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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 4:32 pm 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:01 pm 
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I'm predicting Leclerc to win in Baku. I think the track should really suit Ferrari with that third sector and Charles has done well there in junior categories. Part of the prediction is wishful thinking. If Ferrari cannot get their act together within the next couple of races I don't think we'll see them put up a genuine title challenge this year.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:55 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
I'm predicting Leclerc to win in Baku. I think the track should really suit Ferrari with that third sector and Charles has done well there in junior categories. Part of the prediction is wishful thinking. If Ferrari cannot get their act together within the next couple of races I don't think we'll see them put up a genuine title challenge this year.

I'm considering some money on Leclerc for Baku myself. He's looked mega there the last 2 years and wouldn't surprise me if Ferrari bounced back again next time out. I'll be rooting for him anyway after the Bahrain misfortune.

This is going to be a very up and down season between Mercedes and Ferrari I think.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:27 pm 
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Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


I'd say it's fairly bold seeing as Reb Bull have only had one winless season since 2009 (2015) and they have Verstappen in the team. They'll nab wins.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:16 pm 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


I'd say it's fairly bold seeing as Reb Bull have only had one winless season since 2009 (2015) and they have Verstappen in the team. They'll nab wins.


Yeah, I can see Red Bull nabbing a win somewhere. Red Bull performance-wise in 2019 are like Benetton in 1992 and 1993, and they managed a win in each of those seasons with only 16 races to do so in each of those years compared to 21 now. Max is their Schumacher and Gasly is their Patrese/Brundle, so Gasly should be able to grab a podium or two if he gets the whole season.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:27 pm 
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Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


Red Bull tends to get 3 or 4 wins every season. Mostly due to specific tracks suiting. I think it's bold because I don't expect RBR to be the best car at any circuit. Whenever I see the car, I get the feeling it's chassis is subpar (compared to Merc/Ferrari).


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2019 11:55 pm 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


Red Bull tends to get 3 or 4 wins every season. Mostly due to specific tracks suiting. I think it's bold because I don't expect RBR to be the best car at any circuit. Whenever I see the car, I get the feeling it's chassis is subpar (compared to Merc/Ferrari).


Interesting, since a lot of folks have thought that Red Bull had the best or near best chassis for several seasons and that they were hampered by a low power and unreliable P/U.

Did they screw up the best chassis with the new rules changes or did Merc and Ferrari just get better???

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:13 am 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Interesting, since a lot of folks have thought that Red Bull had the best or near best chassis for several seasons and that they were hampered by a low power and unreliable P/U.

Did they screw up the best chassis with the new rules changes or did Merc and Ferrari just get better???

If you want to apply the same logic we McLaren fans have been getting thrown at us, they never had the best chassis and were just lying about it to make themselves look better at the expense of their PU supplier.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:44 am 
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Mort Canard wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


Red Bull tends to get 3 or 4 wins every season. Mostly due to specific tracks suiting. I think it's bold because I don't expect RBR to be the best car at any circuit. Whenever I see the car, I get the feeling it's chassis is subpar (compared to Merc/Ferrari).


Interesting, since a lot of folks have thought that Red Bull had the best or near best chassis for several seasons and that they were hampered by a low power and unreliable P/U.

Did they screw up the best chassis with the new rules changes or did Merc and Ferrari just get better???

If you compare China this year with last, only Mercedes of the top teams improved their time. Ferrari took the biggest step backwards, dropping half a second. But this may be explained by the rumour that they are having to turn things down due to reliability concerns - certainly in Bahrain they posted similar times to last year. The Ferrari looks less planted than the Merc, though.

