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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 11:49 pm 
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Lotus49 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Rockie wrote:
What one reads on internet gets ridiculous as time goes on, no wonder the world is getting dumber.

The specs of the system is submitted to the FIA for scrutiny also the FIA has the power to ask for explanation of anything they don't understand.

If they understand it then why the need to fit a secondary sensor?


Because Mercedes just publicly pointed out that the split battery could be abused in this way. If the FIA didn't then slap a sensor on it then Ferrari can just go ahead and do it even if they weren't before obviously.

So basically this has always been unmonitored on the Ferrari because the FIA never fully understood the system in the first place?


Yes there's been no monitoring of that loophole but there's also no suggestion from the FIA that Ferrari understood it could be done either as far as I know.

Because of the recent Sassi (ex Ferrari engine boss) signing to the same team that run it up the pole I can understand why folk would get suspicious though of course but unless they get caught then much like the oil burn situation there's not a lot to be done.

Indeed all you can do is close the loophole.

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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 11:52 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
I don't think you're being particularly honest here. Several posters have taken issue with you claiming the accusations as fact and there have been a number of discussions about it. This thread would probably be less than half as long if you hadn't done so. But if you're backpedalling now and no longer trying to claim it's true then I guess we can move on

The stories are clearly true as Ferrari are under investigation, some of the conclusions however are unproven such as some kind of deal was done with Ferrari.

The only thing that's true is that the FIA is investigating and if that's what you had said initially we wouldn't even be having this conversation. But it's difficult to interpret things like "Well specifically they were using it to cheat in qualifying " as anything other than you making things up I'm afraid. If you didn't do things like that the conversations would go a lot more smoothly

No it didn't make it up this is what was being proposed and I was replying to someone that asked what benefit would Ferrari get from it.

No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference

Because when I read it was said that it was suspected that was what Ferrari were doing.

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2017: 9th Place
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Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 11:54 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
Blake wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
The only thing that's true is that the FIA is investigating and if that's what you had said initially we wouldn't even be having this conversation. But it's difficult to interpret things like "Well specifically they were using it to cheat in qualifying " as anything other than you making things up I'm afraid. If you didn't do things like that the conversations would go a lot more smoothly

No it didn't make it up this is what was being proposed and I was replying to someone that asked what benefit would Ferrari get from it.

No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference


I am sadly coming to the conclusion that he doesn't, Zoue. A fixation on painting Ferrari in the worst possible way, based on what he claims "heard" is the modus operandi it seems. Turn the tables to Merc, and watch the 180 degree about face.

... or put Lewis Hamilton in red? 8)

Blake would have a heart attack. :)

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: Currently 3rd

Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 12:05 am 
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Greenman wrote:
Zoue wrote:


.

I think you're ignoring the "careful" wording in that statement (you only quoted general statements)

So, from the quoted link ;

".... that Ferrari’s system was more complicated than that used by rivals but he now accepted everything was above board...." note the "now" - it does not comment on what it was at Baku.

"..... the duty of the competitor to satisfy the FIA that their car complies at all times and they were having difficulty satisfying us,” he added. “Here, we are now satisfied.” -- AGAIN, the ambiguous "now".

"...... they took some measures to make sure we understood it more and that we were seeing things that we were happy with.” -- only happy AFTER the measures were taken, why ?

I'm sorry, I have no idea as to whether the system was legal in Baku, but neither IT WOULD SEEM do the FIA - they are only saying that the Ferrari system is o.k. now.

.

Yeah I had previously read the transcript, Zoue did decide to leave out certain bits, when I said that the FIA didn't know how the system worked that seemed to be somewhat a laughable thing to say, the main thing going forward is not what Ferrari may have or may not have been doing but that will not be possible now.

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Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 2:38 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Blake wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
No it didn't make it up this is what was being proposed and I was replying to someone that asked what benefit would Ferrari get from it.

