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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:52 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
The point for fastest lap is a farce & a gimmick that adds absolutely nothing to the spectacle of the sport.


I disagree. It's a nice little subplot to races. Admittedly it becomes less interesting when someone gets a 'free stop' to do it. But we may one day see a leader bin it while going for fastest lap.


Sub plot, to what? I'm sure if it was the final race of the season and 1 point would make the difference of who won the WDC, it would be bloody interesting. Other than that, it ranks far below the battles down the field for me, even those out of the points. At least they're battling rivals, not simply making space on the track for a single hot lap.


It's something mildly interesting that happens at the front of the race when the big points are often settled. It replaces nothing with something essentially. It may not be a massively interesting something but can provide intrigue on occasion.


When has it provided intrigue? The driver pitting for fresh rubber has always achieved the fastest lap haven't they? Even Gasly got it just about by a fraction in the one race he went for it, when we know he has been very slow this season, so if he can get the fastest lap by putting on fresh rubber, all the other drivers can easily convert the fresh rubber into a fastest lap point. So it provides zero intrigue as far as I can see.


:thumbup:

Probably the only way for it to provide intrigue is if someone messes up his ostensible free pit stop for fresh tyres. Hasn't happened yet, though.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:57 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
The point for fastest lap is a farce & a gimmick that adds absolutely nothing to the spectacle of the sport.


I disagree. It's a nice little subplot to races. Admittedly it becomes less interesting when someone gets a 'free stop' to do it. But we may one day see a leader bin it while going for fastest lap.


Sub plot, to what? I'm sure if it was the final race of the season and 1 point would make the difference of who won the WDC, it would be bloody interesting. Other than that, it ranks far below the battles down the field for me, even those out of the points. At least they're battling rivals, not simply making space on the track for a single hot lap.


It's something mildly interesting that happens at the front of the race when the big points are often settled. It replaces nothing with something essentially. It may not be a massively interesting something but can provide intrigue on occasion.


When has it provided intrigue? The driver pitting for fresh rubber has always achieved the fastest lap haven't they? Even Gasly got it just about by a fraction in the one race he went for it, when we know he has been very slow this season, so if he can get the fastest lap by putting on fresh rubber, all the other drivers can easily convert the fresh rubber into a fastest lap point. So it provides zero intrigue as far as I can see.


Again, it's something where there used to be absolutely nothing. Just because fastest lap points haven't been significant this season doesn't mean that they couldn't. I'm pretty sure Hamilton pulled out a fastest lap on 40 lap old hard tyres somewhere.

I'm not saying it has been a game changer, but it hasn't taken anything away from the spectacle. Again, even if the free pit stop makes it a bit of a foregone conclusion, it is a pitstop and fastest lap attempt that likely wouldn't have happened in previous seasons.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 3:18 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
The point for fastest lap is a farce & a gimmick that adds absolutely nothing to the spectacle of the sport.


I disagree. It's a nice little subplot to races. Admittedly it becomes less interesting when someone gets a 'free stop' to do it. But we may one day see a leader bin it while going for fastest lap.


Sub plot, to what? I'm sure if it was the final race of the season and 1 point would make the difference of who won the WDC, it would be bloody interesting. Other than that, it ranks far below the battles down the field for me, even those out of the points. At least they're battling rivals, not simply making space on the track for a single hot lap.


It's something mildly interesting that happens at the front of the race when the big points are often settled. It replaces nothing with something essentially. It may not be a massively interesting something but can provide intrigue on occasion.


When has it provided intrigue? The driver pitting for fresh rubber has always achieved the fastest lap haven't they? Even Gasly got it just about by a fraction in the one race he went for it, when we know he has been very slow this season, so if he can get the fastest lap by putting on fresh rubber, all the other drivers can easily convert the fresh rubber into a fastest lap point. So it provides zero intrigue as far as I can see.


Australia, Bahrain, Spain, Austria, GB, Germany, Hungary, Italy and Russia it was not decided by someone pitting and generally the winner... that’s 9/16 races. Belgium too really, Vettel ran a proper 2 stop and got it.

