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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 6:55 am 
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I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 6:58 am 
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WDC 2019 :D 8) :o

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:16 am 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

+1
I was thinking exactly the same after yesterday's race. It's good to know there could be strong talent still emerging


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:23 am 
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Zoue wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

+1
I was thinking exactly the same after yesterday's race. It's good to know there could be strong talent still emerging

I can't wait to see the Leclerc vs. Verstappen rivalry. Could be legendary. 8)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:25 am 
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Leclerc does appear to be a part of a potentially strong generation. It's early days but there are promising signs also from Lando Norris and even George Russell.

We know Max is very quick, and Leclerc might be a match.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:38 pm 
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Charles is one of the nicest guys in sport I can think of right now, but he isn't just nice and plain but also quite an interesting character. I think it's going to be tremendous fun to watch him develop as a racer and a top sportsman this year. I'm not a Ferrari fan but Leclerc easily overrides that moderate distaste.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:54 pm 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

Someone always emerges


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:56 pm 
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mas wrote:
Based on the fact that Hamilton hit his fastest lap of 1:33.528 on lap 36 and Leclerc hit his fastest lap of 1:33.411 on lap 38 with a lighter car with both fastest laps two laps after the last pitstop for mediums.

http://en.mclarenf-1.com/index.php?page ... %20Leclerc

Hamilton was in DRS range of Vettel.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:57 pm 
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jimmyj wrote:
Pretty impressive to be comparing Hammy and Charles already. I really like Leclerc, my new favourite driver.

Yeah he's easily likeable.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:58 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
kleefton wrote:
mas wrote:
Based on the fact that Hamilton hit his fastest lap of 1:33.528 on lap 36 and Leclerc hit his fastest lap of 1:33.411 on lap 38 with a lighter car with both fastest laps two laps after the last pitstop for mediums.

http://en.mclarenf-1.com/index.php?page ... %20Leclerc


Ferrari still had a straight line speed advantage though. It's harder to pass cars that are quicker in a straight line. And there was no collision with Lewis's pass. He completed the maneuver cleanly. He was actually already past and then Vettel spun in an attempt to launch a futile counter attack.

:thumbup: :nod:

Even Seb blamed himself for the spin.

Vettel always seems to be quite honest with such things.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:02 pm 
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froze wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

+1
I was thinking exactly the same after yesterday's race. It's good to know there could be strong talent still emerging

I can't wait to see the Leclerc vs. Verstappen rivalry. Could be legendary. 8)

I wonder what Verstappen must be thinking now with his decision to stay with Red Bull?

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Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:12 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
froze wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

+1
I was thinking exactly the same after yesterday's race. It's good to know there could be strong talent still emerging

I can't wait to see the Leclerc vs. Verstappen rivalry. Could be legendary. 8)

I wonder what Verstappen must be thinking now with his decision to stay with Red Bull?

Did Verstappen not get an offer from Mercedes for 2019?

He should have taken it tbh. I don’t think Red Bull will be WDC contenders until 2021, which will be his seventh season in F1.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:14 pm 
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KingVoid wrote:
pokerman wrote:
froze wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

+1
I was thinking exactly the same after yesterday's race. It's good to know there could be strong talent still emerging

I can't wait to see the Leclerc vs. Verstappen rivalry. Could be legendary. 8)

I wonder what Verstappen must be thinking now with his decision to stay with Red Bull?

Did Verstappen not get an offer from Mercedes for 2019?

He should have taken it tbh. I don’t think Red Bull will be WDC contenders until 2021, which will be his seventh season in F1.

It probably was 2019?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 7:28 pm 
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Where do you guys reckon Leclerc will win his first races?

My picks are ESP and CAN, for two wins in the first 10 races of the season.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:45 pm 
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Invade wrote:
Where do you guys reckon Leclerc will win his first races?

My picks are ESP and CAN, for two wins in the first 10 races of the season.

Baku


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:17 pm 
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Invade wrote:
Where do you guys reckon Leclerc will win his first races?

My picks are ESP and CAN, for two wins in the first 10 races of the season.

China or Baku. I don't think he'll wait long.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 12:59 am 
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In F2, Leclerc took pole in Baku, won the feature race, and then won the sprint race from 8th (reverse grid). Last year he finished 6th in his Sauber.

I know that’s not a big sample size, but still.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:40 pm 
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KingVoid wrote:
pokerman wrote:
froze wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I was concerned that after Hamilton and Vettel's generation retired, Verstappen was going to find himself in a talent vacuum similar to Schumacher after Senna died. Leclerc's performance this weekend shows he has at least one peer, for raw speed/natural talent.

+1
I was thinking exactly the same after yesterday's race. It's good to know there could be strong talent still emerging

I can't wait to see the Leclerc vs. Verstappen rivalry. Could be legendary. 8)

I wonder what Verstappen must be thinking now with his decision to stay with Red Bull?

