former as the team didn't have much praise for Wehrlein. If they let a charming & good racer like Ocon go & put Wehrlein in his place which most of the team personnel were against, it would put FI on backfoot.
- Kubica is very much poised to join Renault sooner or later.

I wonder if Toto would make Wehrlein Mercedes' reserve driver.

You can't say that Ocon is gelling with the team when he is at loggerheads with Perez and Perez is very much the cash cow.

Perez has still to sign with Force India and some agreement may come about where Ocon is squeezed out of the team, Mercedes have a problem with Wehrlein and may let Ocon go to solve that problem knowing that Ocon is very much first on Renault's list.

Just because Force India preferred Ocon doesn't mean they wouldn't have taken Wehrlein if he had been the only choice it would still have been a financial desirable agreement for a team that needs to rent it's cars out to pay drivers for FP1 sessions and test sessions.

Also regarding Wehrlein, Wolff's statement that people will be surprised about things to come for next season I don't believe would be as simple as Wehrlein being announced as the Mercedes reserve driver which I believe he has been in the past anyway, that would be more like a backward step for him, it seems more likely to be a scenario like the one I proposed.


Completely agree with Pokerman. From a financial perspective, Force India's best scenario is retaining Perez and running a Mercedes junior driver in their second seat. I would expect whatever deal they have with Mercedes for Ocon would be the same if they were running Wehrlein instead.

For Mercedes, it is infinitely better to have Wehrlein at FI and Ocon at Renault rather than Ocon at FI and Wehrlein potentially not even on the grid, which seems like it could be the case should (as expected) he find himself squeezed out of Sauber through a combination of Ericsson and Leclerc/Giovinazzi. If Ocon and Perez both remain at FI then the only other option for Wehrlein/Mercedes is going to be Williams, and that would depend on them dropping Massa as they're obviously not going to drop Stroll! Perhaps that is the surprise movement that Toto Wolff is referring to?

On another note, if Toro Rosso do indeed partner with Honda for 2018, should we expect Honda's two most prominent junior drivers (Matsushita and Fukuzumi) to become either part of, or somehow associated with, the Red Bull junior programme? Neither is a particularly standout talent, but besides Pierre Gasly, the Red Bull junior team is looking pretty weak these days.

I ruled out Wehrlein going to Williams because it's part of their sponsorship deal with Martini that at least one driver has to be over 25 years old, so we're back to the only way you keep Wehrlein in F1 is by letting Ocon go to Renault.

Having said that there is another rumour that Renault want Sainz so a deal can be brokered were Renault allow STR to break their contract with them so they can have Honda engines in return for Sainz.

It's all very confusing with so many drivers linked to Renault.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:29 am 
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This month is going to give a lot of drivers anxiety & probably sleepless nights. A lot of discussions, negotiations & agreements with highlight their schedule.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:58 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I only see this as Ocon to Renault and Wehrlein to Force India, there are no other seats available to Wehrlein, and I know I keep harping on about this but nationality plays a part as well, Mercedes need a well placed German within the system.

Talking about nationality how much would Renault love to have a talented young Frenchman in their team?


Agin I doubt Ocon going to Renault because:

- Ocon is gelling very well within the team & has come to speed so well hat he's literally matching Perez.
- When FI had the option to choose Ocon or Wehrlein, FI chose the former as the team didn't have much praise for Wehrlein. If they let a charming & good racer like Ocon go & put Wehrlein in his place which most of the team personnel were against, it would put FI on backfoot.
- Kubica is very much poised to join Renault sooner or later.

I wonder if Toto would make Wehrlein Mercedes' reserve driver.

You can't say that Ocon is gelling with the team when he is at loggerheads with Perez and Perez is very much the cash cow.

Perez has still to sign with Force India and some agreement may come about where Ocon is squeezed out of the team, Mercedes have a problem with Wehrlein and may let Ocon go to solve that problem knowing that Ocon is very much first on Renault's list.