Someone has done a late stop to do fastest lap 6/16 races.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 3:39 pm 
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Johnson wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:

Sub plot, to what? I'm sure if it was the final race of the season and 1 point would make the difference of who won the WDC, it would be bloody interesting. Other than that, it ranks far below the battles down the field for me, even those out of the points. At least they're battling rivals, not simply making space on the track for a single hot lap.


It's something mildly interesting that happens at the front of the race when the big points are often settled. It replaces nothing with something essentially. It may not be a massively interesting something but can provide intrigue on occasion.


When has it provided intrigue? The driver pitting for fresh rubber has always achieved the fastest lap haven't they? Even Gasly got it just about by a fraction in the one race he went for it, when we know he has been very slow this season, so if he can get the fastest lap by putting on fresh rubber, all the other drivers can easily convert the fresh rubber into a fastest lap point. So it provides zero intrigue as far as I can see.


Australia, Bahrain, Spain, Austria, GB, Germany, Hungary, Italy and Russia it was not decided by someone pitting and generally the winner... that’s 9/16 races. Belgium too really, Vettel ran a proper 2 stop and got it.

Someone has done a late stop to do fastest lap 6/16 races.


Yeah, not everyone has tried it at every race as you need to have a gap behind to pit into etc, but the six times it has been attempted, the driver has managed to steal the fastest lap, so it's still boring and adds pretty much nothing to the race other than seeing a deserving fastest lap accolade get robbed from someone, (now only total poles and wins means something whereas 10+ years ago in Schumacher and Senna's eras the amount of fastest laps a driver had accumulated meant something too).


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 3:44 pm 
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Even if the director shows a car coming in for fresh tyres and then follows it for the first flying lap, is that really very exciting? It's a single car on its own lapping a little quicker than the rest of the cars, but not actually racing as such.

Even if multiple cars came in for fresh tyres and then went out, bit like qualifying, it would still be a strange thing because that's not the point of a race!

I've yet to feel even the slightest pang of excitement because a single car lapped fractionally quicker for a single lap towards the end of the race.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 4:07 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
Even if the director shows a car coming in for fresh tyres and then follows it for the first flying lap, is that really very exciting? It's a single car on its own lapping a little quicker than the rest of the cars, but not actually racing as such.

Even if multiple cars came in for fresh tyres and then went out, bit like qualifying, it would still be a strange thing because that's not the point of a race!

I've yet to feel even the slightest pang of excitement because a single car lapped fractionally quicker for a single lap towards the end of the race.


Exactly, it's fake entertainment and adds nothing of real value to proceedings.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:41 pm 
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Can anybody remember who got the fastest laps and on which lap other than silverstone? Without checking I'd bet no chance


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:51 pm 
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I never liked this fastest lap point from the beginning. The only time I recall a fastest lap being impressive this season was when Lewis did it on tires that were really old, I believe in France. Other than that it adds zero to the show for me.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:19 pm 
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FormulaFun wrote:
Can anybody remember who got the fastest laps and on which lap other than silverstone? Without checking I'd bet no chance


Magnussen in Singapore!

Apart from that ....


Last edited by Paolo_Lasardi on Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:19 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
Johnson wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:

Sub plot, to what? I'm sure if it was the final race of the season and 1 point would make the difference of who won the WDC, it would be bloody interesting. Other than that, it ranks far below the battles down the field for me, even those out of the points. At least they're battling rivals, not simply making space on the track for a single hot lap.


It's something mildly interesting that happens at the front of the race when the big points are often settled. It replaces nothing with something essentially. It may not be a massively interesting something but can provide intrigue on occasion.


When has it provided intrigue? The driver pitting for fresh rubber has always achieved the fastest lap haven't they? Even Gasly got it just about by a fraction in the one race he went for it, when we know he has been very slow this season, so if he can get the fastest lap by putting on fresh rubber, all the other drivers can easily convert the fresh rubber into a fastest lap point. So it provides zero intrigue as far as I can see.


Australia, Bahrain, Spain, Austria, GB, Germany, Hungary, Italy and Russia it was not decided by someone pitting and generally the winner... that’s 9/16 races. Belgium too really, Vettel ran a proper 2 stop and got it.

Someone has done a late stop to do fastest lap 6/16 races.