Did Verstappen not get an offer from Mercedes for 2019?

He should have taken it tbh. I don’t think Red Bull will be WDC contenders until 2021, which will be his seventh season in F1.


Even so, Verstappen will still be very young so he has plenty of time, although he will need to win a championship fairly soon if he wants to get 8+ WDC's by the end of his career.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:44 pm 
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As the Canadian Grand Prix thread is locked did anyone notice that Ferrari forgot to tell Leclerc about Vettel's 5 second penalty ??


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:39 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
As the Canadian Grand Prix thread is locked did anyone notice that Ferrari forgot to tell Leclerc about Vettel's 5 second penalty ??

Man I wish they hadn't, Vettel's board swapping would have been even funnier.

I doubt they forgot though they were probably just hoping he wouldn't get within 5 seconds so as to not rub salt in Vettel's wound.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:58 pm 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
As the Canadian Grand Prix thread is locked did anyone notice that Ferrari forgot to tell Leclerc about Vettel's 5 second penalty ??

Man I wish they hadn't, Vettel's board swapping would have been even funnier.

I doubt they forgot though they were probably just hoping he wouldn't get within 5 seconds so as to not rub salt in Vettel's wound.

They actually told Leclerc to pit for fastest lap but he refused, he had good pace and felt he was slowly catching the leaders and didn't want to give up on that.

It's kind of strange that they forgot to tell him about the 5 second penalty but had the presence of mind for him to try for fastest lap, of course if he had done that then Vettel would have had no threat from Leclerc closing within Vettel's penalty window, maybe just coincidence?

As for his strategy seemed a bit rubbish again gambling on a 5 lap SC window which when it didn't happen saw him pit and lose a position to Verstappen although he did quickly get past but left him 10 seconds behind Hamilton when previously he had only been 2 seconds behind.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:24 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
As the Canadian Grand Prix thread is locked did anyone notice that Ferrari forgot to tell Leclerc about Vettel's 5 second penalty ??

Man I wish they hadn't, Vettel's board swapping would have been even funnier.

I doubt they forgot though they were probably just hoping he wouldn't get within 5 seconds so as to not rub salt in Vettel's wound.

They actually told Leclerc to pit for fastest lap but he refused, he had good pace and felt he was slowly catching the leaders and didn't want to give up on that.

It's kind of strange that they forgot to tell him about the 5 second penalty but had the presence of mind for him to try for fastest lap, of course if he had done that then Vettel would have had no threat from Leclerc closing within Vettel's penalty window, maybe just coincidence?

As for his strategy seemed a bit rubbish again gambling on a 5 lap SC window which when it didn't happen saw him pit and lose a position to Verstappen although he did quickly get past but left him 10 seconds behind Hamilton when previously he had only been 2 seconds behind.


I don't think they forgot to tell him. It was deliberate. It is time we acknowledge that this is still Vettel's team. Leclerc gets the inferior strategy all the time, he is told to hold station when he is faster, and he was royally screwed in Monaco during qualifying simply because they did not care enough for him to advance. Ferrari want Vettel to be the man. I think that much should be clear for everyone to see by now. We may not agree with it, but it is what it is.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:32 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
As the Canadian Grand Prix thread is locked did anyone notice that Ferrari forgot to tell Leclerc about Vettel's 5 second penalty ??

Man I wish they hadn't, Vettel's board swapping would have been even funnier.

I doubt they forgot though they were probably just hoping he wouldn't get within 5 seconds so as to not rub salt in Vettel's wound.

They actually told Leclerc to pit for fastest lap but he refused, he had good pace and felt he was slowly catching the leaders and didn't want to give up on that.

It's kind of strange that they forgot to tell him about the 5 second penalty but had the presence of mind for him to try for fastest lap, of course if he had done that then Vettel would have had no threat from Leclerc closing within Vettel's penalty window, maybe just coincidence?

As for his strategy seemed a bit rubbish again gambling on a 5 lap SC window which when it didn't happen saw him pit and lose a position to Verstappen although he did quickly get past but left him 10 seconds behind Hamilton when previously he had only been 2 seconds behind.


I don't think they forgot to tell him. It was deliberate. It is time we acknowledge that this is still Vettel's team. Leclerc gets the inferior strategy all the time, he is told to hold station when he is faster, and he was royally screwed in Monaco during qualifying simply because they did not care enough for him to advance. Ferrari want Vettel to be the man. I think that much should be clear for everyone to see by now. We may not agree with it, but it is what it is.

Indeed but then again it's up to Leclerc to make a bigger fist of it, he's done little since Bahrain really?