Just because Force India preferred Ocon doesn't mean they wouldn't have taken Wehrlein if he had been the only choice it would still have been a financial desirable agreement for a team that needs to rent it's cars out to pay drivers for FP1 sessions and test sessions.

Also regarding Wehrlein, Wolff's statement that people will be surprised about things to come for next season I don't believe would be as simple as Wehrlein being announced as the Mercedes reserve driver which I believe he has been in the past anyway, that would be more like a backward step for him, it seems more likely to be a scenario like the one I proposed.


Completely agree with Pokerman. From a financial perspective, Force India's best scenario is retaining Perez and running a Mercedes junior driver in their second seat. I would expect whatever deal they have with Mercedes for Ocon would be the same if they were running Wehrlein instead.

For Mercedes, it is infinitely better to have Wehrlein at FI and Ocon at Renault rather than Ocon at FI and Wehrlein potentially not even on the grid, which seems like it could be the case should (as expected) he find himself squeezed out of Sauber through a combination of Ericsson and Leclerc/Giovinazzi. If Ocon and Perez both remain at FI then the only other option for Wehrlein/Mercedes is going to be Williams, and that would depend on them dropping Massa as they're obviously not going to drop Stroll! Perhaps that is the surprise movement that Toto Wolff is referring to?

On another note, if Toro Rosso do indeed partner with Honda for 2018, should we expect Honda's two most prominent junior drivers (Matsushita and Fukuzumi) to become either part of, or somehow associated with, the Red Bull junior programme? Neither is a particularly standout talent, but besides Pierre Gasly, the Red Bull junior team is looking pretty weak these days.

I ruled out Wehrlein going to Williams because it's part of their sponsorship deal with Martini that at least one driver has to be over 25 years old, so we're back to the only way you keep Wehrlein in F1 is by letting Ocon go to Renault.

Having said that there is another rumour that Renault want Sainz so a deal can be brokered were Renault allow STR to break their contract with them so they can have Honda engines in return for Sainz.

It's all very confusing with so many drivers linked to Renault.


That Sainz rumour actually makes a lot of sense, although that then ignores the other Renault/Honda/Toro Rosso rumour that Renault would allow Toro Rosso to break their contract with them in return for Honda allowing McLaren to end their partnership early so Renault can power McLaren! Might not be much of a silly season at the front of the grid but the midfield silly season is more than making up for it.

And, of course, all of that would be moot if Renault end up bringing back Kubica, as that would end the possibility of either Sainz or Ocon partnering Hulkenberg next year. And that would then leave Mercedes in a really tough spot to find a seat for Wehrlein. Your point re: Williams/Martini is very valid and one I had forgotten about completely, and if Sauber isn't an option it's hard to see where he would fit into it all.

I'm still waiting for it to turn out that Lewis is actually going to retire at the end of the season, and that to turn everything on its head!

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:15 pm 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
pokerman wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:

Agin I doubt Ocon going to Renault because:

- Ocon is gelling very well within the team & has come to speed so well hat he's literally matching Perez.
- When FI had the option to choose Ocon or Wehrlein, FI chose the former as the team didn't have much praise for Wehrlein. If they let a charming & good racer like Ocon go & put Wehrlein in his place which most of the team personnel were against, it would put FI on backfoot.
- Kubica is very much poised to join Renault sooner or later.

I wonder if Toto would make Wehrlein Mercedes' reserve driver.

You can't say that Ocon is gelling with the team when he is at loggerheads with Perez and Perez is very much the cash cow.

Perez has still to sign with Force India and some agreement may come about where Ocon is squeezed out of the team, Mercedes have a problem with Wehrlein and may let Ocon go to solve that problem knowing that Ocon is very much first on Renault's list.

Just because Force India preferred Ocon doesn't mean they wouldn't have taken Wehrlein if he had been the only choice it would still have been a financial desirable agreement for a team that needs to rent it's cars out to pay drivers for FP1 sessions and test sessions.