Yeah, not everyone has tried it at every race as you need to have a gap behind to pit into etc, but the six times it has been attempted, the driver has managed to steal the fastest lap, so it's still boring and adds pretty much nothing to the race other than seeing a deserving fastest lap accolade get robbed from someone, (now only total poles and wins means something whereas 10+ years ago in Schumacher and Senna's eras the amount of fastest laps a driver had accumulated meant something too).


Yes, your original message stated it was every race that somebody pitted to set fastest lap. That’s only happening 35% of the time. The other 65% of the time, the majority you’re happy with?

That’s also only occurring as high as 35% because we have a split field of 3 teams way ahead of the rest, that won’t always be the case. That should lower as the field inevitably closers in.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:38 pm 
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Johnson wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Johnson wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:

When has it provided intrigue? The driver pitting for fresh rubber has always achieved the fastest lap haven't they? Even Gasly got it just about by a fraction in the one race he went for it, when we know he has been very slow this season, so if he can get the fastest lap by putting on fresh rubber, all the other drivers can easily convert the fresh rubber into a fastest lap point. So it provides zero intrigue as far as I can see.


Australia, Bahrain, Spain, Austria, GB, Germany, Hungary, Italy and Russia it was not decided by someone pitting and generally the winner... that’s 9/16 races. Belgium too really, Vettel ran a proper 2 stop and got it.

Someone has done a late stop to do fastest lap 6/16 races.


Yeah, not everyone has tried it at every race as you need to have a gap behind to pit into etc, but the six times it has been attempted, the driver has managed to steal the fastest lap, so it's still boring and adds pretty much nothing to the race other than seeing a deserving fastest lap accolade get robbed from someone, (now only total poles and wins means something whereas 10+ years ago in Schumacher and Senna's eras the amount of fastest laps a driver had accumulated meant something too).


Yes, your original message stated it was every race that somebody pitted to set fastest lap. That’s only happening 35% of the time. The other 65% of the time, the majority you’re happy with?

That’s also only occurring as high as 35% because we have a split field of 3 teams way ahead of the rest, that won’t always be the case. That should lower as the field inevitably closers in.



Yeah, that was hyperbole. Whenever it happens it is a formality and it is dull.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:06 pm 
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FormulaFun wrote:
Can anybody remember who got the fastest laps and on which lap other than silverstone? Without checking I'd bet no chance

Without checking (not even going to try to get which lap):

Leclerc didn't get it in Australia because he didn't pit. I think Bottas got it?
Leclerc in Bahrain.
China... not sure. I wanna say this is the one where Gasly pitted to get the point, but he only got it by like a tenth anyway?
Baku. No clue.
Spain... no clue.
Monaco I think would have to be Hamilton?
Canada I kind of feel was Leclerc closing in on the leaders?
France, again no clue.
Austria it was Max.
Great Britain it was Hamilton on the last lap.
Germany I think was probably Max?
Hungary was Max, pitting after he got overtaken.
Belgium was Leclerc.
Not sure about Italy.
Singapore was Magnussen on the last lap.
Not sure about Russia, and it just happened.

Let's see how I did:

8 right / 8 wrong or didn't know

Not perfect, but I have to say that's about 50% better than I would have got right before they added the point. I used to have no clue at all who got it.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 2:51 am 
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Exediron wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
Can anybody remember who got the fastest laps and on which lap other than silverstone? Without checking I'd bet no chance

Without checking (not even going to try to get which lap):

Leclerc didn't get it in Australia because he didn't pit. I think Bottas got it?
Leclerc in Bahrain.
China... not sure. I wanna say this is the one where Gasly pitted to get the point, but he only got it by like a tenth anyway?
Baku. No clue.
Spain... no clue.
Monaco I think would have to be Hamilton?
Canada I kind of feel was Leclerc closing in on the leaders?
France, again no clue.
Austria it was Max.
Great Britain it was Hamilton on the last lap.
Germany I think was probably Max?
Hungary was Max, pitting after he got overtaken.
Belgium was Leclerc.
Not sure about Italy.
Singapore was Magnussen on the last lap.
Not sure about Russia, and it just happened.

Let's see how I did:

8 right / 8 wrong or didn't know

Not perfect, but I have to say that's about 50% better than I would have got right before they added the point. I used to have no clue at all who got it.


