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Driver(s) of the day was / were:-
1. Lewis Hamilton 11%  11%  [ 17 ]
2. Valtteri Bottas 19%  19%  [ 29 ]
3. Sebastian Vettel 1%  1%  [ 2 ]
4. Kimi Raikkonen 1%  1%  [ 1 ]
5. Daniel Ricciardo 1%  1%  [ 2 ]
6. Max Verstappen 33%  33%  [ 50 ]
7. Sergio Perez 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
8. Esteban Ocon 1%  1%  [ 1 ]
9. Sergey Sirotkin 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
10. Lance Stroll 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
11. Fernando Alonso 1%  1%  [ 2 ]
12. Stoffel Vandoorne 1%  1%  [ 2 ]
13. Pierre Gasly 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
14. Brandon Hartley 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
15. Romain Grosjean 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
16. Kevin Magnussen 5%  5%  [ 7 ]
17. Nico Hulkenberg 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
18. Carlos Sainz 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
19. Marcus Ericsson 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
20. Charles Leclerc 25%  25%  [ 37 ]
Total votes : 150
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:40 pm 
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For me,

Bottas, Verstappen & Leclerc

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:43 pm 
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Verstappen, Leclerc, Magnussen


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:43 pm 
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Verstappen and Leclerc for me


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:45 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
For me,

Bottas, Verstappen & Leclerc


Yup, no question, these three.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:15 pm 
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Leclerc for me.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:23 pm 
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Hamilton for that overtake on Vettel.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:24 pm 
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Ricciardo did a great job actually with a dinged up front wing. Verstappen, Bottas.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:26 pm 
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Verstappen and Leclerc for me. Those two drove at a level higher than anyone else in my opinion. I do struggle to understand why Verstappen couldn't make inroads in the second stint though. Leclerc was phenomenal, some good overtakes, blistering pace and a best of the rest result. The gap he had to the rest of the field considering his equipment was mind boggling as well. He actually did not get lapped either, which is so impressive when you are in a midfield car.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:28 pm 
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Verstappen it's just a racing beast.
Too bad that the first 3 teams performance being so established he can't do much to gain more places above P5.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:38 pm 
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Verstappen (great start and faultless racecraft), Leclerc (very solid and fast), Hamilton (Crushing move on Vettel).


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:01 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
Verstappen and Leclerc for me. Those two drove at a level higher than anyone else in my opinion. I do struggle to understand why Verstappen couldn't make inroads in the second stint though. Leclerc was phenomenal, some good overtakes, blistering pace and a best of the rest result. The gap he had to the rest of the field considering his equipment was mind boggling as well. He actually did not get lapped either, which is so impressive when you are in a midfield car.


Sauber are now in the same bracket as Renault, Haas & Force India.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:01 pm 
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Llotyhy wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
For me,

Bottas, Verstappen & Leclerc


Yup, no question, these three.


:thumbup:

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:12 pm 
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Leclerc for me. Ferrari must be very happy with him today


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:21 pm 
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After a string of messy and awkward races that were often no fault of his own, this was a fantastic result for Leclerc. It puts to bed any silly ideas about him being overrated.

What was most impressive was the turnaround after an awful first few practice sessions. That adaptability bodes well for the future. That race critical pass on K-Mag was well judged too.

So much for Renault's qualifying masterstroke. They were atrocious today.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:52 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Verstappen and Leclerc for me. Those two drove at a level higher than anyone else in my opinion. I do struggle to understand why Verstappen couldn't make inroads in the second stint though. Leclerc was phenomenal, some good overtakes, blistering pace and a best of the rest result. The gap he had to the rest of the field considering his equipment was mind boggling as well. He actually did not get lapped either, which is so impressive when you are in a midfield car.


Sauber are now in the same bracket as Renault, Haas & Force India.


Yes.