Also regarding Wehrlein, Wolff's statement that people will be surprised about things to come for next season I don't believe would be as simple as Wehrlein being announced as the Mercedes reserve driver which I believe he has been in the past anyway, that would be more like a backward step for him, it seems more likely to be a scenario like the one I proposed.


Completely agree with Pokerman. From a financial perspective, Force India's best scenario is retaining Perez and running a Mercedes junior driver in their second seat. I would expect whatever deal they have with Mercedes for Ocon would be the same if they were running Wehrlein instead.

For Mercedes, it is infinitely better to have Wehrlein at FI and Ocon at Renault rather than Ocon at FI and Wehrlein potentially not even on the grid, which seems like it could be the case should (as expected) he find himself squeezed out of Sauber through a combination of Ericsson and Leclerc/Giovinazzi. If Ocon and Perez both remain at FI then the only other option for Wehrlein/Mercedes is going to be Williams, and that would depend on them dropping Massa as they're obviously not going to drop Stroll! Perhaps that is the surprise movement that Toto Wolff is referring to?

On another note, if Toro Rosso do indeed partner with Honda for 2018, should we expect Honda's two most prominent junior drivers (Matsushita and Fukuzumi) to become either part of, or somehow associated with, the Red Bull junior programme? Neither is a particularly standout talent, but besides Pierre Gasly, the Red Bull junior team is looking pretty weak these days.

I ruled out Wehrlein going to Williams because it's part of their sponsorship deal with Martini that at least one driver has to be over 25 years old, so we're back to the only way you keep Wehrlein in F1 is by letting Ocon go to Renault.

Having said that there is another rumour that Renault want Sainz so a deal can be brokered were Renault allow STR to break their contract with them so they can have Honda engines in return for Sainz.

It's all very confusing with so many drivers linked to Renault.


That Sainz rumour actually makes a lot of sense, although that then ignores the other Renault/Honda/Toro Rosso rumour that Renault would allow Toro Rosso to break their contract with them in return for Honda allowing McLaren to end their partnership early so Renault can power McLaren! Might not be much of a silly season at the front of the grid but the midfield silly season is more than making up for it.

And, of course, all of that would be moot if Renault end up bringing back Kubica, as that would end the possibility of either Sainz or Ocon partnering Hulkenberg next year. And that would then leave Mercedes in a really tough spot to find a seat for Wehrlein. Your point re: Williams/Martini is very valid and one I had forgotten about completely, and if Sauber isn't an option it's hard to see where he would fit into it all.

I'm still waiting for it to turn out that Lewis is actually going to retire at the end of the season, and that to turn everything on its head!

Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:20 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?


Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:32 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?


Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.

Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:38 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?


Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.

Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.


I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:48 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?


Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.

Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.


I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.


I remember he had said he had a few years more with him in F1. I don't know if these years remain constant irrespective if he wins or loses (to Vettel or Bottas for example) for the title.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:30 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?


Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.

Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.


I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.

The only link in this respect to Rosberg is that he was his teammate otherwise why Hamilton and not say Alonso who is older?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:34 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Why do people think that Hamilton might retire anytime soon, there is nothing really to back that up?


Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.

Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.


I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.

The only link in this respect to Rosberg is that he was his teammate otherwise why Hamilton and not say Alonso who is older?


I don't understand?

Rosberg is an F1 driver who quit suddenly without any evidence being that he was going to do so. The point being that it can happen. lac of evidence does not mean one cannot speculate as to Hamilton's retirement date.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:54 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Nothing to back up the notion he will go on and on either.

I suspect he'll do another few years but I don't see him growing old in F1.

Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.


I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.

The only link in this respect to Rosberg is that he was his teammate otherwise why Hamilton and not say Alonso who is older?


I don't understand?

Rosberg is an F1 driver who quit suddenly without any evidence being that he was going to do so. The point being that it can happen. lac of evidence does not mean one cannot speculate as to Hamilton's retirement date.

