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AUSTRIA 2019
Ferrari lost it 19%  19%  [ 5 ]
Leclerc lost it 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Red Bull won it 15%  15%  [ 4 ]
Verstappen won it 67%  67%  [ 18 ]
Total votes : 27
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:08 pm 
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Interesting race with exciting finish, but who do you think made the difference? Who determined the result?

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:11 pm 
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Can you choose all of the above?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:29 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Can you choose all of the above?


So far unanimous at 4-0. Max made the win. Team mate was more than a lap down.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:34 pm 
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I felt it was an outstanding drive.

Obviously other things have to align to make an outstanding drive well errr.... outstanding.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:35 pm 
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Leclerc didnt appear to have the best of pace, the gap to Bottas remained pretty constant and Vettel appeared to be gaining slightly prior to his second stop (though he could have just been gaining on Bottas, I cant remember). He could have been managing his pace but I would have expected him to pick it up more towards the end when Max got past Vettel/Bottas if that were the case.

Verstappen on the other hand finished a lap ahead of his teammate. Normally the gap is pretty big between them but 70 seconds or whatever it ended up being was a lot larger than usual, especially when Verstappen was behind on the first lap.

Also on Friday/Saturday we saw the Ferrari much quicker in both one lap pace and race sims.

I think based on those factors that was a case of the driver winning, not the car. He was just the class of the field today IMO and tbh has been all season.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 11:45 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Can you choose all of the above?


So far unanimous at 4-0. Max made the win. Team mate was more than a lap down.

I voted Max won it too but I was being pedantic. Technically all 4 of those things happened.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:59 am 
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Leclerc probably didn't expect the result. And there's a chance he could have driven better earlier. It was obvious a win was on the cars when Verstappen was +14 secs behind P1. It surprised me when both Horner and Max said they only thought about the win when he was second. It's possibe Ferrari also took it lightly. So I would say both Ferrari and Leclerc lost it.

Verstappen also drove the race of his life. But I think somehow the car just worked with the tires. This wasn't Red Bull's actual pace. The temperatures probably hit the sweet spot for the car, making it half a second faster than what it is supposed to be. Maxmillian also drove amazingly in the first stint. First I thought about the win was when he wasn't losing time leading the race. I thought hey, he could win here.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 3:06 am 
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This race is very similar to Suzuka 2005. The driver at the front just chilling just assuming he's won the race. Meanwhile a driver from way back is charging and then finally overtakes in the final laps of the race.

I felt bad for Leclerc but he really should have not lost here.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:27 am 
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The team won it. The driver is only as fast as the car . Max had a horrible start but as the race went he got better and better. Ferrari did not have great race again. Vettel pitstop was horrible. He should have had podium otherwise. Who I thought looked faster than Charles. With Mercedes having overheating problems this was Ferrari chance to win. Vettel engine problem in qualifying din't help them

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:19 am 
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Ferrari screwed up BIGTIME!

They needed to tell Leclerc to push in order to pull a gap the moment they saw Verstappen was on a charge. Just another feather in Ferrari’s proverbial strategy Tom
Foolery the last several years.

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HAMILTON :: ALONSO :: VETTEL :: RAIKKONEN :: RICCIARDO :: VERSTAPPEN
BOTTAS :: MAGNUSSEN :: OCON :: SAINZ :: PEREZ :: VANDOORNE :: HULKENBERG
GROSJEAN :: GASLY :: ERICSON :: LECLERC :: STROLL :: SEROTKIN :: HARTLEY


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:32 am 
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Ferrari screwed up BIGTIME!

They needed to tell Leclerc to push in order to pull a gap the moment they saw Verstappen was on a charge. Just another feather in Ferrari’s proverbial strategy Tom
Foolery the last several years.

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HAMILTON :: ALONSO :: VETTEL :: RAIKKONEN :: RICCIARDO :: VERSTAPPEN
BOTTAS :: MAGNUSSEN :: OCON :: SAINZ :: PEREZ :: VANDOORNE :: HULKENBERG
GROSJEAN :: GASLY :: ERICSON :: LECLERC :: STROLL :: SEROTKIN :: HARTLEY


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:49 am 
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F1 MERCENARY wrote:
Ferrari screwed up BIGTIME!

They needed to tell Leclerc to push in order to pull a gap the moment they saw Verstappen was on a charge. Just another feather in Ferrari’s proverbial strategy Tom
Foolery the last several years.

They screwed up in a more comprehensive manner than you're giving them credit for. It started on Saturday when they chose to qualify on the soft tires despite having seen the weather forecast. I thought they must have known what they were doing there but it turns out that they really didn't. I think a big part of why Max won was that he pitted 10 laps later than Charles and he had better tires at the end.

