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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:03 pm 
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Didn't see this coming...

https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/2843 ... -f1-teams/

Seems like Sirotkin could be on his way to Toro Rosso.

Hopefully, if it is true, this paves way for Ocon/Russell/Kubica at Williams.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 3:20 pm 
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Surely Toro Rosso would be better going for Vandoorne than Sirotkin if they're going for an existing F1 driver.

Any rumours on Williams' line up? Not seen much recently for them.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 4:46 pm 
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Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:05 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!


Yeah that would make sense but do Red Bull need money?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:06 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!


Indeed, Sirotkin has shown nothing to justify giving him a F1 seat on merit.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:56 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!


Yeah that would make sense but do Red Bull need money?


Well let's not forget that Sean Gelael has done a bunch of FP1 sessions for Toro Rosso, and he's 100% there because of money. Not to say they *need* money, but perhaps they're not adverse to bringing extra funds in.

All that said, I'd be very, very surprised if Sirotkin takes that second seat.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:59 pm 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
JN23 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!


Yeah that would make sense but do Red Bull need money?


Well let's not forget that Sean Gelael has done a bunch of FP1 sessions for Toro Rosso, and he's 100% there because of money. Not to say they *need* money, but perhaps they're not adverse to bringing extra funds in.

All that said, I'd be very, very surprised if Sirotkin takes that second seat.


I reckon it's the same game football agents play: it's either Hartley getting the indirect hurry up because a fella with cash is on the market, or Williams being told to offer Sirotkin a deal sharpish because he has 'other offers'.... probably the latter.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:22 am 
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I can't see this happening. Say what you will about the Red Bull program, but they don't pick slow drivers with cash. They'll put someone in that seat they think has potential to be a Red Bull driver one day, and that isn't Sirotkin.

Mind you, I was on record as saying Kimi would never go to Sauber, so take that for what it's worth! :D

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 10:22 am 
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Exediron wrote:
I can't see this happening. Say what you will about the Red Bull program, but they don't pick slow drivers with cash. They'll put someone in that seat they think has potential to be a Red Bull driver one day, and that isn't Sirotkin.

Mind you, I was on record as saying Kimi would never go to Sauber, so take that for what it's worth! :D


I don't think you were Robinson Caruso on that one Exed.

Yeah seems an odd move by TR if true. Surely there's options out there that'd be a better fit into the RB/TR driver model than Sirotkin.

With a once sacked, former driver re-joining the team & now a, i'd say fairly ordinary pay driver rumoured to be along side him, the RBYDP really isn't looking too strong ATM.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 12:56 pm 
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I've said it before, but Red Bull's YDP is a victim of its own success. The other teams finally started catching on and doing a better job with their own YDP, which has left Red Bull with less talent and less of an ability to sign drivers at a later stage in their development, when it might be easier to predict if they'll get to F1 or not. The fact that they're having to look outside of the programme for the second time in 12 months says it all.

Personally I would've liked to have seen them give Albon another chance, or even (putting aside the fact he's not ready for F1) put Mick Schumacher in the car. I'd love all of this to be misdirection and it ends with Stoffel Vandoorne getting the seat, but it really doesn't seem like that's going to happen.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:11 pm 
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https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/bloc ... o/3188773/

So by the sounds of this article Red Bull blocked Sainz to Renault and then didn't even promote him to the Red Bull seat when Dan left.

Have to say it looks like Sainz was royally screwed over here. Why block the move if you have no intention of giving him the drive anyway? At least he found a seat I guess.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:21 pm 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/blocking-sainz-deal-cost-red-bull-ricciardo/3188773/

So by the sounds of this article Red Bull blocked Sainz to Renault and then didn't even promote him to the Red Bull seat when Dan left.

Have to say it looks like Sainz was royally screwed over here. Why block the move if you have no intention of giving him the drive anyway? At least he found a seat I guess.

So Renault only signed Ricciardo because Red Bull blocked their approach for Sainz? I enjoy the irony of that.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 6:14 pm 
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j man wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/blocking-sainz-deal-cost-red-bull-ricciardo/3188773/

So by the sounds of this article Red Bull blocked Sainz to Renault and then didn't even promote him to the Red Bull seat when Dan left.

Have to say it looks like Sainz was royally screwed over here. Why block the move if you have no intention of giving him the drive anyway? At least he found a seat I guess.