I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:40 am 
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pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Then in that case I guess all the talk I hear about how Kimi is going to retire every single year is just my imagination? Or how about how Alonso is going to retire and go to IndyCar if he can't get a winning car?

I guess those don't count.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:09 am 
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pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.


No talk of Alonso packing it all in then? Or Kimi or Massa?


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:42 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.


No talk of Alonso packing it all in then? Or Kimi or Massa?

To be fair none of those drivers want to retire, Massa and Kimi would be because they didn't get contracts and Alonso because he didn't get a competitive car. All three are actively seeking to remain in F1 and the rumours are different to the Hamilton ones


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:00 am 
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pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Whilst Hamilton himself has stated that his still good for a few more years yet.


I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.

The only link in this respect to Rosberg is that he was his teammate otherwise why Hamilton and not say Alonso who is older?


I don't understand?

Rosberg is an F1 driver who quit suddenly without any evidence being that he was going to do so. The point being that it can happen. lac of evidence does not mean one cannot speculate as to Hamilton's retirement date.

I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Not so strange when Lewis makes comments on the lines of these:

"My destiny is in my own hands. I can decide to stop at the end of this year,"

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/24181/10922119/lewis-hamilton-opens-door-to-f1-retirement-despite-enjoying-awesome-2017-competition

Now you can't read anything conclusive from that, but I'd suggest he'd media-savvy enough to know that saying things like that would be bound to cause speculation as to its meaning.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 am 
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As per recent rumours, Vettel is not agreeing to a 3 year contract with Ferrari. He wants a 1 year extenstion, hoping to join Mercedes in 2019.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns37092.html

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:23 am 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
As per recent rumours, Vettel is not agreeing to a 3 year contract with Ferrari. He wants a 1 year extenstion, hoping to join Mercedes in 2019.

http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/formula-1/ferrari/news/vettel-wants-one-year-ferrari-extension_304352.html

seems like smoke and mirrors, tbh. Just speculation


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:27 am 
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Zoue wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
As per recent rumours, Vettel is not agreeing to a 3 year contract with Ferrari. He wants a 1 year extenstion, hoping to join Mercedes in 2019.

http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/formula-1/ferrari/news/vettel-wants-one-year-ferrari-extension_304352.html

seems like smoke and mirrors, tbh. Just speculation


I could believe that. if you're an elite level driver then in the current culture of the sport I see no big incentive to sign a long term deal.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:50 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Zoue wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
As per recent rumours, Vettel is not agreeing to a 3 year contract with Ferrari. He wants a 1 year extenstion, hoping to join Mercedes in 2019.

http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/formula-1/ferrari/news/vettel-wants-one-year-ferrari-extension_304352.html

seems like smoke and mirrors, tbh. Just speculation


I could believe that. if you're an elite level driver then in the current culture of the sport I see no big incentive to sign a long term deal.

yes I don't think it's not possible, just that the article seems to be relying on pure guesswork


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:18 am 
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Assuming if Ferrari do give him a 1 year extension, he'll be leaving Ferrari at the end of 2018. Kimi would also be retiring after 2018 as there will be no Vettel to push for his seat.

This implies there could be 2 vacant seats at Ferrari. If Hamilton doesn't retire next year, he would likely fill 1 seat.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:25 am 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Assuming if Ferrari do give him a 1 year extension, he'll be leaving Ferrari at the end of 2018. Kimi would also be retiring after 2018 as there will be no Vettel to push for his seat.

This implies there could be 2 vacant seats at Ferrari. If Hamilton doesn't retire next year, he would likely fill 1 seat.


Even if he does only want a one year deal it may not be because he wants to leave Ferrari at the end of 2018. He may just want the option.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:51 am 
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Exediron wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Then in that case I guess all the talk I hear about how Kimi is going to retire every single year is just my imagination? Or how about how Alonso is going to retire and go to IndyCar if he can't get a winning car?