Actually, the Points FI looked to be the quickest car among them in Sochi but for once they were outperformed driverwise by Leclerc and Magnussen.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:55 pm 
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Hamilton is getting a few too many votes IMO. He had an overtake on Vettel. But I think that only happened because the pit stops that dropped him behind allowed him to get close enough. As was the case with Bottas, he couldn't get close enough unless Bottas had made a mistake. The rest of his race really wasn't impressive so I don't know what warrants him any votes. He didn't manage to get past Bottas at the start which many predicted. I think their pace was pretty similar. Bottas didn't drop back once Hamilton got past and did the fastest lap. Bottas's race wasn't exactly thrilling, but he did very well to keep the lead into the first corner and would have won the race without team orders. I think Verstappen is the standout followed by Bottas and Leclerc.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 3:03 pm 
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Ricciardo, Leclerc & Magnusson get my votes

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 3:04 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Hamilton is getting a few too many votes IMO. He had an overtake on Vettel. But I think that only happened because the pit stops that dropped him behind allowed him to get close enough. As was the case with Bottas, he couldn't get close enough unless Bottas had made a mistake. The rest of his race really wasn't impressive so I don't know what warrants him any votes. He didn't manage to get past Bottas at the start which many predicted. I think their pace was pretty similar. Bottas didn't drop back once Hamilton got past and did the fastest lap. Bottas's race wasn't exactly thrilling, but he did very well to keep the lead into the first corner and would have won the race without team orders. I think Verstappen is the standout followed by Bottas and Leclerc.


Hamilton did no worse than Bottas and showed brilliant racing instinct vs Vettel. I also got the impression he had a touch more pace than Bottas overall regardless of fastest laps. So if Ham is getting too many votes, then Bottas is getting too many votes... and currently Bottas has a lot more votes than Ham. Several of them are probably sympathy votes or something given he was solid and didn't do anything outstanding.


Last edited by Invade on Sun Sep 30, 2018 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 3:04 pm 
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Paolo_Lasardi wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Verstappen and Leclerc for me. Those two drove at a level higher than anyone else in my opinion. I do struggle to understand why Verstappen couldn't make inroads in the second stint though. Leclerc was phenomenal, some good overtakes, blistering pace and a best of the rest result. The gap he had to the rest of the field considering his equipment was mind boggling as well. He actually did not get lapped either, which is so impressive when you are in a midfield car.


Sauber are now in the same bracket as Renault, Haas & Force India.


Yes.

Actually, the Points FI looked to be the quickest car among them in Sochi but for once they were outperformed driverwise by Leclerc and Magnussen.


FI did have pace. It's the nature of this track that prevented FI cars to get past Magnussen. Any car that got within 1 second of the car ahead, lost performance. I was following live timing carefully. FI cars were able to close in on Magnussen in the 1st 2 sectors but in the 3rd sector which is more downforce centric, FI cars would slip back enough not to be in DRS zone of Magnussen.

Leclerc drove well no doubt but it also highlights the point where a car running in clean air will have the maximum performance. Hulk too who was running by himself was putting good laps but after his pitstop, he got behind FI cars & lost performance. Leclerc was putting fast laps consistently just like how Perez was doing in Singapore as he was racing by himself. Once when he pitted & rejoined behind Sirotkin, he simply couldn't overtake.

I hope next year's simpler front wing solution makes a difference to racing to aid more closer racing.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:58 pm 
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Verstappen, he had genuine front-running pace on the soft tyres. For a while I actually thought he might be in with a shot of victory, with a late change to fresh hypersofts I could see him making a few seconds up per lap. I'm not sure why the team didn't use them, and also why their pace disappeared on the ultras.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:03 pm 
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Verstappen, Bottas, Leclerc in particular order.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 7:11 pm 
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UnlikeUday wrote:
Paolo_Lasardi wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Verstappen and Leclerc for me. Those two drove at a level higher than anyone else in my opinion. I do struggle to understand why Verstappen couldn't make inroads in the second stint though. Leclerc was phenomenal, some good overtakes, blistering pace and a best of the rest result. The gap he had to the rest of the field considering his equipment was mind boggling as well. He actually did not get lapped either, which is so impressive when you are in a midfield car.


Sauber are now in the same bracket as Renault, Haas & Force India.


Yes.