No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference


I am sadly coming to the conclusion that he doesn't, Zoue. A fixation on painting Ferrari in the worst possible way, based on what he claims "heard" is the modus operandi it seems. Turn the tables to Merc, and watch the 180 degree about face.

... or put Lewis Hamilton in red? 8)

Blake would have a heart attack. :)


Only if it meant pokerman were a Ferrari fan... they can't afford that!!! Nor could I!

;)

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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 5:08 am 
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Posts: 23910
pokerman wrote:
Greenman wrote:
Zoue wrote:


.

I think you're ignoring the "careful" wording in that statement (you only quoted general statements)

So, from the quoted link ;

".... that Ferrari’s system was more complicated than that used by rivals but he now accepted everything was above board...." note the "now" - it does not comment on what it was at Baku.

"..... the duty of the competitor to satisfy the FIA that their car complies at all times and they were having difficulty satisfying us,” he added. “Here, we are now satisfied.” -- AGAIN, the ambiguous "now".

"...... they took some measures to make sure we understood it more and that we were seeing things that we were happy with.” -- only happy AFTER the measures were taken, why ?

I'm sorry, I have no idea as to whether the system was legal in Baku, but neither IT WOULD SEEM do the FIA - they are only saying that the Ferrari system is o.k. now.

.

Yeah I had previously read the transcript, Zoue did decide to leave out certain bits, when I said that the FIA didn't know how the system worked that seemed to be somewhat a laughable thing to say, the main thing going forward is not what Ferrari may have or may not have been doing but that will not be possible now.

Of course I left out certain bits. Forum rules don't actually allow you to post an entire quote of that length! But nothing in that article paints Ferrari in a bad light in any way

The main thing going forward is that nothing illegal was found. But hey, like I said, this means nothing to the conspiracy theorist


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 5:11 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
The only thing that's true is that the FIA is investigating and if that's what you had said initially we wouldn't even be having this conversation. But it's difficult to interpret things like "Well specifically they were using it to cheat in qualifying " as anything other than you making things up I'm afraid. If you didn't do things like that the conversations would go a lot more smoothly

No it didn't make it up this is what was being proposed and I was replying to someone that asked what benefit would Ferrari get from it.

No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference

Because when I read it was said that it was suspected that was what Ferrari were doing.

this makes no sense. I'm at a bit of a loss why you'd still try to claim you were somehow just quoting, when clearly you were judging with your own words, which has been pointed out to you by multiple people


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 8:14 am 
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From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 8:49 am 
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Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 1:51 pm 
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Blake wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Blake wrote:
Zoue wrote:
No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference


I am sadly coming to the conclusion that he doesn't, Zoue. A fixation on painting Ferrari in the worst possible way, based on what he claims "heard" is the modus operandi it seems. Turn the tables to Merc, and watch the 180 degree about face.

... or put Lewis Hamilton in red? 8)

Blake would have a heart attack. :)


Only if it meant pokerman were a Ferrari fan... they can't afford that!!! Nor could I!

;)

No worries I've never been a fan of teams as such. :)

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2016: 4th Place

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Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 1:53 pm 
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Posts: 28404
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference

Because when I read it was said that it was suspected that was what Ferrari were doing.

this makes no sense. I'm at a bit of a loss why you'd still try to claim you were somehow just quoting, when clearly you were judging with your own words, which has been pointed out to you by multiple people

Because the things I was reading came across as being factual, it's not like I was screaming for Ferrari to be penalised as teams never are retrospectively anyway.

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: Currently 3rd

Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 28404
Zoue wrote:
Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case

The system is basically too clever for the stewards and that's the kind of thing you would do if looking to cheat, not that this has been proven of course.