So Renault only signed Ricciardo because Red Bull blocked their approach for Sainz? I enjoy the irony of that.

Karma!

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:49 pm 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/blocking-sainz-deal-cost-red-bull-ricciardo/3188773/

So by the sounds of this article Red Bull blocked Sainz to Renault and then didn't even promote him to the Red Bull seat when Dan left.

Have to say it looks like Sainz was royally screwed over here. Why block the move if you have no intention of giving him the drive anyway? At least he found a seat I guess.


I assume he had a contract and Red Bull wanted paying to get out of it. I think Sainz made himself very unpopular at Red Bull. They obviously weren't interested in doing him a favour.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 8:42 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!

Never thought I'd actually agree with Marko but he's right. I think there are just a lot of people who haven't let go of Vandoorne's feeder series success. That's why his name keeps getting brought up for these seats. I'd much rather put an unknown quantity in the car than Stoff at this point. What has he done in 2 full F1 seasons to warrant a second chance? Name me one impressive performance that he's had? One really special lap in qualy or one gutsy overtake? One weekend where he's brought home a points haul that was unexpected? I ask you to name one of any of these things because I actually cannot.

I know the car has been bad and I know he's got a very tough teammate as a comparison point but it has been nearly 40 races with hardly anything to talk about. I think the two race stretch of Singapore and Malaysia last year was probably the high point of his career (back to back 7th place finishes) and he really benefited a LOT in Singapore from the first lap crash. There just hasn't been anything to be excited about and it's been a pretty good sample size at this point.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 6:16 am 
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sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!

Never thought I'd actually agree with Marko but he's right. I think there are just a lot of people who haven't let go of Vandoorne's feeder series success. That's why his name keeps getting brought up for these seats. I'd much rather put an unknown quantity in the car than Stoff at this point. What has he done in 2 full F1 seasons to warrant a second chance? Name me one impressive performance that he's had? One really special lap in qualy or one gutsy overtake? One weekend where he's brought home a points haul that was unexpected? I ask you to name one of any of these things because I actually cannot.

I know the car has been bad and I know he's got a very tough teammate as a comparison point but it has been nearly 40 races with hardly anything to talk about. I think the two race stretch of Singapore and Malaysia last year was probably the high point of his career (back to back 7th place finishes) and he really benefited a LOT in Singapore from the first lap crash. There just hasn't been anything to be excited about and it's been a pretty good sample size at this point.


His debut fills your criteria.

I think we want to see him given another chance because we're mistified that someone so good can look so poor. Maybe it's him or maybe it's the environment. He's got a nightmare setup at the moment. A great team mate and a car slower than we all expected it to be.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 12:08 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Had read recently Marko said Vandorne is not good enough for F1. Incase they employ Sirotkin, it probably would be not because he's better than Vandoorne but because he has cash at his disposal!

Never thought I'd actually agree with Marko but he's right. I think there are just a lot of people who haven't let go of Vandoorne's feeder series success. That's why his name keeps getting brought up for these seats. I'd much rather put an unknown quantity in the car than Stoff at this point. What has he done in 2 full F1 seasons to warrant a second chance? Name me one impressive performance that he's had? One really special lap in qualy or one gutsy overtake? One weekend where he's brought home a points haul that was unexpected? I ask you to name one of any of these things because I actually cannot.

I know the car has been bad and I know he's got a very tough teammate as a comparison point but it has been nearly 40 races with hardly anything to talk about. I think the two race stretch of Singapore and Malaysia last year was probably the high point of his career (back to back 7th place finishes) and he really benefited a LOT in Singapore from the first lap crash. There just hasn't been anything to be excited about and it's been a pretty good sample size at this point.


Exactly. It's been a big sample size now. Losing to Fernando isn't the end of the world, but Stoff hasn't looked like he belongs in the same category.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:40 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Name me one impressive performance that he's had? One really special lap in qualy or one gutsy overtake? One weekend where he's brought home a points haul that was unexpected? I ask you to name one of any of these things because I actually cannot.

Malaysia 2017 is really the only one. He out-qualified and out-raced Alonso with no luck on his side, and finished P7 while Alonso fought away at the cusp of P10. It was a legitimately impressive performance.