Verstappen's Red Bull dropped 3 tenths on last year, which could be down to the PU. But when we look at Toro Rosso, they gained nearly half a second, and they haven't changed PU, while the Renault team also have dropped half a second on last year. This would suggest that Red Bull (and Renault) are more likely losing on the chassis side, rather than the PU. It's too small a sample to be scientific but at first glance it doesn't look like Red Bull have made any steps forward with this year's package, and in fact look to have lost some ground. Mercerdes are the only ones who look to have made definite improvements


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 8:13 am 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


Red Bull tends to get 3 or 4 wins every season. Mostly due to specific tracks suiting. I think it's bold because I don't expect RBR to be the best car at any circuit. Whenever I see the car, I get the feeling it's chassis is subpar (compared to Merc/Ferrari).


Red Bull are the development kings though, they started 2016 and 2017 nowhere but by the end were racing for wins.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 8:40 am 
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Johnson wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
Altair wrote:
ReservoirDog wrote:
I will make a bold prediction: Red Bull will not win a race this year.

That's not bold.

Bold is saying Ferrari won't win a race this year.


Red Bull tends to get 3 or 4 wins every season. Mostly due to specific tracks suiting. I think it's bold because I don't expect RBR to be the best car at any circuit. Whenever I see the car, I get the feeling it's chassis is subpar (compared to Merc/Ferrari).

Red Bull are the development kings though, they started 2016 and 2017 nowhere but by the end were racing for wins.

But is that really an illusion caused by the fact that they keep developing their car to the end every year, causing a repeating cycle where they're good at the end but start the next year on the back foot?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:53 am 
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j man wrote:
Zoue wrote:
j man wrote:
Johnson wrote:
It seems Ferrari have reliability issues, new CE in both cars this weekend of an older spec. The mystery of no pace in Australia before switching the engines up a Leclercs car failing. Now possibly turned back down?

This is th first time in 2019 I feel Mercedes look the best package for the titles though.

:thumbup:

I'm getting the impression that Ferrari have the fastest car but they're unable to use it to its full potential, making the Mercedes the best car overall. It's a bit reminiscent of 2005.

I agree with you that if Ferrari have indeed turned their PU down then they do have the fastest car but cannot use it to its fullest potential. But since they are still claimed to be fastest by some margin on the straights, even while "holding back," this would suggest that the best car is in fact the Mercedes, while Ferrari look to have the best PU. But for Mercedes to be so much quicker in the twisty bits is quite impressive - what could they do with a Ferrari PU in the back? :twisted:

I was also wondering after Bahrain if Ferrari's reported power advantage is primarily in their "qualifying" mode and that in race pace it's pretty close between them. Certainly Hamilton's race pace that day was not too shabby.

Yeah In qualifying they are able to use more power than Mercedes but in the race itself the power is quite even.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:00 am 
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Exediron wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
Interesting, since a lot of folks have thought that Red Bull had the best or near best chassis for several seasons and that they were hampered by a low power and unreliable P/U.

Did they screw up the best chassis with the new rules changes or did Merc and Ferrari just get better???

If you want to apply the same logic we McLaren fans have been getting thrown at us, they never had the best chassis and were just lying about it to make themselves look better at the expense of their PU supplier.

Well unlike McLaren they were able to win many races with scores of podiums thrown in. :)

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2017: 9th Place
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:05 am 
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So quite straight forward again Mercedes > Ferrari > Red Bull, let's use the WDC scoring system so we have thus far:-

1. Mercedes 68
2. Ferrari 58
3. Red Bull 48

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:02 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
Interesting, since a lot of folks have thought that Red Bull had the best or near best chassis for several seasons and that they were hampered by a low power and unreliable P/U.

Did they screw up the best chassis with the new rules changes or did Merc and Ferrari just get better???

If you compare China this year with last, only Mercedes of the top teams improved their time. Ferrari took the biggest step backwards, dropping half a second. But this may be explained by the rumour that they are having to turn things down due to reliability concerns - certainly in Bahrain they posted similar times to last year. The Ferrari looks less planted than the Merc, though.