Actually, the Points FI looked to be the quickest car among them in Sochi but for once they were outperformed driverwise by Leclerc and Magnussen.


FI did have pace. It's the nature of this track that prevented FI cars to get past Magnussen. Any car that got within 1 second of the car ahead, lost performance. I was following live timing carefully. FI cars were able to close in on Magnussen in the 1st 2 sectors but in the 3rd sector which is more downforce centric, FI cars would slip back enough not to be in DRS zone of Magnussen.

Leclerc drove well no doubt but it also highlights the point where a car running in clean air will have the maximum performance. Hulk too who was running by himself was putting good laps but after his pitstop, he got behind FI cars & lost performance. Leclerc was putting fast laps consistently just like how Perez was doing in Singapore as he was racing by himself. Once when he pitted & rejoined behind Sirotkin, he simply couldn't overtake.

I hope next year's simpler front wing solution makes a difference to racing to aid more closer racing.


Leclerc actually overtook Magnussen.

And both Magnussen and Leclerc outperformed the FI drivers in qualifying.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 7:21 pm 
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Hamilton for the overtake on Vettel.
Valtteri for what should have been a victory.
Max for a great (and clean) drive from the back.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:11 pm 
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Bottas no doubt.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:46 pm 
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Invade wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Hamilton is getting a few too many votes IMO. He had an overtake on Vettel. But I think that only happened because the pit stops that dropped him behind allowed him to get close enough. As was the case with Bottas, he couldn't get close enough unless Bottas had made a mistake. The rest of his race really wasn't impressive so I don't know what warrants him any votes. He didn't manage to get past Bottas at the start which many predicted. I think their pace was pretty similar. Bottas didn't drop back once Hamilton got past and did the fastest lap. Bottas's race wasn't exactly thrilling, but he did very well to keep the lead into the first corner and would have won the race without team orders. I think Verstappen is the standout followed by Bottas and Leclerc.


Hamilton did no worse than Bottas and showed brilliant racing instinct vs Vettel. I also got the impression he had a touch more pace than Bottas overall regardless of fastest laps. So if Ham is getting too many votes, then Bottas is getting too many votes... and currently Bottas has a lot more votes than Ham. Several of them are probably sympathy votes or something given he was solid and didn't do anything outstanding.


He was definitely holding up Hamilton in the first stint and for some of the second stint. Which is why I ultimately didn’t vote for him. Had he been 2-3 sec up the road I doubt Merc would have issued the order.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:49 pm 
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Verstappen and Leclerc were the two standouts.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:03 pm 
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Leclerc and Verstappen were the obvious two for me. I decided not to vote for a third this time around, as I didn't feel there was a third clear choice.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:07 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
Invade wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Hamilton is getting a few too many votes IMO. He had an overtake on Vettel. But I think that only happened because the pit stops that dropped him behind allowed him to get close enough. As was the case with Bottas, he couldn't get close enough unless Bottas had made a mistake. The rest of his race really wasn't impressive so I don't know what warrants him any votes. He didn't manage to get past Bottas at the start which many predicted. I think their pace was pretty similar. Bottas didn't drop back once Hamilton got past and did the fastest lap. Bottas's race wasn't exactly thrilling, but he did very well to keep the lead into the first corner and would have won the race without team orders. I think Verstappen is the standout followed by Bottas and Leclerc.


Hamilton did no worse than Bottas and showed brilliant racing instinct vs Vettel. I also got the impression he had a touch more pace than Bottas overall regardless of fastest laps. So if Ham is getting too many votes, then Bottas is getting too many votes... and currently Bottas has a lot more votes than Ham. Several of them are probably sympathy votes or something given he was solid and didn't do anything outstanding.


He was definitely holding up Hamilton in the first stint and for some of the second stint. Which is why I ultimately didn’t vote for him. Had he been 2-3 sec up the road I doubt Merc would have issued the order.