Sadly, it was his only one, so I have to agree there's some risk in giving him a second chance.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:33 am 
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C4. 'I know you can't say, but a little birdy tells me you are in a Williams next year?'
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 9:00 am 
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shoot999 wrote:
C4. 'I know you can't say, but a little birdy tells me you are in a Williams next year?'
George Russell. 'It's looking good.'


Boom! Good news.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:07 pm 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
shoot999 wrote:
C4. 'I know you can't say, but a little birdy tells me you are in a Williams next year?'
George Russell. 'It's looking good.'

Boom! Good news.

:thumbup:

He deserves to be on the grid, so it would be nice to see him there. Although that would sort of close off the last hope Ocon had of staying, so a bit of a mixed return...

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:31 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
shoot999 wrote:
C4. 'I know you can't say, but a little birdy tells me you are in a Williams next year?'
George Russell. 'It's looking good.'

Boom! Good news.

:thumbup:

He deserves to be on the grid, so it would be nice to see him there. Although that would sort of close off the last hope Ocon had of staying, so a bit of a mixed return...


Does it? Still another seat at Williams to go which is probably between Ocon, Sirotkin and Kubica.

Very pleased for Russell!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:22 pm 
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shoot999 wrote:
C4. 'I know you can't say, but a little birdy tells me you are in a Williams next year?'
George Russell. 'It's looking good.'


Correction: 'It was 'looking positive', rather than 'looking good'.


https://f1.channel4.com/video/george-ru ... rmula-one/


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:24 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Exediron wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
shoot999 wrote:
C4. 'I know you can't say, but a little birdy tells me you are in a Williams next year?'
George Russell. 'It's looking good.'

Boom! Good news.

:thumbup:

He deserves to be on the grid, so it would be nice to see him there. Although that would sort of close off the last hope Ocon had of staying, so a bit of a mixed return...


Does it? Still another seat at Williams to go which is probably between Ocon, Sirotkin and Kubica.

Very pleased for Russell!


That’s how I see it. I’m still hoping for an Ocon/Russell lineup


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:30 pm 
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On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 4:15 am 
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Flash2k11 wrote:
On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later


Ocon may have a subdued 2019 but 2020 looks damn promising for him!

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:39 am 
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Flash2k11 wrote:
On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later


I don't understand this at all from Williams' perspective. I mean I understand what they're saying, but if they're worried about having training another team's driver only for him to be moved elsewhere then why are they taking Russell? Sure, he might be at the team for two, or even three seasons, but he's still going to be a Mercedes driver. There is still the prospect that a better seat opens up (at Force India, for instance) and Mercedes are able to move him there as soon as 2020.

It also completely ignores that if Williams are basically conceding one seat goes to a pay driver, why are they not falling over themselves to ensure that they get the best driver they can in their other seat, which would surely be Ocon rather than Russell.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:49 am 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later


I don't understand this at all from Williams' perspective. I mean I understand what they're saying, but if they're worried about having training another team's driver only for him to be moved elsewhere then why are they taking Russell? Sure, he might be at the team for two, or even three seasons, but he's still going to be a Mercedes driver. There is still the prospect that a better seat opens up (at Force India, for instance) and Mercedes are able to move him there as soon as 2020.

It also completely ignores that if Williams are basically conceding one seat goes to a pay driver, why are they not falling over themselves to ensure that they get the best driver they can in their other seat, which would surely be Ocon rather than Russell.


Russell has learning to do & has to gain experience in an F1 car. He's be a Williams' river for 2 or 3 years, apart from Mercedes giving some discount on the engines. Ocon on the other hand, is close to being ready for the Mercedes seat but the earliest he can be there is 2020. Hence, Ocon is a more short term prospect whereas Russell is a long term one.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:02 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later


I don't understand this at all from Williams' perspective. I mean I understand what they're saying, but if they're worried about having training another team's driver only for him to be moved elsewhere then why are they taking Russell? Sure, he might be at the team for two, or even three seasons, but he's still going to be a Mercedes driver. There is still the prospect that a better seat opens up (at Force India, for instance) and Mercedes are able to move him there as soon as 2020.

It also completely ignores that if Williams are basically conceding one seat goes to a pay driver, why are they not falling over themselves to ensure that they get the best driver they can in their other seat, which would surely be Ocon rather than Russell.