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: Currently 3rd

Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 6:31 pm 
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Posts: 2018
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Because when I read it was said that it was suspected that was what Ferrari were doing.

this makes no sense. I'm at a bit of a loss why you'd still try to claim you were somehow just quoting, when clearly you were judging with your own words, which has been pointed out to you by multiple people

Because the things I was reading came across as being factual, it's not like I was screaming for Ferrari to be penalised as teams never are retrospectively anyway.


It would probably help these discussions if you posted links to the things you were reading when making these comments.

From the tone of what Whiting has said, there is no real implication Ferrari are cheating. Just that the way they came up with to prove so was too convoluted.

Is the Canada monitoring just a proof of concept for future (2019?) monitoring.

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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 8:33 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 2:04 pm
Posts: 2046
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case

The system is basically too clever for the stewards and that's the kind of thing you would do if looking to cheat, not that this has been proven of course.


Hm, so the system was (a) too complex for the stewarts to police (so far) and (b) had the potential to be used for cheating. So, so far, Ferrari basically could cheat without getting caught. Well, I am very sure they were much too moral for doing this and the complexity plus the ability to cheat is a fully necessary element of the system in question. :lol:

So, let's hope that FIA's/stewarts' new measures and controls are sufficient to prevent any further cheating on this side.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 11:33 pm 
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Posts: 28404
Herb wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:

this makes no sense. I'm at a bit of a loss why you'd still try to claim you were somehow just quoting, when clearly you were judging with your own words, which has been pointed out to you by multiple people

Because the things I was reading came across as being factual, it's not like I was screaming for Ferrari to be penalised as teams never are retrospectively anyway.


It would probably help these discussions if you posted links to the things you were reading when making these comments.

From the tone of what Whiting has said, there is no real implication Ferrari are cheating. Just that the way they came up with to prove so was too convoluted.

Is the Canada monitoring just a proof of concept for future (2019?) monitoring.

I wouldn't know but it's obviously more complicated than some were trying to make out.

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Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


Last edited by pokerman on Mon May 28, 2018 11:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 11:34 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 28404
Paolo_Lasardi wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case

The system is basically too clever for the stewards and that's the kind of thing you would do if looking to cheat, not that this has been proven of course.


Hm, so the system was (a) too complex for the stewarts to police (so far) and (b) had the potential to be used for cheating. So, so far, Ferrari basically could cheat without getting caught. Well, I am very sure they were much too moral for doing this and the complexity plus the ability to cheat is a fully necessary element of the system in question. :lol:

So, let's hope that FIA's/stewarts' new measures and controls are sufficient to prevent any further cheating on this side.

That would be unproven cheating. :)

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: Currently 3rd

Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (6)


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 11:38 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 10:39 am
Posts: 23910
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case

The system is basically too clever for the stewards and that's the kind of thing you would do if looking to cheat, not that this has been proven of course.

So if something is complex your default position is that they intend to cheat? Hilarious! :lol:


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 8:17 am 
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Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 11:31 am
Posts: 6556
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Because when I read it was said that it was suspected that was what Ferrari were doing.

this makes no sense. I'm at a bit of a loss why you'd still try to claim you were somehow just quoting, when clearly you were judging with your own words, which has been pointed out to you by multiple people

Because the things I was reading came across as being factual, it's not like I was screaming for Ferrari to be penalised as teams never are retrospectively anyway.


No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 8:20 am 
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Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 11:31 am
Posts: 6556
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case

The system is basically too clever for the stewards and that's the kind of thing you would do if looking to cheat, not that this has been proven of course.

So if something is complex your default position is that they intend to cheat? Hilarious! :lol:


Also, if teams would look to cheat, then ban the whole car I guess as the possibilities are endless; if people can cheat of a freaking bicycle race, then imagine what they could do with an F1 car.

It is not the way to go forward, guilty until proven innocent...


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 1:26 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Clarky wrote:
From Racefans.net (F1Fanatics)

FIA adding more monitoring to Ferrari’s power unit for next race:

https://www.racefans.net/2018/05/27/fia ... next-race/

Quote:
The FIA says it is satisfied Ferrari’s F1 power unit complies with the rules but confirmed it will add further systems to monitor it more closely from the next race.