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:44 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
As the Canadian Grand Prix thread is locked did anyone notice that Ferrari forgot to tell Leclerc about Vettel's 5 second penalty ??

Man I wish they hadn't, Vettel's board swapping would have been even funnier.

I doubt they forgot though they were probably just hoping he wouldn't get within 5 seconds so as to not rub salt in Vettel's wound.

They actually told Leclerc to pit for fastest lap but he refused, he had good pace and felt he was slowly catching the leaders and didn't want to give up on that.

It's kind of strange that they forgot to tell him about the 5 second penalty but had the presence of mind for him to try for fastest lap, of course if he had done that then Vettel would have had no threat from Leclerc closing within Vettel's penalty window, maybe just coincidence?

As for his strategy seemed a bit rubbish again gambling on a 5 lap SC window which when it didn't happen saw him pit and lose a position to Verstappen although he did quickly get past but left him 10 seconds behind Hamilton when previously he had only been 2 seconds behind.


I don't think they forgot to tell him. It was deliberate. It is time we acknowledge that this is still Vettel's team. Leclerc gets the inferior strategy all the time, he is told to hold station when he is faster, and he was royally screwed in Monaco during qualifying simply because they did not care enough for him to advance. Ferrari want Vettel to be the man. I think that much should be clear for everyone to see by now. We may not agree with it, but it is what it is.


:thumbup: :nod:

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:08 am 
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Ferrari at the beginning of the season may well have taken that decision and boxed themselves into a corner. Vettel over 2018/2019 has now made at least 6 errors. How long will they support him as their number 1 driver.

Problem is now that Leclerc has gone off the boil. Its is up to him to prove he can step up. Where else to do that as a Frenchman than at Circuit Paul Ricard, Le Castellet.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:47 am 
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Option or Prime wrote:
Ferrari at the beginning of the season may well have taken that decision and boxed themselves into a corner. Vettel over 2018/2019 has now made at least 6 errors. How long will they support him as their number 1 driver.

Problem is now that Leclerc has gone off the boil. Its is up to him to prove he can step up. Where else to do that as a Frenchman than at Circuit Paul Ricard, Le Castellet.

The only way for Charles to turn his season around is to display superior pace to Seb BOTH in qualifying and the race. If he qualifies behind Seb he will be stranded on worn tires for several laps after Seb pits much like Kimi normally was during his time at Ferrari. By the time he begins his second stint he will have lost several seconds to the leaders. If he qualifies ahead of Seb but does not pull a gap during the race he will be asked to move aside.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:34 am 
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What I thought Ferrari would try in Canada was to have Vettel back Hamilton into Leclerc so that Leclerc can pass Hamilton and allow Vettel to build the 5s gap.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:17 am 
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Option or Prime wrote:
Where else to do that as a Frenchman than at Circuit Paul Ricard, Le Castellet.
Quite! But Leclerc is not a Frenchman...

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:46 am 
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Covalent wrote:
What I thought Ferrari would try in Canada was to have Vettel back Hamilton into Leclerc so that Leclerc can pass Hamilton and allow Vettel to build the 5s gap.

Yes I was worried about that scenario and in that respect I would have preferred Vettel not to have the 5s penalty, similar to Monaco without the 5s penalty Verstappen wouldn't have been so desperate to pass Hamilton, it was win or finish 4th so more chance of something untoward happening to Hamilton and they did clash wheels.

Believe it or not I would have been happy for Vettel not to have had the penalty and for Hamilton to have had an easy second place, it still would have been a very good result in respect of the WDC and also I feared the anti Mercedes/F1 backlash, a Ferrari win would have been a nice 2 week rest from the ongoing negative posts.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:47 am 
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Fiki wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
Where else to do that as a Frenchman than at Circuit Paul Ricard, Le Castellet.
Quite! But Leclerc is not a Frenchman...

I'm sure he has close ties though?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:01 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Fiki wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
Where else to do that as a Frenchman than at Circuit Paul Ricard, Le Castellet.
Quite! But Leclerc is not a Frenchman...

I'm sure he has close ties though?
Of course he has, his country is surrounded by France, and Le Castellet is closest to Monaco. But he isn't French, as is shown by the Monegasque flag on his racing overalls.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:11 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
Of course he has, his country is surrounded by France, and Le Castellet is closest to Monaco. But he isn't French, as is shown by the Monegasque flag on his racing overalls.


It's mainly our fiscal paradise... Two thirds of the French colours on the flag, the other third is put away in a anonymous safe.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:56 pm 
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Harpo wrote:
Fiki wrote:
Of course he has, his country is surrounded by France, and Le Castellet is closest to Monaco. But he isn't French, as is shown by the Monegasque flag on his racing overalls.