Russell has learning to do & has to gain experience in an F1 car. He's be a Williams' river for 2 or 3 years, apart from Mercedes giving some discount on the engines. Ocon on the other hand, is close to being ready for the Mercedes seat but the earliest he can be there is 2020. Hence, Ocon is a more short term prospect whereas Russell is a long term one.


I think you're missing my point, which is that they're both Mercedes' property. Maybe Mercedes are more willing to do a two (or even three) year loan to Williams with George Russell, whereas Ocon would be a one year deal, but ultimately Williams are still training another team's driver.

Also, Ted bringing up Bottas is a little bizarre. Bottas was a Williams young driver, not a Mercedes one, and had multiple years with the team before a bigger team came calling. That's basically a scenario that any smaller team with a good young driver is going to face. If Williams don't want a repeat of that then... what are they going to do? Only sign pay drivers who are never going to be good enough for the big teams?

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:12 pm 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later


I don't understand this at all from Williams' perspective. I mean I understand what they're saying, but if they're worried about having training another team's driver only for him to be moved elsewhere then why are they taking Russell? Sure, he might be at the team for two, or even three seasons, but he's still going to be a Mercedes driver. There is still the prospect that a better seat opens up (at Force India, for instance) and Mercedes are able to move him there as soon as 2020.

It also completely ignores that if Williams are basically conceding one seat goes to a pay driver, why are they not falling over themselves to ensure that they get the best driver they can in their other seat, which would surely be Ocon rather than Russell.


Russell has learning to do & has to gain experience in an F1 car. He's be a Williams' river for 2 or 3 years, apart from Mercedes giving some discount on the engines. Ocon on the other hand, is close to being ready for the Mercedes seat but the earliest he can be there is 2020. Hence, Ocon is a more short term prospect whereas Russell is a long term one.


I think you're missing my point, which is that they're both Mercedes' property. Maybe Mercedes are more willing to do a two (or even three) year loan to Williams with George Russell, whereas Ocon would be a one year deal, but ultimately Williams are still training another team's driver.

Also, Ted bringing up Bottas is a little bizarre. Bottas was a Williams young driver, not a Mercedes one, and had multiple years with the team before a bigger team came calling. That's basically a scenario that any smaller team with a good young driver is going to face. If Williams don't want a repeat of that then... what are they going to do? Only sign pay drivers who are never going to be good enough for the big teams?


Bottas was lucky! The main reason he went to Mercedes was because he was managed by Toto. Williams are the Minardi of the current grid. They need money but can't offer much hope to a driver coming in when it comes to performance or competitiveness. Kubica is still an option but I think Williams need good young drivers to give them a new direction.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:56 pm 
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According to Joe Saward Williams will probably finalise Kubica & Russell. Kubica will be getting a $10 million sponsorship & since he's been their reserve driver, he'll take the 1st seat. Mercedes are really pushing for Russell in the 2nd seat & he'll be there.

As for Force India, Perez & Stroll partnership would be announced in Mexico.

Ocon is poised to become Mercedes' reserve driver for 2019. It's a good turn of event for Ocon.

https://thesportsrush.com/reports-williams-to-have-kubica-russell-lineup-for-2019/

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:18 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
According to Joe Saward Williams will probably finalise Kubica & Russell. Kubica will be getting a $10 million sponsorship & since he's been their reserve driver, he'll take the 1st seat. Mercedes are really pushing for Russell in the 2nd seat & he'll be there.

As for Force India, Perez & Stroll partnership would be announced in Mexico.

Ocon is poised to become Mercedes' reserve driver for 2019. It's a good turn of event for Ocon.

https://thesportsrush.com/reports-williams-to-have-kubica-russell-lineup-for-2019/

Isn't that worst case scenario for Ocon? I had no doubt Mercedes would make him reserve/development/test driver if he had nowhere to go, I don't think it's particularly good news for him.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:51 pm 
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The good news for Ocon is that Williams bafflingly not wanting a quality driver for a short period of time but being happy with Russell shows that the noise there getting from Merc is Ocon will be driving in a silver car in the near future.

That said I still can't understand why Willaims would turn down a driver as good as Ocon even if it was just for a season. Have him now and get Russell next year what have they lost?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:35 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
That said I still can't understand why Willaims would turn down a driver as good as Ocon even if it was just for a season. Have him now and get Russell next year what have they lost?

