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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 6:42 pm 
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Oz_karter asks whether "..a change in Red Bull setup following Monaco..." could be a reason for Dan's apparent drop in performance.

Yet when this allegedly happened to Vettel in 2014 when the Rec Bull's handling/whatever did not suit him, many fans slammed Vettel for making excuses and reckoned that Ricciardo was just superior.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 6:58 pm 
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red_alert wrote:
Shame about all these Ves suppoters not addressing Ric superior qualifying or saying its not as important as the race, monaco begs to differ. I'd say Austria is the only race where Ves was 'faster' and didnt rely on the team to get a better result.


It's incredibly impressive for an 18 to be right up with a top tier driver after just 4 races with his new team. Quite honestly I've been astounded by Verstappen since he moved up to Red Bull. Partly I guess because I rate Ricciardo so highly.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 7:00 pm 
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If Ricciardo had a weaker teammate, he would have gotten another 4th place finish yesterday, like he did consistently in the first part of the season. And most people would have said: that's a very good result, only finishing behind the two Mercs and the one Ferrari. We would have assumed that he got everything out of that car and that the 31 sec gap to the race winner was all down to the car/PU. We wouldn't even have known that he was seriously off the pace yesterday.

But in the current situation he is unhappy, because he isn't on the podium, with or in place of, Verstappen. In the end this can only be good for RBR, and ultimately Daniel too. But he needs to stop the now emerging trend, if he want to be seen as the 'top dog' (his quote) at the team.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 7:24 pm 
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TypingChicane wrote:
If Ricciardo had a weaker teammate, he would have gotten another 4th place finish yesterday, like he did consistently in the first part of the season. And most people would have said: that's a very good result, only finishing behind the two Mercs and the one Ferrari. We would have assumed that he got everything out of that car and that the 31 sec gap to the race winner was all down to the car/PU. We wouldn't even have known that he was seriously off the pace yesterday.

But in the current situation he is unhappy, because he isn't on the podium, with or in place of, Verstappen. In the end this can only be good for RBR, and ultimately Daniel too. But he needs to stop the now emerging trend, if he want to be seen as the 'top dog' (his quote) at the team.


As I was trying to point out in earlier posts, I don't think there is an emerging trend.
He recent performances have been hampered by certain circuits that don't favour Red Bull and a few unfortunate incidents (having to avoid Rosberg in Canada losing a place).
All except in Austria during the race where he didn't look quick at all. And losing 4 places in the opening 4-6 laps was quite strange imo. He had a good start gaining a place, but went backwards the whole race.
If he gets beaten by Max at races like Spa, Hungry and Singapore then I will agree Max has his measure.
Red Bull was a clear number 2 in Monaco, but after the recent Ferrari tweaks, Red Bull are the 3rd best car and Merc and Ferrari seem closer than ever.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 9:12 pm 
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red_alert wrote:
Shame about all these Ves suppoters not addressing Ric superior qualifying or saying its not as important as the race, monaco begs to differ. I'd say Austria is the only race where Ves was 'faster' and didnt rely on the team to get a better result.

Apparently you didn't like the answer when you previously brought up the qualifying since you didn't reply, but mds was spot on.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 10:26 pm 
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Don't you think maybe an official Max Verstappen thread would be the right place for people to do nothing but talk about how great Max is? I can't imagine anyone really comes to this one to hear that.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 2:59 am 
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pokerman wrote:
mds wrote:
red_alert wrote:
Ric is fine, out qualifies Vestappen comfortably. Probably a bit off after RB team let him down twice - should of had two wins (Spain & Monaco) and Ves would have none. Ric is also good for NOT binning the car in wall unlike his younger team mate.


Ricciardo has binned it too on occasion. Last time was two weeks ago. Drivers make mistakes - it happens, and the younger ones more. Outqualifying is one thing but what use is there if your teammate passes you in the race?

He's a great driver but at the moment I don't think he is very happy - he is yet to have a race where he is demonstrably faster than his team mate. I don't think he would have expected that.

I think at Monaco he easily had the beating of Max.


Max didn't have the upgraded engine in Monaco.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 3:01 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
red_alert wrote:
Shame about all these Ves suppoters not addressing Ric superior qualifying or saying its not as important as the race, monaco begs to differ. I'd say Austria is the only race where Ves was 'faster' and didnt rely on the team to get a better result.


It's incredibly impressive for an 18 to be right up with a top tier driver after just 4 races with his new team. Quite honestly I've been astounded by Verstappen since he moved up to Red Bull. Partly I guess because I rate Ricciardo so highly.