Race director Charlie Whiting said the team proved to the FIA their power unit is compliant after monitoring it during practice on Thursday in Monaco. However the method used to check it was complicated and the FIA wants a simpler system in place for the Canadian Grand Prix.

“Their duty is to satisfy us that the car complies,” said Whiting after Sunday’s race. “But they were finding it hard to satisfy us.

“By the time we got to here, looking at data [and] software changes that had been implemented, it [became] clearer exactly where we were and after the first day of running we were then able to say we’re happy and we understand it now.”

Ferrari demonstrated the legality of its design “via a complex routine” Whiting explained. “But we don’t want to have to go through that all the time in order to make sure so we would rather additional measurements were made.”

The FIA will add “additional monitoring for Canada”, he said, and further sensors could be added to improve monitoring next year. “But what we’ll have for Canada will be a better system which will help us get things done much quicker than we had to. It’s taken us a couple of races to get to the bottom of it.”

I must admit some of this make NO sense what so ever.

The way I read that is that the FIA feels that the system has the potential to be abused but they haven’t found evidence that it has been. Or simply that they just don’t understand its complexity so are taking measures just in case

The system is basically too clever for the stewards and that's the kind of thing you would do if looking to cheat, not that this has been proven of course.

So if something is complex your default position is that they intend to cheat? Hilarious! :lol:

It seems it would give them the opportunity to cheat that's why action is being taken by the FIA, it would be naive of them not to be suspicious.

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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 1:27 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Because the things I was reading came across as being factual, it's not like I was screaming for Ferrari to be penalised as teams never are retrospectively anyway.


No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.

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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 1:36 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:

No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Then choose better articles to read as it's not guilty until proven innocent. Or at least it shouldn't be for anyone remotely being fair in an article.

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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 1:56 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Where were the articles?

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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 3:29 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Where were the articles?

I was wondering the same, I have not found any articles that plainly stated that Ferrari were cheating.

I'll be honest though, I wasn't looking at http://www.I-hate-Ferrari.com or anything like that, just a plain google search


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 3:34 pm 
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Blake wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Blake wrote:
Zoue wrote:
No, because then you'd say something like Ferrari may have been using it to cheat in qualifying, but instead you categorically stated they were using it. Please tell me you understand the difference


I am sadly coming to the conclusion that he doesn't, Zoue. A fixation on painting Ferrari in the worst possible way, based on what he claims "heard" is the modus operandi it seems. Turn the tables to Merc, and watch the 180 degree about face.

... or put Lewis Hamilton in red? 8)

Blake would have a heart attack. :)


Only if it meant pokerman were a Ferrari fan... they can't afford that!!! Nor could I!

;)

I think you should mentally prepare yourself. It's probably going to happen eventually.


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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 2:44 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Where were the articles?

I was wondering the same, I have not found any articles that plainly stated that Ferrari were cheating.

I'll be honest though, I wasn't looking at http://www.I-hate-Ferrari.com or anything like that, just a plain google search

I read too many to be saving them but I've found the relevant one, go to 4:30

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5OxyB11XAc

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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 3:14 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Where were the articles?

I was wondering the same, I have not found any articles that plainly stated that Ferrari were cheating.

I'll be honest though, I wasn't looking at http://www.I-hate-Ferrari.com or anything like that, just a plain google search

I read too many to be saving them but I've found the relevant one, go to 4:30

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5OxyB11XAc


I'm sorry, but this is no proof what so ever that they did something. Marc Priestley keeps saying "IF that's true" and also specifically stresses at 6:20 that there are only rumours. He finishes by questioning if the FIA used the "illegal" harvesting as a bargain for the new aero rules and answers "we don't know".

So no, "That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it" is not true for the link you provided.