How can you conclude this? Hamilton virtually always fell out of DRS range in the final sector. and Bottas was usually faster in the middle sector. You could actually see in the first few laps, Bottas did build a decent gap to Hamilton which made it difficult for Hamilton to challenge him much. To me, just because he just couldn't get close enough. I don't know what evidence there actually is to conclude Hamilton was faster. Once Bottas let him through the gap remained consistent. Admittedly the gap was bigger, but the gap increased and decreased but was always between 1.5 and 2.5. Because we don't know, I'm not going to say Bottas was faster than Hamilton overall either at the final stage. But there isn't anything to prove Hamilton was quicker in the first stint. I thought ther were overall very even, but overall Bottas had the better weekend due to qualifying. I just can't understand how you can say he was definitely holding up Hamilton. If this was the case, Hamilton will have been on the radio as it was a safe time for Bottas to let him past as the Ferrari's had dropped back. The team almost certainly will have done something if they believed Hamilton was being held up as they had an easy way of letting Hamilton through then.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 10:35 pm 
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Verstappen, Bottas and Stoffel for his opportunistic pass. I can't understand those votes for Hamilton.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 10:41 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
Verstappen, Bottas and Stoffel for his opportunistic pass. I can't understand those votes for Hamilton.


Of course you can, Fiki. Be it Lewis or Seb, there are some who can always find "justification" in their mind to vote them as DoD.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 11:19 pm 
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The complaints make no sense given that Bottas didn't do any better than Hamilton in the race. I suppose the argument could be that Hamilton only held onto 2nd place because of Mercedes teamwork with Vettel having the better start, but after that Hamilton's pace was no worse and he was the one who produced an inspired burst of racing for an overtake. Maybe Bottas could and would have done the same, though I'm doubtful. So there's nothing confusing at all about voting for Hamilton over Bottas.

Bottas was better for the weekend because his work netted him what should have been race P1 and Ham P2, but the vote is for driver of the day.

Maybe this is a sentimental thing such as how Fiki (IIRC) was glad that Kimi got the vote for DOTD over Hamilton in Monza, but Hamilton was plainly superior. That example is way more obvious.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 2:06 am 
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Of course, :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 2:31 am 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Invade wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Hamilton is getting a few too many votes IMO. He had an overtake on Vettel. But I think that only happened because the pit stops that dropped him behind allowed him to get close enough. As was the case with Bottas, he couldn't get close enough unless Bottas had made a mistake. The rest of his race really wasn't impressive so I don't know what warrants him any votes. He didn't manage to get past Bottas at the start which many predicted. I think their pace was pretty similar. Bottas didn't drop back once Hamilton got past and did the fastest lap. Bottas's race wasn't exactly thrilling, but he did very well to keep the lead into the first corner and would have won the race without team orders. I think Verstappen is the standout followed by Bottas and Leclerc.


Hamilton did no worse than Bottas and showed brilliant racing instinct vs Vettel. I also got the impression he had a touch more pace than Bottas overall regardless of fastest laps. So if Ham is getting too many votes, then Bottas is getting too many votes... and currently Bottas has a lot more votes than Ham. Several of them are probably sympathy votes or something given he was solid and didn't do anything outstanding.


He was definitely holding up Hamilton in the first stint and for some of the second stint. Which is why I ultimately didn’t vote for him. Had he been 2-3 sec up the road I doubt Merc would have issued the order.


How can you conclude this? Hamilton virtually always fell out of DRS range in the final sector. and Bottas was usually faster in the middle sector. You could actually see in the first few laps, Bottas did build a decent gap to Hamilton which made it difficult for Hamilton to challenge him much. To me, just because he just couldn't get close enough. I don't know what evidence there actually is to conclude Hamilton was faster. Once Bottas let him through the gap remained consistent. Admittedly the gap was bigger, but the gap increased and decreased but was always between 1.5 and 2.5. Because we don't know, I'm not going to say Bottas was faster than Hamilton overall either at the final stage. But there isn't anything to prove Hamilton was quicker in the first stint. I thought ther were overall very even, but overall Bottas had the better weekend due to qualifying. I just can't understand how you can say he was definitely holding up Hamilton. If this was the case, Hamilton will have been on the radio as it was a safe time for Bottas to let him past as the Ferrari's had dropped back. The team almost certainly will have done something if they believed Hamilton was being held up as they had an easy way of letting Hamilton through then.