Actual results.
Australia - Bottas
Bahrain- Leclerc
China Gasly
Baku. Leclerc
Spain - Hamilton
Monaco - Gasly
Canada - Bottas
France - Vettel
Austria - Max
Great Britain - Hamilton
Germany - Max
Hungary - Max
Belgium - Vettel
Italy - Hamilton
Singapore - Magnussen (finished 17th so no point awarded)
Russia - Hamilton

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:51 am 
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Unpopular opinion?

Ricciardo isn't funny, if anything he's rather annoying.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:12 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Exediron wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
Can anybody remember who got the fastest laps and on which lap other than silverstone? Without checking I'd bet no chance

Without checking (not even going to try to get which lap):

Leclerc didn't get it in Australia because he didn't pit. I think Bottas got it?
Leclerc in Bahrain.
China... not sure. I wanna say this is the one where Gasly pitted to get the point, but he only got it by like a tenth anyway?
Baku. No clue.
Spain... no clue.
Monaco I think would have to be Hamilton?
Canada I kind of feel was Leclerc closing in on the leaders?
France, again no clue.
Austria it was Max.
Great Britain it was Hamilton on the last lap.
Germany I think was probably Max?
Hungary was Max, pitting after he got overtaken.
Belgium was Leclerc.
Not sure about Italy.
Singapore was Magnussen on the last lap.
Not sure about Russia, and it just happened.

Let's see how I did:

8 right / 8 wrong or didn't know

Not perfect, but I have to say that's about 50% better than I would have got right before they added the point. I used to have no clue at all who got it.


Actual results.
Australia - Bottas
Bahrain- Leclerc
China Gasly
Baku. Leclerc
Spain - Hamilton
Monaco - Gasly
Canada - Bottas
France - Vettel
Austria - Max
Great Britain - Hamilton
Germany - Max
Hungary - Max
Belgium - Vettel
Italy - Hamilton
Singapore - Magnussen (finished 17th so no point awarded)
Russia - Hamilton

In Singapore with KMag finishing outside the top 10 the fastest lap bonus point went to Bottas so that makes it:-

1. Hamilton 4
2. Bottas 3
2. Verstappen 3
4. Leclerc 2
4. Vettel 2
4. Gasly 2

WDC
1. Hamilton
2. Bottas
3. Leclerc
4. Verstappen
5. Vettel
6. Gasly

It's perhaps not quite the lottery it appears to be?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:32 pm 
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pokerman wrote:

In Singapore with KMag finishing outside the top 10 the fastest lap bonus point went to Bottas so that makes it:-

1. Hamilton 4
2. Bottas 3
2. Verstappen 3
4. Leclerc 2
4. Vettel 2
4. Gasly 2

WDC
1. Hamilton
2. Bottas
3. Leclerc
4. Verstappen
5. Vettel
6. Gasly

It's perhaps not quite the lottery it appears to be?


That's not how it works. The fast lap point was simply not awarded in Singapore.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:33 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
In Singapore with KMag finishing outside the top 10 the fastest lap bonus point went to Bottas so that makes it:-

1. Hamilton 4
2. Bottas 3
2. Verstappen 3
4. Leclerc 2
4. Vettel 2
4. Gasly 2

WDC
1. Hamilton
2. Bottas
3. Leclerc
4. Verstappen
5. Vettel
6. Gasly

It's perhaps not quite the lottery it appears to be?


Did Bottas get the fastest lap point in Singapore though or was it just not awarded?

From F1.com

"There is, however, a condition for earning the point. Only drivers who are classified in the top 10 at the end of the race are eligible. If you achieve the feat and finish in 11th or lower (or fail to finish), no point will be allocated."

I have to ask though, what was the objective in introducing the fastest lap point in the first place ?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:40 pm 
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I don't really see the point (pun intended) in not giving the drivers outside of the top 10 a chance for the fastest lap point.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:06 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
I don't really see the point (pun intended) in not giving the drivers outside of the top 10 a chance for the fastest lap point.


It's to avoid 10 plus cars all pitting together on the penultimate lap for new tyres in the hope of getting a point. They'd be so many cars trying to do this it would quite possible mean those racing for real points would get messed up with the amount of cars trying for a single lap point.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:13 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
Covalent wrote:
I don't really see the point (pun intended) in not giving the drivers outside of the top 10 a chance for the fastest lap point.