I guess those don't count.

Kimi is the oldest driver on the grid at 38 this year, that's the kind of age that most drivers have already retired, plus he's not exactly performing at the highest level.

Meanwhile Alonso is 36 and getting close to the normal F1 retirement, he is also in an uncompetitive car so again that's quite normal to start considering his age and motivation.

Hamilton at 32 is much younger and he is in a race winning car, where's the motivation for him to consider retirement, he's only 1 year older than Grosjean, 2 years older than Vettel, 3 years older than the Hulk, he is closer in age to these drivers than he is to Alonso but we would never consider these drivers to be retiring anytime soon.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:58 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Exediron wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Then in that case I guess all the talk I hear about how Kimi is going to retire every single year is just my imagination? Or how about how Alonso is going to retire and go to IndyCar if he can't get a winning car?

I guess those don't count.

Kimi is the oldest driver on the grid at 38 this year, that's the kind of age that most drivers have already retired, plus he's not exactly performing at the highest level.

Meanwhile Alonso is 36 and getting close to the normal F1 retirement, he is also in an uncompetitive car so again that's quite normal to start considering his age and motivation.

Hamilton at 32 is much younger and he is in a race winning car, where's the motivation for him to consider retirement, he's only 1 year older than Grosjean, 2 years older than Vettel, 3 years older than the Hulk, he is closer in age to these drivers than he is to Alonso but we would never consider these drivers to be retiring anytime soon.


And a few months older that Rosberg who did retire.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:59 am 
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I remember talk of Alonso retiring back in 2013/14, he would have been around the same age Hamilton is now. Vettel will the next one in a couple of years time when he's the same age, that's just the age that the speculation starts seemingly.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:03 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.


No talk of Alonso packing it all in then? Or Kimi or Massa?

These drivers are much older than Hamilton plus in the case of Massa and Kimi that's more to do with them being put out to pasture than actually packing in.

With Alonso it's clear he has no intention of packing in racing anytime soon, he has set himself goals past the end of his F1 career, his only problem presently is finding a better car.

The other 30+ drivers are Vettel and Grosjean but because like Hamilton they are in the low 30's there's no consideration given to them retiring in the next year or two.

Only with Hamilton do we hear talk that he could retire anytime soon of his own accord, this despite him being in a WDC capable car, it's strange that of all the 30+ drivers he is seen as the one most ready to walk from F1.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:12 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:

I am sure Rosberg felt the same way until he didn't.

There was no evidence of his sudden retirement either.

The only link in this respect to Rosberg is that he was his teammate otherwise why Hamilton and not say Alonso who is older?


I don't understand?

Rosberg is an F1 driver who quit suddenly without any evidence being that he was going to do so. The point being that it can happen. lac of evidence does not mean one cannot speculate as to Hamilton's retirement date.

I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Not so strange when Lewis makes comments on the lines of these:

"My destiny is in my own hands. I can decide to stop at the end of this year,"

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/24181/10922119/lewis-hamilton-opens-door-to-f1-retirement-despite-enjoying-awesome-2017-competition

Now you can't read anything conclusive from that, but I'd suggest he'd media-savvy enough to know that saying things like that would be bound to cause speculation as to its meaning.

He was being asked a question about retirement because of Rosberg retiring, there's all kinds of quotes from him like he's driving better than he has ever had before and he sees himself retiring maybe at 37, he's still young and he's in his prime.

He mentions things like so long as he's driving well and he is in a good car then basically he's good to go.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:20 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Exediron wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Then in that case I guess all the talk I hear about how Kimi is going to retire every single year is just my imagination? Or how about how Alonso is going to retire and go to IndyCar if he can't get a winning car?

I guess those don't count.

Kimi is the oldest driver on the grid at 38 this year, that's the kind of age that most drivers have already retired, plus he's not exactly performing at the highest level.