Me too.

What's happening at Redbull right now is resembling what is happening over at Force India. One guy always qualifies his teammate but gets beaten on race day consistently. I hope that trend does not continue for Ricciardo's sake but who knows? Max is just a genius.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 6:07 am 
Is that true though? Ricciardo should have won both in Spain and Monaco had he not fallen victim to his teams brainfarts. And how many races have they had together so far? I think it's a bit early to say that VES has beaten RIC consistently yet. Also, not to take anything away from VES he is very impressive, but he has had some silly crashes too when he has been pushing too hard.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:11 am 
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Randine wrote:
Ric was within or around 1 second range in Canada for more than 10 laps including fighting with Vettel for 3 of them. For Ric to sit very closely behind waiting for Max to pull over would be stupid. Max has a history of ignoring team orders. I think had Ric got past him early on, he could have easily pulled a gap to Max.


Of course you "think" so. It's conjecture. And that Max ignored team orders before doesn't mean he ignored one in Canada. Again: he wasn't asked to move over, there was no follow-up call, again my conclusion is that you saying he ignored a team order is unfair and incorrect.

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Again ignoring Ric lifting to avoid Rosberg at the start, who did Max overtake on track that day? No one. So yes some teams could overtake in Canada, Red Bull wasn't one of them.


I'm not ignoring anything. Just saying he did just as well. And maybe Red Bull couldn't overtake other cars, but if a Red Bull can overtake a Red Bull in Austria I have no idea why a Red Bull would not be able to overtake a Red Bull in Canada.

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Baku, the pecking order of the track on race day had the Red Bull as 4th or 5th fastest.
So Ric going from 3rd to 7th and Max from 9th to 8th has nothing to do with a worse drive by Ricciardo.


It does if 6 places difference at the start are reduced to a second at the finish.

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Re tyre wear. Twice Kimi has displayed similar tyre life to Max when following when Max has had clear air. (Spain and Austria) So yes, some tracks you can follow more easily and not be punished, and others like Canada, it is more critical.


We've seen in the past that Spain will also punish drivers for following closely.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:16 am 
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red_alert wrote:
Shame about all these Ves suppoters not addressing Ric superior qualifying or saying its not as important as the race, monaco begs to differ. I'd say Austria is the only race where Ves was 'faster' and didnt rely on the team to get a better result.

Clearly today tyre-management is more important than qualifying. Well at least if your name is not Hamilton or Rosberg it is.
Street-tracks like Monaco is a different ballgame.

Some people seem to forget Ricciardo already knows the car inside out, whereas Verstappen got in midseason. So yes, he should be able to put in better laptimes.


Last edited by Knuppel1983 on Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:16 am 
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Exediron wrote:
Don't you think maybe an official Max Verstappen thread would be the right place for people to do nothing but talk about how great Max is? I can't imagine anyone really comes to this one to hear that.


I saw things I didn't agree with and I responded reasoned and politely. I don't see why anyone would have a problem with that?

I'm not here to say how great Verstappen is. I just adressed this notion that everything is great and wonderful for Ricciardo.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 4:11 pm 
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mds wrote:
Randine wrote:
Ric was within or around 1 second range in Canada for more than 10 laps including fighting with Vettel for 3 of them. For Ric to sit very closely behind waiting for Max to pull over would be stupid. Max has a history of ignoring team orders. I think had Ric got past him early on, he could have easily pulled a gap to Max.


Of course you "think" so. It's conjecture. And that Max ignored team orders before doesn't mean he ignored one in Canada. Again: he wasn't asked to move over, there was no follow-up call, again my conclusion is that you saying he ignored a team order is unfair and incorrect.

Quote:
Again ignoring Ric lifting to avoid Rosberg at the start, who did Max overtake on track that day? No one. So yes some teams could overtake in Canada, Red Bull wasn't one of them.


I'm not ignoring anything. Just saying he did just as well. And maybe Red Bull couldn't overtake other cars, but if a Red Bull can overtake a Red Bull in Austria I have no idea why a Red Bull would not be able to overtake a Red Bull in Canada.

Quote:
Baku, the pecking order of the track on race day had the Red Bull as 4th or 5th fastest.
So Ric going from 3rd to 7th and Max from 9th to 8th has nothing to do with a worse drive by Ricciardo.


It does if 6 places difference at the start are reduced to a second at the finish.

