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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 12:45 pm 
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Prema wrote:
I find this pretty much an American internal issue, the flag "fetishism". It is far deeper than what it appears to be from its surface. Kneeling in itself is not even an act of disrespect, but simply a different way. Even not giving a respect, that itself would still not constitute an act of disrespect by default. But just the absence of respect. So it is not even about the very symbol itself (the flag) but the ritual. And that is but the surface of it.

Americans can't watch one silly game without being made to stand up and cross their hearts. That is the drill that they Americans have been subjected to since their births. It is brainwashing, yes, like they do in N. Korea too. The unconditional worship of the state, or rather the mighty military that is protecting their freedom and liberty. That is the meaning, so when the Uncle Sam calls for their boys to be sent to fight (and die and get butchered) in some war overseas, people answer the calls as proudly as they have been trained to stand up with their hands crossing their hearts millions of times... no question asked. Never mind that their boys are not even protecting their freedom and liberty back home - nobody is ever threatening the homeland security and American freedom, since the end of WW2.

That is the trouble of "taking the knee" during the flag ritual. An individual sheep doing differently than what all the rest of sheep do every time. Yes, it brings the full attention to the intended message, but it could lead to an erosion of the very ritual... and incidentally, the gross reaction by Trump has just initiated something more than the intended original "BLM" protest. A protest against the government itself. Though, that is the way Trump only knows how to rule: to divide people, turn one group (preferably the majority) against the other. If people didn't mind, if it is fine with them, then the rulers are losers. But it's the sward with double edge.

Hence, Hamilton best keeps out of that circus. IMO.


Just like this guy.

Image
http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/559413e8eab8eac877d8d3ce/the-tragically-powerful-story-behind-the-lone-german-who-refused-to-give-hitler-the-nazi-salute.jpg

When people are conditioned to give a mechanical response or they will face retaliation, it takes a brave man with firm convictions to stand their ground. The story of August Landmesser should never be forgotten. He was later imprisoned and eventually drafted into penal military service, where he was killed in action.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 1:08 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:22 pm
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Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Prema wrote:
I find this pretty much an American internal issue, the flag "fetishism". It is far deeper than what it appears to be from its surface. Kneeling in itself is not even an act of disrespect, but simply a different way. Even not giving a respect, that itself would still not constitute an act of disrespect by default. But just the absence of respect. So it is not even about the very symbol itself (the flag) but the ritual. And that is but the surface of it.

Americans can't watch one silly game without being made to stand up and cross their hearts. That is the drill that they Americans have been subjected to since their births. It is brainwashing, yes, like they do in N. Korea too. The unconditional worship of the state, or rather the mighty military that is protecting their freedom and liberty. That is the meaning, so when the Uncle Sam calls for their boys to be sent to fight (and die and get butchered) in some war overseas, people answer the calls as proudly as they have been trained to stand up with their hands crossing their hearts millions of times... no question asked. Never mind that their boys are not even protecting their freedom and liberty back home - nobody is ever threatening the homeland security and American freedom, since the end of WW2.

That is the trouble of "taking the knee" during the flag ritual. An individual sheep doing differently than what all the rest of sheep do every time. Yes, it brings the full attention to the intended message, but it could lead to an erosion of the very ritual... and incidentally, the gross reaction by Trump has just initiated something more than the intended original "BLM" protest. A protest against the government itself. Though, that is the way Trump only knows how to rule: to divide people, turn one group (preferably the majority) against the other. If people didn't mind, if it is fine with them, then the rulers are losers. But it's the sward with double edge.

Hence, Hamilton best keeps out of that circus. IMO.


Just like this guy.

Image
http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/559413e8eab8eac877d8d3ce/the-tragically-powerful-story-behind-the-lone-german-who-refused-to-give-hitler-the-nazi-salute.jpg

When people are conditioned to give a mechanical response or they will face retaliation, it takes a brave man with firm convictions to stand their ground. The story of August Landmesser should never be forgotten. He was later imprisoned and eventually drafted into penal military service, where he was killed in action.


Maybe he forgot to use deodorant, or put his belt on

As you say, it takes a brave man, respect to him. It probably involved more than just being ignored too


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