I concluded that because that is what I saw. In fact, if you actually were watching this race, you could see that a team order was imminent, because Lewis was hounding him all race and Vettel was closing in. And I guess you missed it, but Lewis did come on the radio and say that Bottas needed to speed up. Also, if he was fast enough he shouldn't let Hamilton get into DRS range at all. No way anyone lets the car behind get within DRS range if they have the pace. Too risky. The fact Lewis fell off is likely due to how hard it is to keep up in the dirty air, and also the need to preserve/cool the car. But whenever he fell off, he would always come back and close right back up. Why couldn't Bottas maintain a safe 2+ sec gap? Even after Hamilton passed Vettel, there was a 2.3sec gap to Bottas, but Lewis closed it quickly down to 0.6, and then he backed off and the team order came. So to me, it was obvious who was faster during this race.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 2:59 am 
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Paolo_Lasardi wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
Paolo_Lasardi wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Verstappen and Leclerc for me. Those two drove at a level higher than anyone else in my opinion. I do struggle to understand why Verstappen couldn't make inroads in the second stint though. Leclerc was phenomenal, some good overtakes, blistering pace and a best of the rest result. The gap he had to the rest of the field considering his equipment was mind boggling as well. He actually did not get lapped either, which is so impressive when you are in a midfield car.


Sauber are now in the same bracket as Renault, Haas & Force India.


Yes.

Actually, the Points FI looked to be the quickest car among them in Sochi but for once they were outperformed driverwise by Leclerc and Magnussen.


FI did have pace. It's the nature of this track that prevented FI cars to get past Magnussen. Any car that got within 1 second of the car ahead, lost performance. I was following live timing carefully. FI cars were able to close in on Magnussen in the 1st 2 sectors but in the 3rd sector which is more downforce centric, FI cars would slip back enough not to be in DRS zone of Magnussen.

Leclerc drove well no doubt but it also highlights the point where a car running in clean air will have the maximum performance. Hulk too who was running by himself was putting good laps but after his pitstop, he got behind FI cars & lost performance. Leclerc was putting fast laps consistently just like how Perez was doing in Singapore as he was racing by himself. Once when he pitted & rejoined behind Sirotkin, he simply couldn't overtake.

I hope next year's simpler front wing solution makes a difference to racing to aid more closer racing.


Leclerc actually overtook Magnussen.

And both Magnussen and Leclerc outperformed the FI drivers in qualifying.


When did Leclerc overtake Magnussen?????? Leclerc got a better exit at turn 1 & since he was on fresh tyres, he was able to overtake. No doubt, he had the best midfield car today but after the 1st lap & apart from Red Bulls, didn't see much overtakes happening. Last year even, I read somewhere there was just 1 overtake.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 4:06 am 
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Unlikeuday,

It would appear that you answered your own question in your first sentence.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:31 am 
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kleefton wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Invade wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Hamilton is getting a few too many votes IMO. He had an overtake on Vettel. But I think that only happened because the pit stops that dropped him behind allowed him to get close enough. As was the case with Bottas, he couldn't get close enough unless Bottas had made a mistake. The rest of his race really wasn't impressive so I don't know what warrants him any votes. He didn't manage to get past Bottas at the start which many predicted. I think their pace was pretty similar. Bottas didn't drop back once Hamilton got past and did the fastest lap. Bottas's race wasn't exactly thrilling, but he did very well to keep the lead into the first corner and would have won the race without team orders. I think Verstappen is the standout followed by Bottas and Leclerc.


Hamilton did no worse than Bottas and showed brilliant racing instinct vs Vettel. I also got the impression he had a touch more pace than Bottas overall regardless of fastest laps. So if Ham is getting too many votes, then Bottas is getting too many votes... and currently Bottas has a lot more votes than Ham. Several of them are probably sympathy votes or something given he was solid and didn't do anything outstanding.


He was definitely holding up Hamilton in the first stint and for some of the second stint. Which is why I ultimately didn’t vote for him. Had he been 2-3 sec up the road I doubt Merc would have issued the order.