It's to avoid 10 plus cars all pitting together on the penultimate lap for new tyres in the hope of getting a point. They'd be so many cars trying to do this it would quite possible mean those racing for real points would get messed up with the amount of cars trying for a single lap point.


Yeah, unlike the reverse grid concept which isn’t designed to mess up those who’d normally be competing for points with cars who’d normally be trundling around at the back of the field.

Maybe they should allow the cars outside the top 10 to go for the glory lap.

Imagine how much it’d “add to the excitement” of the last lap.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:50 pm 
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Herb wrote:
pokerman wrote:

In Singapore with KMag finishing outside the top 10 the fastest lap bonus point went to Bottas so that makes it:-

1. Hamilton 4
2. Bottas 3
2. Verstappen 3
4. Leclerc 2
4. Vettel 2
4. Gasly 2

WDC
1. Hamilton
2. Bottas
3. Leclerc
4. Verstappen
5. Vettel
6. Gasly

It's perhaps not quite the lottery it appears to be?


That's not how it works. The fast lap point was simply not awarded in Singapore.

:thumbup: :nod:

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:08 am 
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Ironically fastest lap showdown between Hamilton and Leclerc decides the WCC today


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:52 am 
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Not sure this is an opinion, it's more a prediction based on gut instinct and I've mentioned the first part of it before.

Hamilton will win sixth WDC this year but that will be his last (this is what I've mentioned before). He will also not break Schumacher's 91 wins record.

My thinking is that Ferrari's momentum and engine power advantage will carry though to next season where they'll have the best package. Vettel or Leclerc win the WDC 2020.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:50 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Not sure this is an opinion, it's more a prediction based on gut instinct and I've mentioned the first part of it before.

Hamilton will win sixth WDC this year but that will be his last (this is what I've mentioned before). He will also not break Schumacher's 91 wins record.

My thinking is that Ferrari's momentum and engine power advantage will carry though to next season where they'll have the best package. Vettel or Leclerc win the WDC 2020.


Ferrari has had the car to win the championship the last 2 years and failed. I don't see why next year would be any different if they still have a slightly faster car. The Leclerc/Vettel dynamic is toxic while the Hamilton/Bottas partnership is a good one for Hamilton's championship aspirations. And I would never underestimate what Merc can do for next year's car. They have really underdeveloped this year's, so that might suggest that a lot of resources were allocated to next year's. And if that is the case, they may have a hell of a car next year.
But the leclerc and vettel pairing is so bad for the team in my opiinion that even if Ferrari are definitely faster and win the constructor's, Hamilton can still win the WDC.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2019 7:47 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
JN23 wrote:
Not sure this is an opinion, it's more a prediction based on gut instinct and I've mentioned the first part of it before.

Hamilton will win sixth WDC this year but that will be his last (this is what I've mentioned before). He will also not break Schumacher's 91 wins record.

My thinking is that Ferrari's momentum and engine power advantage will carry though to next season where they'll have the best package. Vettel or Leclerc win the WDC 2020.


Ferrari has had the car to win the championship the last 2 years and failed. I don't see why next year would be any different if they still have a slightly faster car. The Leclerc/Vettel dynamic is toxic while the Hamilton/Bottas partnership is a good one for Hamilton's championship aspirations. And I would never underestimate what Merc can do for next year's car. They have really underdeveloped this year's, so that might suggest that a lot of resources were allocated to next year's. And if that is the case, they may have a hell of a car next year.
But the leclerc and vettel pairing is so bad for the team in my opiinion that even if Ferrari are definitely faster and win the constructor's, Hamilton can still win the WDC.


My hunch is that the Ferrari car will be more than slightly better than the Merc, but I also see your point about Merc putting a lot of resources to next year.

There's not a whole lot of logic behind my predictions tbh, just gut feelings.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2019 10:57 pm 
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kleefton wrote:
JN23 wrote:
Not sure this is an opinion, it's more a prediction based on gut instinct and I've mentioned the first part of it before.

Hamilton will win sixth WDC this year but that will be his last (this is what I've mentioned before). He will also not break Schumacher's 91 wins record.