Verstappen's Red Bull dropped 3 tenths on last year, which could be down to the PU. But when we look at Toro Rosso, they gained nearly half a second, and they haven't changed PU, while the Renault team also have dropped half a second on last year. This would suggest that Red Bull (and Renault) are more likely losing on the chassis side, rather than the PU. It's too small a sample to be scientific but at first glance it doesn't look like Red Bull have made any steps forward with this year's package, and in fact look to have lost some ground. Mercerdes are the only ones who look to have made definite improvements


Very interesting! Thanks for that! :thumbup:

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 5:01 pm 
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Mark Hughes comparing Ferrari and Mercedes so far.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opin ... -delivered

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:23 am 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
Mark Hughes comparing Ferrari and Mercedes so far.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opin ... -delivered

Interesting. What I take from this is that Ferrari think that they have the fastest car but have not been able to 'unlock' it - and there's no guarantee that they will. I guess it would be a bit like Usain Bolt being the fastest sprinter but his team haven't figured out how - or whether - they can remove his hobnail boots and replace them with running shoes.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2019 3:39 pm 
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tootsie323 wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
Mark Hughes comparing Ferrari and Mercedes so far.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opin ... -delivered

Interesting. What I take from this is that Ferrari think that they have the fastest car but have not been able to 'unlock' it - and there's no guarantee that they will. I guess it would be a bit like Usain Bolt being the fastest sprinter but his team haven't figured out how - or whether - they can remove his hobnail boots and replace them with running shoes.


Merc tamed their diva in 2017. Ferrari should also be able to.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 11:48 am 
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ReservoirDog wrote:
tootsie323 wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
Mark Hughes comparing Ferrari and Mercedes so far.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opin ... -delivered

Interesting. What I take from this is that Ferrari think that they have the fastest car but have not been able to 'unlock' it - and there's no guarantee that they will. I guess it would be a bit like Usain Bolt being the fastest sprinter but his team haven't figured out how - or whether - they can remove his hobnail boots and replace them with running shoes.


Merc tamed their diva in 2017. Ferrari should also be able to.
Unless their issues are identical, there's no correlation between the two


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:13 pm 
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Wow that was a close one pace-wise between Merc, Ferrari and Red Bull!

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:38 pm 
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I'd score them equal in qualifying this weekend, Merc in the race so Merc overall.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 8:22 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
I'd score them equal in qualifying this weekend, Merc in the race so Merc overall.

yeah I think I'd be onboard with that


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:59 am 
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https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/repo ... rix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:55 am 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/reports/f1/2019-azerbaijan-grand-prix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

I think that some people need to read that?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:04 am 
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pokerman wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/reports/f1/2019-azerbaijan-grand-prix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

I think that some people need to read that?


Definitely, some very good information.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 7:11 am 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
pokerman wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/reports/f1/2019-azerbaijan-grand-prix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

I think that some people need to read that?


Definitely, some very good information.

Yeah, what struck me was that the entire piece was pretty much all about the tyres and how they affected the race. It's getting absolutely ridiculous now and it seems they're going back to the really bad old days where they have an operating window that's so narrow as to be virtually invisible.

It's a farce. This is what F1's become now?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 7:59 am 
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pokerman wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/reports/f1/2019-azerbaijan-grand-prix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

I think that some people need to read that?

I think everyone should read it, well written and informative.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 8:00 am 
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Zoue wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
pokerman wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/reports/f1/2019-azerbaijan-grand-prix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

I think that some people need to read that?


Definitely, some very good information.

Yeah, what struck me was that the entire piece was pretty much all about the tyres and how they affected the race. It's getting absolutely ridiculous now and it seems they're going back to the really bad old days where they have an operating window that's so narrow as to be virtually invisible.

It's a farce. This is what F1's become now?

Yes I agree with this. I thought they were supposed to have a wider operating window this year?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:23 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
Zoue wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
pokerman wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/reports/f1/2019-azerbaijan-grand-prix-report

Interesting read regarding qualifying.

I think that some people need to read that?


Definitely, some very good information.

Yeah, what struck me was that the entire piece was pretty much all about the tyres and how they affected the race. It's getting absolutely ridiculous now and it seems they're going back to the really bad old days where they have an operating window that's so narrow as to be virtually invisible.