But yeah, they also lacked a sense of urgency until the point where Max was through on Vettel. They should have responded when they saw Max closing Vettel down so quickly and had Charles pull out that lead while his tires were still good and while Max was dealing with traffic. By the time they told him to push, it was too late to get away.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:16 am 
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Max drove well but race conditions and circumstances conspired to make him shine even more brightly. Mercedes were neutered and Ferrari messed up their strategy and surely didn't eke out all the advantage they could have over the Mercedes at the front with Leclerc. I was impressed with Leclerc's defence at the end but unimpressed with his instincts and overmanagement of the race. Overall I think Leclerc's performance is being overrated and Red Bull had an obvious advantage in the race which Max made use of despite going into anti-stall at the start and then producing clumsy racecraft to finally finish the job. For the cherry on top which makes Verstappen shine even more brightly is the insipid performance of his teammate.

In the end, it's difficult for me to choose a poll option. Max won it as much as Leclerc and his strategist lost it. Max got away with losing his patience after being frustrated by the savvy defence of Leclerc the previous lap but I think such racecraft is going to further open up discussion about the rules and expectations of racing wheel-to-wheel.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:11 am 
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Combination really. I that voted Ferrari lost, as primarily if they had hurried Charles up and didn't mess the strategy then it wouldn't matter what Max did anyway


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:39 am 
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Amazing drive from Max and I agree with Blagflag in that he is the standout driver this season.
Just a thought though, if Lewis didn’t change his front wing, the time loss that Verstappen would incur overtaking means Leclerc holds on.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:50 am 
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Leclerc was driving the best car this weekend. Max himself was the crucial factor that decided this race

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:14 am 
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https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/repo ... ace-report

Good race report by Mark Hughes, also explains why the soft strategy didn't lose Ferrari the race and the thinking behind it.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:24 am 
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Ferrari lost it - yes, because they were unaware of the Max danger, and did tell Charles to push and build a gap.
Leclerc lost it - yes, his defending was girlish, just sitting there on his line doing nothing. No aggression, not even a slight attempt to keep Max back.
Red Bull won it - yes, they had a monstrous package, and lets see in the following races will they start to bet at least Ferrari.
Verstappen won it - yes, magnanimous race, it was performance seen once in 100 races. Incredible.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 1:37 pm 
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Ferrari lost it.
They pitted a few laps too early, i did not see any sign of them losing pace on the softs. They tried to cover merc that was not a threat. If they pitted later the hard tires would have been in better condition by the time Max caught them
They messed up Vettels stop, so he ended up using a lot of rubber trying to catch/pass cars up instead of using it to defend from Max.
Lastly they fell asleep while controlling the race.
Take nothing away from Max and the RBR package this week (they made it a race of the season), but after Max's poor start, it was Ferrari's race to lose.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:37 pm 
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Lt. Drebin wrote:
Ferrari lost it - yes, because they were unaware of the Max danger, and did tell Charles to push and build a gap.
Leclerc lost it - yes, his defending was girlish, just sitting there on his line doing nothing. No aggression, not even a slight attempt to keep Max back.
Red Bull won it - yes, they had a monstrous package, and lets see in the following races will they start to bet at least Ferrari.
Verstappen won it - yes, magnanimous race, it was performance seen once in 100 races. Incredible.


Ferrari lost it in Q2 with going with softs to start the race on.

The only reason Max looked so good was he had 10 lap fresher tyres on a hot day.

The fastest lap was almost half a second slower than 2018, and the overall average lap time was also slower than Max’s 2018 win.
The 2019 cars are much quicker, so this race was an anomaly only due to high track temperature.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:53 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
F1 MERCENARY wrote:
Ferrari screwed up BIGTIME!

They needed to tell Leclerc to push in order to pull a gap the moment they saw Verstappen was on a charge. Just another feather in Ferrari’s proverbial strategy Tom
Foolery the last several years.

They screwed up in a more comprehensive manner than you're giving them credit for. It started on Saturday when they chose to qualify on the soft tires despite having seen the weather forecast. I thought they must have known what they were doing there but it turns out that they really didn't. I think a big part of why Max won was that he pitted 10 laps later than Charles and he had better tires at the end.

But yeah, they also lacked a sense of urgency until the point where Max was through on Vettel. They should have responded when they saw Max closing Vettel down so quickly and had Charles pull out that lead while his tires were still good and while Max was dealing with traffic. By the time they told him to push, it was too late to get away.

I think it gets even worse still. According to the tyre usage graphic posted on the race thread, Ferrari didn't even have a fresh set of hard tyres for Leclerc's second stint. That if you ask me is the biggest blunder of all.


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