My thinking is that Ferrari's momentum and engine power advantage will carry though to next season where they'll have the best package. Vettel or Leclerc win the WDC 2020.


Ferrari has had the car to win the championship the last 2 years and failed. I don't see why next year would be any different if they still have a slightly faster car. The Leclerc/Vettel dynamic is toxic while the Hamilton/Bottas partnership is a good one for Hamilton's championship aspirations. And I would never underestimate what Merc can do for next year's car. They have really underdeveloped this year's, so that might suggest that a lot of resources were allocated to next year's. And if that is the case, they may have a hell of a car next year.
But the leclerc and vettel pairing is so bad for the team in my opiinion that even if Ferrari are definitely faster and win the constructor's, Hamilton can still win the WDC.


I agree.
Merc have not had to play team orders much for the last 6 years.
If Leclerc and VEttel are taking points off each other, Merc could fully back Hamilton and take the WDC.

And I can’t imagine VEttel being number 2 to Leclerc.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 8:21 am 
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Lewis might not beat 7 title (he may equal it depending on 2021), but I expect him to surpass 91 wins.

Merc isn't, in all liklihood, going to produce a dog in 2020, and Lewis will still get at least 5 wins. I can't see him only winning 3-4 times in 2021/22/23 to fail to surpass that. But then again.... who foreseen Alonso never winning again 6.5yrs ago in Spain?

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 11:45 am 
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Hamilton will leave Merc after winning his 7th drivers title title and join Ferrari. He'll win his 8th there.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:45 pm 
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Jezza13 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
In Singapore with KMag finishing outside the top 10 the fastest lap bonus point went to Bottas so that makes it:-

1. Hamilton 4
2. Bottas 3
2. Verstappen 3
4. Leclerc 2
4. Vettel 2
4. Gasly 2

WDC
1. Hamilton
2. Bottas
3. Leclerc
4. Verstappen
5. Vettel
6. Gasly

It's perhaps not quite the lottery it appears to be?


Did Bottas get the fastest lap point in Singapore though or was it just not awarded?

From F1.com

"There is, however, a condition for earning the point. Only drivers who are classified in the top 10 at the end of the race are eligible. If you achieve the feat and finish in 11th or lower (or fail to finish), no point will be allocated."

I have to ask though, what was the objective in introducing the fastest lap point in the first place ?

I never realised that so strategically a team not running in the points can attempt to take the point away from the competition, even a sister team helping out, this is not how it's done in the feeder categories.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:47 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
I don't really see the point (pun intended) in not giving the drivers outside of the top 10 a chance for the fastest lap point.

It would make the racing near the end farcical and imagine if the leader was in the way of one of these attempted laps, I'm thinking of Brazil 2018.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:09 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Not sure this is an opinion, it's more a prediction based on gut instinct and I've mentioned the first part of it before.

Hamilton will win sixth WDC this year but that will be his last (this is what I've mentioned before). He will also not break Schumacher's 91 wins record.

My thinking is that Ferrari's momentum and engine power advantage will carry though to next season where they'll have the best package. Vettel or Leclerc win the WDC 2020.

I think the 7th title will be harder than breaking the win record, Hamilton needs 10 more wins but still has about 3/4 years left in the sport, I think the win record will fall.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:39 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Not sure this is an opinion, it's more a prediction based on gut instinct and I've mentioned the first part of it before.

Hamilton will win sixth WDC this year but that will be his last (this is what I've mentioned before). He will also not break Schumacher's 91 wins record.

My thinking is that Ferrari's momentum and engine power advantage will carry though to next season where they'll have the best package. Vettel or Leclerc win the WDC 2020.


I agree, its not a given as some seem to think it is. Hamilton has addressed this recently when somebody was pushing him about the records. It seems so close when you look at 6 v 7, or 82 v 91. But that's the easy way to look at it. In reality you are looking at a driver at the back end of his career winning another 10 races and a further WDC. And you just have to look back at Alonso and Vettel when they were at the tail end of regularly winning and racking up the WDCs to see how hard it is to predict these things.
As Hamilton intimated, he would need some giant footsteps to conquer this particular mountain.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 7:39 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
I don't really see the point (pun intended) in not giving the drivers outside of the top 10 a chance for the fastest lap point.