It's mainly our fiscal paradise... Two thirds of the French colours on the flag, the other third is put away in a anonymous safe.
:lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:50 pm 
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Great pole lap and well ahead of Vettel all weekend, the first time Leclerc has looked quicker and out qualfiied Vettel in back to back weekends. I think Leclerc will affectively end Vettels Ferrari career in the second half of the season here. Vettel may still be in the car for 2020 but Ferrari aren't shy in moving drivers on who earn 4x the amount of the "number 2" but aren't any quicker, possibly slower.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:55 pm 
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Johnson wrote:
Great pole lap and well ahead of Vettel all weekend, the first time Leclerc has looked quicker and out qualfiied Vettel in back to back weekends. I think Leclerc will affectively end Vettels Ferrari career in the second half of the season here. Vettel may still be in the car for 2020 but Ferrari aren't shy in moving drivers on who earn 4x the amount of the "number 2" but aren't any quicker, possibly slower.

I too am starting to feel that 2020 will almost certainly be Vettel's last year at Ferrari. Charles has the pace. He has the talent. I think that, in the first few races of the season, he really lacked consistency and he made too many errors. That was compounded by some really poor luck and horrible decisions from the team during races and qualifying sessions. With Mercedes looking to be in control of the season, I think the atmosphere at Ferrari has changed of late and I think Charles will be able to full have his own race and his own strategies. He has looked stronger than Vettel these last two weekends and we should keep an eye on that to see if it continues.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:57 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Johnson wrote:
Great pole lap and well ahead of Vettel all weekend, the first time Leclerc has looked quicker and out qualfiied Vettel in back to back weekends. I think Leclerc will affectively end Vettels Ferrari career in the second half of the season here. Vettel may still be in the car for 2020 but Ferrari aren't shy in moving drivers on who earn 4x the amount of the "number 2" but aren't any quicker, possibly slower.

I too am starting to feel that 2020 will almost certainly be Vettel's last year at Ferrari. Charles has the pace. He has the talent. I think that, in the first few races of the season, he really lacked consistency and he made too many errors. That was compounded by some really poor luck and horrible decisions from the team during races and qualifying sessions. With Mercedes looking to be in control of the season, I think the atmosphere at Ferrari has changed of late and I think Charles will be able to full have his own race and his own strategies. He has looked stronger than Vettel these last two weekends and we should keep an eye on that to see if it continues.


This is a general pattern, young guys getting thrown in at new teams against experienced team mates who are usually established at the team - the young guy just gets stronger and stronger.

It happened with Verstappen vs Ricciardo, Ricciardo had him out qualfied 7-0 in there first 7 races before Max started to match him...

Hamilton and Alonso... (although both new to the team)

Raikkonen and Coulthard...

Vettel and Webber...


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:12 pm 
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Before you folks shuffle Seb of to another career, just remember that Kimi spent five years at Ferrari as number two to Sebastian after he had won his one championship. During those five years, 2014-2018, Kimi won exactly one race. (US GP in 2018)

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:31 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Before you folks shuffle Seb of to another career, just remember that Kimi spent five years at Ferrari as number two to Sebastian after he had won his one championship. During those five years, 2014-2018, Kimi won exactly one race. (US GP in 2018)

This does flip from one thing to the other, one day Leclerc looks a little out of his depth, the next day he's going to retire Vettel.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:44 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Before you folks shuffle Seb of to another career, just remember that Kimi spent five years at Ferrari as number two to Sebastian after he had won his one championship. During those five years, 2014-2018, Kimi won exactly one race. (US GP in 2018)

Kimi is a different guy. I think Kimi was able to swallow his pride (or perhaps he is just generally more humble to begin with) and didn't seem too bothered by the number 2 role at Ferrari. I don't think Vettel is, at all, of the same mindset. In other words, I don't think Vettel will want to stay if he is behind Charles.

I also don't think Vettel will accept that level of pay cut that Kimi did. Kimi's salary was cut from $40 million to $7 million while at Ferrari. That's a massive pay cut and Vettel will not accept that. Ferrari will not be willing to pay Vettel the way he's being paid now if his teammate actually gets the better of him. For Vettel, if he cannot remain their #1, I don't see how he can remain a Ferrari driver. Not when it's likely that either Hamilton or Verstappen will also be available.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:18 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
Before you folks shuffle Seb of to another career, just remember that Kimi spent five years at Ferrari as number two to Sebastian after he had won his one championship. During those five years, 2014-2018, Kimi won exactly one race. (US GP in 2018)

This does flip from one thing to the other, one day Leclerc looks a little out of his depth, the next day he's going to retire Vettel.

He's always looked like he's going to retire Vettel. From the start it's been clear that Leclerc's pace ceiling is higher, so as soon as he started to consistently realize it he was always going to force Seb from the team. Vettel isn't going to stay with a quicker teammate, regardless of whether his eventual destination is a different team or retirement.

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