It's a farce. This is what F1's become now?

Yes I agree with this. I thought they were supposed to have a wider operating window this year?

It shows basically how Ferrari (Leclerc) dropped the ball, his crash in Q2 further delayed the qualifying session which pushed the temperatures lower bringing Mercedes more into the game at the expense of Vettel in Q3.

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2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place
2019: Currently 26th

Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:24 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Zoue wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I think that some people need to read that?


Definitely, some very good information.

Yeah, what struck me was that the entire piece was pretty much all about the tyres and how they affected the race. It's getting absolutely ridiculous now and it seems they're going back to the really bad old days where they have an operating window that's so narrow as to be virtually invisible.

It's a farce. This is what F1's become now?

Yes I agree with this. I thought they were supposed to have a wider operating window this year?

It shows basically how Ferrari (Leclerc) dropped the ball, his crash in Q2 further delayed the qualifying session which pushed the temperatures lower bringing Mercedes more into the game at the expense of Vettel in Q3.

it happened in the race with Ferrari, Red Bull etc too


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:38 pm 
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This was very hard to judge, Ferrari (Leclerc) had the fastest car throughout the weekend up to Leclerc crashing in Q2 which put him out of the game and delayed qualifying were the falling temperatures disadvantaged Vettel in respect to the Mercedes drivers in Q3.

I can't help feeling that without that happening Leclerc might well have been on pole with Vettel splitting the Mercs with Bottas possible starting 4th then the race itself takes on a different complexion.

Autosport are running an article were it says possibly 6 drivers could have won the race if things had played out slightly differently, unfortunately it's behind a paywall.

I can't go along with the Mercedes being the fastest car with Ferrari (Leclerc) dropping the ball so I'm going to call it even with Red Bull third, so:-

1. Mercedes 93
2. Ferrari 83
3. Red Bull 63

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Last edited by pokerman on Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:40 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Zoue wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
Definitely, some very good information.

Yeah, what struck me was that the entire piece was pretty much all about the tyres and how they affected the race. It's getting absolutely ridiculous now and it seems they're going back to the really bad old days where they have an operating window that's so narrow as to be virtually invisible.

It's a farce. This is what F1's become now?

Yes I agree with this. I thought they were supposed to have a wider operating window this year?

It shows basically how Ferrari (Leclerc) dropped the ball, his crash in Q2 further delayed the qualifying session which pushed the temperatures lower bringing Mercedes more into the game at the expense of Vettel in Q3.

it happened in the race with Ferrari, Red Bull etc too

Vettel had a problem on the softs which Leclerc may not have had, we saw Vettel have problems with tyres in Australia which didn't affect Leclerc.

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2014: Champion
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2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
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Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:54 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Vettel had a problem on the softs which Leclerc may not have had, we saw Vettel have problems with tyres in Australia which didn't affect Leclerc.


Leclerc could not make the softs work later on in the race or could he keep the mediums working as long as Gasly did.

Mercedes controlled their pace and though Mark Hughes I respect him as an F1 journo what is in that article is no different from what armchair pundits have been saying since sat as well, there is no technical info behind it.

He totally neglects Mercedes race pace in the article, had Leclerc started on pole he wont have had the race pace or the tyre life to fight Mercedes.

Vettel didnt have a tyre problem in Australia rather a silly strategy which made him run out of tyres.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:28 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Yes I agree with this. I thought they were supposed to have a wider operating window this year?

It shows basically how Ferrari (Leclerc) dropped the ball, his crash in Q2 further delayed the qualifying session which pushed the temperatures lower bringing Mercedes more into the game at the expense of Vettel in Q3.

it happened in the race with Ferrari, Red Bull etc too

Vettel had a problem on the softs which Leclerc may not have had, we saw Vettel have problems with tyres in Australia which didn't affect Leclerc.