Probably Russel, since I don't see why he'd sit out a season just to get a Williams seat.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:37 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
The good news for Ocon is that Williams bafflingly not wanting a quality driver for a short period of time but being happy with Russell shows that the noise there getting from Merc is Ocon will be driving in a silver car in the near future.

That said I still can't understand why Willaims would turn down a driver as good as Ocon even if it was just for a season. Have him now and get Russell next year what have they lost?

Yeah with all due respect to Robert Kubica, his time has passed in F1. I'd feel good for him getting the seat if not for Ocon being sidelined. I just think it's a shame for Williams. They could have had a really interesting lineup for next season.

For Ocon, it's looking very likely that he will replace Bottas in 2020. That's how it's all lining up. Bottas has been a good wingman but he hasn't done enough to protect his seat long-term. With Ocon, Mercedes have both a guy who can possibly do an even better job in supporting their title push and a guy who might some day be suitable to be their #1. Personally, I don't see the same magic from Ocon that I have from Max (or even Charles) but he may be a late bloomer.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:16 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
That said I still can't understand why Willaims would turn down a driver as good as Ocon even if it was just for a season. Have him now and get Russell next year what have they lost?

Probably Russel, since I don't see why he'd sit out a season just to get a Williams seat.


If Russell turns out to be good enough to sacrifice Ocon for he'll be off soon enough anyway. He might not have much choice either. A Williams seat next year is better than nothing never.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:43 pm 
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Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
On Ted's Quali notebook he was heavily suggesting the choice for Williams was between Russell and Ocon, and that Russell was being chosen because they didnt want to be effectively training up Ocon only to have him pinched ala Bottas in a years time. Didnt sound great for Bottas tbh, sounded like behind the scenes Ocon is going to be in a Mercedes sooner rather than later


I don't understand this at all from Williams' perspective. I mean I understand what they're saying, but if they're worried about having training another team's driver only for him to be moved elsewhere then why are they taking Russell? Sure, he might be at the team for two, or even three seasons, but he's still going to be a Mercedes driver. There is still the prospect that a better seat opens up (at Force India, for instance) and Mercedes are able to move him there as soon as 2020.

It also completely ignores that if Williams are basically conceding one seat goes to a pay driver, why are they not falling over themselves to ensure that they get the best driver they can in their other seat, which would surely be Ocon rather than Russell.

Are you sure that Ocon is better than Russell?

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:57 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
The good news for Ocon is that Williams bafflingly not wanting a quality driver for a short period of time but being happy with Russell shows that the noise there getting from Merc is Ocon will be driving in a silver car in the near future.

That said I still can't understand why Willaims would turn down a driver as good as Ocon even if it was just for a season. Have him now and get Russell next year what have they lost?

Yeah with all due respect to Robert Kubica, his time has passed in F1. I'd feel good for him getting the seat if not for Ocon being sidelined. I just think it's a shame for Williams. They could have had a really interesting lineup for next season.

For Ocon, it's looking very likely that he will replace Bottas in 2020. That's how it's all lining up. Bottas has been a good wingman but he hasn't done enough to protect his seat long-term. With Ocon, Mercedes have both a guy who can possibly do an even better job in supporting their title push and a guy who might some day be suitable to be their #1. Personally, I don't see the same magic from Ocon that I have from Max (or even Charles) but he may be a late bloomer.


I’m not that enamored with Ocon. He is the same level as Perez imo. I really struggle to envision what explanation Toto Wolff is going to come up with to swap Bottas for Ocon. To me there’s no significant difference there either. Unless he thinks they’ll be running a third car in 2020...


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:58 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
I’m not that enamored with Ocon. He is the same level as Perez imo. I really struggle to envision what explanation Toto Wolff is going to come up with to swap Bottas for Ocon. To me there’s no significant difference there either. Unless he thinks they’ll be running a third car in 2020...

I agree he's at the same level as Perez. But I think there's a sizable chance that Perez is better than Bottas.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:05 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
kleefton wrote:
I’m not that enamored with Ocon. He is the same level as Perez imo. I really struggle to envision what explanation Toto Wolff is going to come up with to swap Bottas for Ocon. To me there’s no significant difference there either. Unless he thinks they’ll be running a third car in 2020...

I agree he's at the same level as Perez. But I think there's a sizable chance that Perez is better than Bottas.


Agree. Also currently Ocon's relative weakness to Perez is in the races, that could improve with experience. Although sitting out next year won't necessarily help that.


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