How can you conclude this? Hamilton virtually always fell out of DRS range in the final sector. and Bottas was usually faster in the middle sector. You could actually see in the first few laps, Bottas did build a decent gap to Hamilton which made it difficult for Hamilton to challenge him much. To me, just because he just couldn't get close enough. I don't know what evidence there actually is to conclude Hamilton was faster. Once Bottas let him through the gap remained consistent. Admittedly the gap was bigger, but the gap increased and decreased but was always between 1.5 and 2.5. Because we don't know, I'm not going to say Bottas was faster than Hamilton overall either at the final stage. But there isn't anything to prove Hamilton was quicker in the first stint. I thought ther were overall very even, but overall Bottas had the better weekend due to qualifying. I just can't understand how you can say he was definitely holding up Hamilton. If this was the case, Hamilton will have been on the radio as it was a safe time for Bottas to let him past as the Ferrari's had dropped back. The team almost certainly will have done something if they believed Hamilton was being held up as they had an easy way of letting Hamilton through then.


I concluded that because that is what I saw. In fact, if you actually were watching this race, you could see that a team order was imminent, because Lewis was hounding him all race and Vettel was closing in. And I guess you missed it, but Lewis did come on the radio and say that Bottas needed to speed up. Also, if he was fast enough he shouldn't let Hamilton get into DRS range at all. No way anyone lets the car behind get within DRS range if they have the pace. Too risky. The fact Lewis fell off is likely due to how hard it is to keep up in the dirty air, and also the need to preserve/cool the car. But whenever he fell off, he would always come back and close right back up. Why couldn't Bottas maintain a safe 2+ sec gap? Even after Hamilton passed Vettel, there was a 2.3sec gap to Bottas, but Lewis closed it quickly down to 0.6, and then he backed off and the team order came. So to me, it was obvious who was faster during this race.


From what I heard, Bottas was trying to hold Vettel up to allow Hamilton to pass him. Sky and Channel 4 seemed to indicate this was possible. Bottas later said after he let Hamilton through that he could have gone faster. I'm still not sure if Bottas was actually trying his hardest throughout the whole race. Also, I don't think Hamilton's message about speeding up was broadcast during the race. I only heard him mention he said that afterwards. I can possibly agree that Hamilton looked quicker in the 2nd stint initially, but I still don't know about the first. The average time seemed to be 1.3 seconds (at least with the in race graphics) and it was rare he was within DRS. If there was obviously quite some difference, Hamilton will have been able to get within DRS and get past him.

I think from what we heard Bottas say, we hear about as much evidence he could have gone faster as Hamilton. I still think they were pretty much equal overall. As when Hamilton got past, the gap remained consistent as it did when he was behind. And he wasn't as close as a much quicker driver should be IMO in the first stint. It could be possible that he was quicker, yes, but in the first stint, Bottas could have done exactly the same thing behind Hamilton. From what evidence we have, in the first stint I'm going to say they were probably equal too.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 7:03 am 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
kleefton wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
kleefton wrote:
Invade wrote:

Hamilton did no worse than Bottas and showed brilliant racing instinct vs Vettel. I also got the impression he had a touch more pace than Bottas overall regardless of fastest laps. So if Ham is getting too many votes, then Bottas is getting too many votes... and currently Bottas has a lot more votes than Ham. Several of them are probably sympathy votes or something given he was solid and didn't do anything outstanding.


He was definitely holding up Hamilton in the first stint and for some of the second stint. Which is why I ultimately didn’t vote for him. Had he been 2-3 sec up the road I doubt Merc would have issued the order.