I think he clearly did have a problem with the softs in the race. Once he pit for softs he started dropping time to Verstappen, on a fresh set of supposedly faster tyres, Ferrari just couldn't seem to make them work on Sunday.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:52 pm 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Yes I agree with this. I thought they were supposed to have a wider operating window this year?

It shows basically how Ferrari (Leclerc) dropped the ball, his crash in Q2 further delayed the qualifying session which pushed the temperatures lower bringing Mercedes more into the game at the expense of Vettel in Q3.

it happened in the race with Ferrari, Red Bull etc too

Vettel had a problem on the softs which Leclerc may not have had, we saw Vettel have problems with tyres in Australia which didn't affect Leclerc.

I think he clearly did have a problem with the softs in the race. Once he pit for softs he started dropping time to Verstappen, on a fresh set of supposedly faster tyres, Ferrari just couldn't seem to make them work on Sunday.


Ferrari told him not to push


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:54 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
It shows basically how Ferrari (Leclerc) dropped the ball, his crash in Q2 further delayed the qualifying session which pushed the temperatures lower bringing Mercedes more into the game at the expense of Vettel in Q3.

it happened in the race with Ferrari, Red Bull etc too

Vettel had a problem on the softs which Leclerc may not have had, we saw Vettel have problems with tyres in Australia which didn't affect Leclerc.

I think he clearly did have a problem with the softs in the race. Once he pit for softs he started dropping time to Verstappen, on a fresh set of supposedly faster tyres, Ferrari just couldn't seem to make them work on Sunday.


Ferrari told him not to push

Because they were worried about how long they could go, to be fair. Just before Leclerc came in Ferrari were telling him it was too soon and would leave too much to do on the Softs. There's no reason to tell him to go easy if they don't have any concerns


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:01 pm 
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Mercedes has been the better car quite clearly now, the Ferrari was better only for one race and the driver that extracted its potential that race broke down.

However, Vettel could be so much higher in the WDC table if he himself had got the most out of the car in Bahrain and cruised to a win or at least been in position to take the win once Leclerc broke down.

If Vettel had won Bahrain the WDC table would look like-

BOT 84
HAM 79
VET 67

Vettel just 12 points behind Lewis and 17 off Bottas and in a good position, especially if Ferrari are on form in Spain he could also entirely wipe that lead out.

Instead he is 35 and 34 points behind them and on the edge of falling out of the title race for the near future at least.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:21 pm 
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I think Ferrari is not that far behind the Merc. But whenever there's a possibility of things going either Merc's way or Ferrari's, they always go Merc's way.

Sending their drivers out on mediums in Q2. Another mega dumb decision from Ferrari. Then it just cascaded, leading to a lot of events that changed the complexion of the race. I know it's could a would a should a, but a well-thought out quali plan could've won Ferrari the race. I liked how LeClerk wasn't afraid of blaming low grip on the tires as part of the reason he crashed.

Merc is such a well-run operation, I just can't see Ferrari touching them. Given the same exact car, I'd say Mercedes operations will beat Ferrari operations 4 out of 5 times.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:49 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
Because they were worried about how long they could go, to be fair. Just before Leclerc came in Ferrari were telling him it was too soon and would leave too much to do on the Softs. There's no reason to tell him to go easy if they don't have any concerns


Maybe that was a factor. Leclerc said it was because he was told not to push because there was no chance of catching Verstappen anyway.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:23 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:
it happened in the race with Ferrari, Red Bull etc too

Vettel had a problem on the softs which Leclerc may not have had, we saw Vettel have problems with tyres in Australia which didn't affect Leclerc.

I think he clearly did have a problem with the softs in the race. Once he pit for softs he started dropping time to Verstappen, on a fresh set of supposedly faster tyres, Ferrari just couldn't seem to make them work on Sunday.


Ferrari told him not to push

Because they were worried about how long they could go, to be fair. Just before Leclerc came in Ferrari were telling him it was too soon and would leave too much to do on the Softs. There's no reason to tell him to go easy if they don't have any concerns

Then we're simply back to Leclerc's poor strategy he should have gone medium, medium, soft.

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