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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 7:14 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
No, you were just calling them cheaters... Even after the FIA found nothing, you still think that they did it

That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Where were the articles?

I was wondering the same, I have not found any articles that plainly stated that Ferrari were cheating.

I'll be honest though, I wasn't looking at http://www.I-hate-Ferrari.com or anything like that, just a plain google search

I read too many to be saving them but I've found the relevant one, go to 4:30

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5OxyB11XAc

Oh boy. You really aren´t doing your credibility any favours here. Seems to me when someone asks you to back up your "stories" they don´t stand up to scrutiny really that often.

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 7:20 am 
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More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 8:10 am 
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To be fair to the FIA Monaco is a bit of a bogus track as its not much of a power track. Canada on the other hand with that long straight should give a clearer picture.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 8:40 am 
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Yellowbin74 wrote:
More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 9:32 am 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


Ah ok I didn't know that :thumbup:

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 10:54 am 
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stevey wrote:
To be fair to the FIA Monaco is a bit of a bogus track as its not much of a power track. Canada on the other hand with that long straight should give a clearer picture.

Very true, I was thinking the same


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 10:55 am 
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Yellowbin74 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


Ah ok I didn't know that :thumbup:


Plus I get the idea that they have left the sensor there in order to prevent this from happening in the future. As in "now we gave you the idea of how to do it so we have to police it"...


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 11:57 am 
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Covalent wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
pokerman wrote:
That's because articles I read said that they were actually doing it.


Where were the articles?

I was wondering the same, I have not found any articles that plainly stated that Ferrari were cheating.

I'll be honest though, I wasn't looking at http://www.I-hate-Ferrari.com or anything like that, just a plain google search

I read too many to be saving them but I've found the relevant one, go to 4:30

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5OxyB11XAc

Oh boy. You really aren´t doing your credibility any favours here. Seems to me when someone asks you to back up your "stories" they don´t stand up to scrutiny really that often.

Indeed paddock rumours but do you think the truth would ever fully come out in the wash if the rumours were true, interesting that the FIA still have concerns in what is supposed to be such an easy thing to police.

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 12:00 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


Ah ok I didn't know that :thumbup:


Plus I get the idea that they have left the sensor there in order to prevent this from happening in the future. As in "now we gave you the idea of how to do it so we have to police it"...

Or the realisation that before they were not policing it properly because they had no idea how the system worked?

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 12:11 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


Ah ok I didn't know that :thumbup:


Plus I get the idea that they have left the sensor there in order to prevent this from happening in the future. As in "now we gave you the idea of how to do it so we have to police it"...

Or the realisation that before they were not policing it properly because they had no idea how the system worked?


I'm a bit interested why you have made nearly 90 posts in this specific thread?


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 12:20 pm 
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AnRs wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


Ah ok I didn't know that :thumbup:


Plus I get the idea that they have left the sensor there in order to prevent this from happening in the future. As in "now we gave you the idea of how to do it so we have to police it"...

Or the realisation that before they were not policing it properly because they had no idea how the system worked?


I'm a bit interested why you have made nearly 90 posts in this specific thread?

I average 13 posts a day, did you really count?

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 12:33 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
I average 13 posts a day, did you really count?


That means you have spent nearly 9 days in this thread..why? I just felt curious


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:08 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Yellowbin74 wrote:
More scrutiny to follow in Canada it seems, according to PF1 main site.

FIA have gone from "satisfied" to "not satisfied" lol.

Must be a soul destroying job working for the FIA !

It was always planned for Canada too. Charlie said so in the same interview he said that the FIA were satisfied with understanding how the system works.


Ah ok I didn't know that :thumbup:


Plus I get the idea that they have left the sensor there in order to prevent this from happening in the future. As in "now we gave you the idea of how to do it so we have to police it"...

Or the realisation that before they were not policing it properly because they had no idea how the system worked?


Maybe. It doesn't mean that Ferrari were cheating though


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