Meanwhile Alonso is 36 and getting close to the normal F1 retirement, he is also in an uncompetitive car so again that's quite normal to start considering his age and motivation.

Hamilton at 32 is much younger and he is in a race winning car, where's the motivation for him to consider retirement, he's only 1 year older than Grosjean, 2 years older than Vettel, 3 years older than the Hulk, he is closer in age to these drivers than he is to Alonso but we would never consider these drivers to be retiring anytime soon.


And a few months older that Rosberg who did retire.


I think it differs for each driver.

Rosberg retired at exactly the right time - I don't think he'd have won a second WDC.

Kimi should have never come back after rallying.

Alonso I reckon has 3 more years left in him.

Vettel - can't see him stopping anytime soon, regardless of how many WDC's he may or may not win.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:34 pm 
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Pokerman - I don't really understand your issue with people speculating about Hamilton's retirement date. he might retire in the next few years. He might not. So what? I don't see many people suggesting he is going to retire this year.

I think you have to remember that things can change. Rosberg wasn't going to retire until he decided he was etc.

Just because Hamilton is not thinking of retirement now doesn't mean he won't be in 12 months time.


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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:53 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
As per recent rumours, Vettel is not agreeing to a 3 year contract with Ferrari. He wants a 1 year extenstion, hoping to join Mercedes in 2019.

http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/formula-1/ferrari/news/vettel-wants-one-year-ferrari-extension_304352.html

seems like smoke and mirrors, tbh. Just speculation

There is a hell of a lot of smoke surrounding this though.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:58 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Assuming if Ferrari do give him a 1 year extension, he'll be leaving Ferrari at the end of 2018. Kimi would also be retiring after 2018 as there will be no Vettel to push for his seat.

This implies there could be 2 vacant seats at Ferrari. If Hamilton doesn't retire next year, he would likely fill 1 seat.

If it's all true and Vettel gets his 1 year contract with Ferrari and then joins Mercedes for 2019 then I believe that would be part of his deal that there will be no Hamilton, I mean that's the only thing that stops him joining Mercedes next year really otherwise why the wait between both Vettel and Mercedes.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:01 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Assuming if Ferrari do give him a 1 year extension, he'll be leaving Ferrari at the end of 2018. Kimi would also be retiring after 2018 as there will be no Vettel to push for his seat.

This implies there could be 2 vacant seats at Ferrari. If Hamilton doesn't retire next year, he would likely fill 1 seat.


Even if he does only want a one year deal it may not be because he wants to leave Ferrari at the end of 2018. He may just want the option.

Now let's swing over to Alonso and what was being discussed in another thread, would Ferrari give Vettel what he wants with a 1 year contract when Alonso would happily sign a multi-year contract with Ferrari?

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 Post subject: Re: Silly season 2018
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:04 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Exediron wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I'm saying in that respect you can make the same case for any 30+ driver, It's strange how Hamilton is the only driver in this age range that people think might retire soon especially when he's not even given a hint that he is considering it.

Then in that case I guess all the talk I hear about how Kimi is going to retire every single year is just my imagination? Or how about how Alonso is going to retire and go to IndyCar if he can't get a winning car?

I guess those don't count.

Kimi is the oldest driver on the grid at 38 this year, that's the kind of age that most drivers have already retired, plus he's not exactly performing at the highest level.

Meanwhile Alonso is 36 and getting close to the normal F1 retirement, he is also in an uncompetitive car so again that's quite normal to start considering his age and motivation.

Hamilton at 32 is much younger and he is in a race winning car, where's the motivation for him to consider retirement, he's only 1 year older than Grosjean, 2 years older than Vettel, 3 years older than the Hulk, he is closer in age to these drivers than he is to Alonso but we would never consider these drivers to be retiring anytime soon.


And a few months older that Rosberg who did retire.

Again the only relevance he has in regards to Rosberg is that they were teammates when he retired, Hamilton is not joined at the hip with Rosberg.

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