How can you conclude this? Hamilton virtually always fell out of DRS range in the final sector. and Bottas was usually faster in the middle sector. You could actually see in the first few laps, Bottas did build a decent gap to Hamilton which made it difficult for Hamilton to challenge him much. To me, just because he just couldn't get close enough. I don't know what evidence there actually is to conclude Hamilton was faster. Once Bottas let him through the gap remained consistent. Admittedly the gap was bigger, but the gap increased and decreased but was always between 1.5 and 2.5. Because we don't know, I'm not going to say Bottas was faster than Hamilton overall either at the final stage. But there isn't anything to prove Hamilton was quicker in the first stint. I thought ther were overall very even, but overall Bottas had the better weekend due to qualifying. I just can't understand how you can say he was definitely holding up Hamilton. If this was the case, Hamilton will have been on the radio as it was a safe time for Bottas to let him past as the Ferrari's had dropped back. The team almost certainly will have done something if they believed Hamilton was being held up as they had an easy way of letting Hamilton through then.


I concluded that because that is what I saw. In fact, if you actually were watching this race, you could see that a team order was imminent, because Lewis was hounding him all race and Vettel was closing in. And I guess you missed it, but Lewis did come on the radio and say that Bottas needed to speed up. Also, if he was fast enough he shouldn't let Hamilton get into DRS range at all. No way anyone lets the car behind get within DRS range if they have the pace. Too risky. The fact Lewis fell off is likely due to how hard it is to keep up in the dirty air, and also the need to preserve/cool the car. But whenever he fell off, he would always come back and close right back up. Why couldn't Bottas maintain a safe 2+ sec gap? Even after Hamilton passed Vettel, there was a 2.3sec gap to Bottas, but Lewis closed it quickly down to 0.6, and then he backed off and the team order came. So to me, it was obvious who was faster during this race.


From what I heard, Bottas was trying to hold Vettel up to allow Hamilton to pass him. Sky and Channel 4 seemed to indicate this was possible. Bottas later said after he let Hamilton through that he could have gone faster. I'm still not sure if Bottas was actually trying his hardest throughout the whole race. Also, I don't think Hamilton's message about speeding up was broadcast during the race. I only heard him mention he said that afterwards. I can possibly agree that Hamilton looked quicker in the 2nd stint initially, but I still don't know about the first. The average time seemed to be 1.3 seconds (at least with the in race graphics) and it was rare he was within DRS. If there was obviously quite some difference, Hamilton will have been able to get within DRS and get past him.

I think from what we heard Bottas say, we hear about as much evidence he could have gone faster as Hamilton. I still think they were pretty much equal overall. As when Hamilton got past, the gap remained consistent as it did when he was behind. And he wasn't as close as a much quicker driver should be IMO in the first stint. It could be possible that he was quicker, yes, but in the first stint, Bottas could have done exactly the same thing behind Hamilton. From what evidence we have, in the first stint I'm going to say they were probably equal too.

yeah Hamilton didn't pull away after Bottas let him by, which he would have done if he felt they were going too slow. It's more likely both Mercs were just pacing themselves and going at a comfortable pace to save tyres or other components, like in Singapore. Towards the end of the race they both started pulling out lap records out of nowhere, when neither was under threat, which shows they weren't exactly pushing themselves before


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:33 am 
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Remmirath wrote:
Leclerc and Verstappen were the obvious two for me. I decided not to vote for a third this time around, as I didn't feel there was a third clear choice.

Same here


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 7:09 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Fiki wrote:
Verstappen, Bottas and Stoffel for his opportunistic pass. I can't understand those votes for Hamilton.


Of course you can, Fiki. Be it Lewis or Seb, there are some who can always find "justification" in their mind to vote them as DoD.

I don't see a problem with people voting for Hamilton, although I didn't do so personally. He had good pace and put in an excellent overtake on Vettel after pressuring him into a mistake. I don't see how his race can be considered any worse than Bottas' when he shadowed him for the entire race before the team orders came into play. That a team order in his favour should automatically mean that Hamilton's race was unspectacular is what I struggle to understand.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 10:28 am 
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Blake wrote:
Fiki wrote:
Verstappen, Bottas and Stoffel for his opportunistic pass. I can't understand those votes for Hamilton.


Of course you can, Fiki. Be it Lewis or Seb, there are some who can always find "justification" in their mind to vote them as DoD.
Perhaps they misread it for "diver" of the day? But he pulled out of his attempt. :?

Didn't Max dive better anyway?

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