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 Post subject: Jerez 1997 - 20 years on
PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:20 pm 
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A nice video and article has been given to us by Liberty Media F1:

https://www.formula1.com/en/video/2017/ ... z_'97.html

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/feat ... ez-97.html

The interesting tidbits from my POV:

- JV mentioned the goodyear tyres were very peaky that year, and that he pushed like hell on the first couple of laps after his final pitstop. He thinks if he hadn't made the move then, he would have lost out because he had taken the life out of the tyres. Other accounts do mention that MS was nursing his tyres in that final stint, especially given the problems that Ferrari had with blistering tyres that year. Incidentally, no mention of a water leak (or any other mechanical problem) on Michael's car. Craig Pollack said at the time that he though MS had a problem with his car.

- JV and MS didn't see eye to eye after Estoril 96.

- HHF went crazy on the radio as he was watching the collision unfold in front of him. Apparently, he got so flustered that he missed his pitbox for final pitstop, instead arriving in the Benetton box (this wasn't picked up in the live race feed, nor was Berger's last lap pass on Irvine). Would love to have heard team radio from JV and MS in that race.

- JV says he saw Michael watching him with his helmet off in the laps after the collision. JV also says he saw Michael was sweating and that Michael never sweats (amazed and slightly sceptical that he can see that kind of detail while still racing). This is in line with Webber's observations after Monaco 06 that MS was very nervous and jittery in the press conference, and his hand was shaking.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 2:35 am 
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This was an amazing race to rewatch today. It’s so fascinating to see certain cars pulling away at different points. Thanks for posting, great video!

I love how the tracks used to have so much gravel instead of the ashpahlt run off areas we have today. 1997 was an exciting season.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 8:15 am 
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I watched this race live too. Of course I was willing Schumacher on. There had to have been something wrong with his car, perhaps they overfilled it or something, because the rate at which Villeneuve caught him was unfathomable.

As the collision happened, for a spilt second I had wanted to believe that it had happened organically. A racing incident. But quickly I was livid with Schumacher.

Watching this video, although it doesn't excuse it, to be fairto Schumacher he was right at the time that Villeneuve had broke too late. He was wrong that Villeneuve wouldn't have made the corner, but had his car not been ailing and he still had confidence in it, Villeneuve almost certainly would have went wide, either taking Schumacher with him, of been vulnerable to Schumacher ducking back under him on the inside.

I also don't like that aspect of Villeneuve's character. He went too hard after Schumacher trying to smear his reputation. And for years after, for that matter. Relaying the story of the photo turning up in the paper. He was losing second place in the championship. What was Villeneuve expecting? Schumacher tried to make an unjust gain at the championship. Now Villeneuve was attempting to support a questionably deserved second place for Frentzen. Right or wrong, for all but one race that season, Schumacher had merited that second place. I'm comfortable with Schumacher's demotion, especially as previous seasons had become ridiculous with last race shenanigans. But it was all very distasteful.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:10 am 
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Was quite amusing to see Cars falling over each other at the last Corner.

Coulthard - "After you Jacques"
Villeneuve - "No after you"

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 2:49 pm 
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So JV had one chance and took it.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:10 pm 
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da4an1qu1 wrote:
Watching this video, although it doesn't excuse it, to be fairto Schumacher he was right at the time that Villeneuve had broke too late. He was wrong that Villeneuve wouldn't have made the corner, but had his car not been ailing and he still had confidence in it, Villeneuve almost certainly would have went wide, either taking Schumacher with him, of been vulnerable to Schumacher ducking back under him on the inside.
If all Schumacher had to do was a switchback behind Villeneuve, then clearly he didn't believe Villeneuve braked too late, did he?

I still don't understand whose car is supposed to have been ailing. Schumacher's?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 12:35 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
da4an1qu1 wrote:
Watching this video, although it doesn't excuse it, to be fairto Schumacher he was right at the time that Villeneuve had broke too late. He was wrong that Villeneuve wouldn't have made the corner, but had his car not been ailing and he still had confidence in it, Villeneuve almost certainly would have went wide, either taking Schumacher with him, of been vulnerable to Schumacher ducking back under him on the inside.
If all Schumacher had to do was a switchback behind Villeneuve, then clearly he didn't believe Villeneuve braked too late, did he?


As per below, for sure Schumacher realised he didn't have the pace to hold onto a lead, let alone retake it. And to be honest, the latter part of my contention, that Schumacher could duck back under... that's a concession to those that don't believe Villeneuve would have had Schumacher wide or off... I found a video that has the bit about Schumacher making the claim about the late braking:

https://youtu.be/J_33NHxHsis?t=9m50s


I'm not defending Schumacher's decision to go for broke. I am defending his racing assessment. Look at the video objectively, you'll see that Villeneuve broke too late. If there was no car beside him, he would have been having one of those moments to tip-toe back onto the racing line.

I somewhat feel that Schumacher was rationalising his bad behaviour by Villeneuve's supposed bad behaviour. That was wrong. Over-cooking it is not the same as deliberately trying to have someone off...

Fiki wrote:
I still don't understand whose car is supposed to have been ailing. Schumacher's?


I wish I had timing data to see what happened exactly, but at the time, I remember that Schumacher's pace dropped right off. Well below even competitors further down the placings. Commentators were saying that there might have been something wrong with the car. The OP alludes to this:

davidheath461 wrote:
The interesting tidbits from my POV:

- JV mentioned the goodyear tyres were very peaky that year, and that he pushed like hell on the first couple of laps after his final pitstop. He thinks if he hadn't made the move then, he would have lost out because he had taken the life out of the tyres. Other accounts do mention that MS was nursing his tyres in that final stint, especially given the problems that Ferrari had with blistering tyres that year. Incidentally, no mention of a water leak (or any other mechanical problem) on Michael's car. Craig Pollack said at the time that he though MS had a problem with his car.


Also from that same video:

https://youtu.be/J_33NHxHsis?t=7m55s

Quote:
It was absolutely clear. He knew he was going to lose the lead. His car was faltering and that was his final effort to hang on to the championship


I hope I haven't put anyone's noses out. It's really a bit of fun remembering what at the time was the tensest finale I had watched (which was quickly followed by Suzuka in 1999, with the 1998 finale being a bit of a bust).


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