There would also be the case that you would see teams that virtually never get points doing some of the most odd strategies to get fastest lap at the end. This would then have strange results with the team at the bottom at the championship possibly getting all their points this way. I think it makes perfect sense to only allow the top 10 to get this.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2019 5:58 am 
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pokerman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
I don't really see the point (pun intended) in not giving the drivers outside of the top 10 a chance for the fastest lap point.

It would make the racing near the end farcical and imagine if the leader was in the way of one of these attempted laps, I'm thinking of Brazil 2018.

I don't really think it would.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:46 am 
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Not precisely sure how unpopular this one will be, but...

Vettel should have had a race ban by now, and the only reason he hasn't is that the FIA is reluctant to give him penalty points for fear of just that outcome.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:54 am 
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Exediron wrote:
Not precisely sure how unpopular this one will be, but...

Vettel should have had a race ban by now, and the only reason he hasn't is that the FIA is reluctant to give him penalty points for fear of just that outcome.


I didn't think that "no action" was the appropriate decision for the Vettel-Leclerc incident. That was much more dangerous AND reckless than what Vettel did to earn a penalty in Canada. Of course here Vettel was not re-entering the track. A time penalty would have been irrelevant and meaningless since they were both out of any contention. I am not sure what would have been appropriate.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:33 am 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Not precisely sure how unpopular this one will be, but...

Vettel should have had a race ban by now, and the only reason he hasn't is that the FIA is reluctant to give him penalty points for fear of just that outcome.


I didn't think that "no action" was the appropriate decision for the Vettel-Leclerc incident. That was much more dangerous AND reckless than what Vettel did to earn a penalty in Canada. Of course here Vettel was not re-entering the track. A time penalty would have been irrelevant and meaningless since they were both out of any contention. I am not sure what would have been appropriate.

Well it would be nice to see them do SOMETHING. He basically did the same thing to Hamilton in Mexico and got away with it there too.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:41 am 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Not precisely sure how unpopular this one will be, but...

Vettel should have had a race ban by now, and the only reason he hasn't is that the FIA is reluctant to give him penalty points for fear of just that outcome.

I didn't think that "no action" was the appropriate decision for the Vettel-Leclerc incident. That was much more dangerous AND reckless than what Vettel did to earn a penalty in Canada. Of course here Vettel was not re-entering the track. A time penalty would have been irrelevant and meaningless since they were both out of any contention. I am not sure what would have been appropriate.

I think the current concept of tying penalty points to in-race penalties needs to get looked at. A time penalty for Vettel would certainly have been meaningless, but penalty points on his license were very much earned.

sandman1347 wrote:
Well it would be nice to see them do SOMETHING. He basically did the same thing to Hamilton in Mexico and got away with it there too.

Indeed, that would be one of the incidents I'm thinking of where he avoided points recently.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:08 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
Not precisely sure how unpopular this one will be, but...

Vettel should have had a race ban by now, and the only reason he hasn't is that the FIA is reluctant to give him penalty points for fear of just that outcome.

I agree. As I wrote on the race thread, Grosjean was handed a ban for less than what Vettel has done over the past 18 months. Also it's clear he shows no remorse and takes no responsibility for his actions, so some level of punishment is needed for him to perhaps actually reflect on what he is doing wrong.

How bad does it look for the sport if a 4 time champion with the 3rd highest win count gets a ban for persistent incompetent/dangerous driving? It must be on the FIA's minds.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:51 pm 
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j man wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Not precisely sure how unpopular this one will be, but...

Vettel should have had a race ban by now, and the only reason he hasn't is that the FIA is reluctant to give him penalty points for fear of just that outcome.

I agree. As I wrote on the race thread, Grosjean was handed a ban for less than what Vettel has done over the past 18 months. Also it's clear he shows no remorse and takes no responsibility for his actions, so some level of punishment is needed for him to perhaps actually reflect on what he is doing wrong.

How bad does it look for the sport if a 4 time champion with the 3rd highest win count gets a ban for persistent incompetent/dangerous driving? It must be on the FIA's minds.


He's also on about his third final warning regarding his general conduct anyway.


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