Quote:
Re tyre wear. Twice Kimi has displayed similar tyre life to Max when following when Max has had clear air. (Spain and Austria) So yes, some tracks you can follow more easily and not be punished, and others like Canada, it is more critical.


We've seen in the past that Spain will also punish drivers for following closely.


MDS, how do you know there were no follow up calls in Canada for Max to move over?
Yes I 'think' Ric would have been faster. Why he fought hard against Seb as he believed he was racing him that day for 3 laps. (He qualified 2 tenths behind) MAx gave up that position very cheaply in less than half a lap or less.

Re Baku, so what if he ended up 1 spot behind. What about Rosberg in Russia 2014, starting pit lane, pitted after the first lap and then drove to 2nd to end 1 place behind Hamilton. According to you that would mean that Hamilton had a bad race compared to Rosberg.

And all your other points you have made with me about this stuff, you are not looking at the full picture. You just bring in info to suit your stance on it and missing or overlooking key pieces of information.
I have been very fair of my assessment of Max.
I think he has raced well and probably gained near the maximum available out of each race.

My position on it all is this. Out of all of the races so far since they have been at the same team, only Austria is the only one you can compare them due to the more open nature of the track, and that both had clear air.
So when I defend Ricciardo, it is not to say he is better, it is to explain why he was not optimal on that day. And you have done nothing to change my assessment 1 little bit.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:01 pm 
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Randine wrote:
MDS, how do you know there were no follow up calls in Canada for Max to move over?


OK. I don't. Now, how do you know that Max's pace after the SC was not satisfying for Ricciardo? You probably don't know that either. So sticking to the facts, your statement that Max disobeyed team orders remains unfair and not backed up by facts.

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Yes I 'think' Ric would have been faster. Why he fought hard against Seb as he believed he was racing him that day for 3 laps. (He qualified 2 tenths behind) MAx gave up that position very cheaply in less than half a lap or less.


1. Ricciardo didn't fight Vettel for 3 laps - not anywhere near that. Vettel entered Ricciardo's DRS range somewhere during lap 16 and had passed him one lap later.
2. So Max gave up position a bit sooner - and? His defense against Rosberg in the same race in a car SO much faster was among the best I've ever seen.

Quote:
Re Baku, so what if he ended up 1 spot behind. What about Rosberg in Russia 2014, starting pit lane, pitted after the first lap and then drove to 2nd to end 1 place behind Hamilton. According to you that would mean that Hamilton had a bad race compared to Rosberg.


Unnecessary straw man argument here. I never said Ricciardo had a bad race compared to a good one from Verstappen. All I said was that I thought Verstappen's race pace was better. I didn't even say by how much - just that I believed it to be better.

Quote:
And all your other points you have made with me about this stuff, you are not looking at the full picture. You just bring in info to suit your stance on it and missing or overlooking key pieces of information.


How so? What key pieces of information am I missing? All I'm saying is that from the races we can assess, Max's race pace has looked on par in two (Canada and Spain) and better in Baku and Austria. That is my opinion on it and I don't think it is that unfair nor unbalanced.

Quote:
My position on it all is this. Out of all of the races so far since they have been at the same team, only Austria is the only one you can compare them due to the more open nature of the track, and that both had clear air.
So when I defend Ricciardo, it is not to say he is better, it is to explain why he was not optimal on that day. And you have done nothing to change my assessment 1 little bit.


Well, I don't see why I shouldn't be able to say that Verstappen seemed as fast as Ricciardo in Spain, for example. I honestly don't.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 4:48 am 
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Ok MDS, we are finally getting closer to what I have been pointing out all along. Which is that a few tracks that don't suit Red Bull and a few but of bad luck have meant that Ric hasn't got the maximum.
And that comparison between the drivers has been either not really possible.

Re your other points:
Ricciardo did battle with Seb in Canada for quite a while all while staying only 1 second behind Max. I rewatched this after the race and it certainly was more than 2 laps.

On Max's defence of Rosberg, yes, it was an amazing bit of driving. However his tyres weren't as fresh and it was clear he didn't have as good a drive out of the hair pin. Reason being he was able to get the moves done before the corner on Raikonen and others. However with Max he was right on top of him going into the chicane. Max's move to the inside blocked him very nicely.

In Baku, the top 6 all 1 stopped. Both Red Bull's 2 stopped. So at the moment this is where I still disagree with you in that Ric got beaten by better strategy by the guys in front.
And the Red Bull was clearly better than McLaren, Renault etc etc making it most likely that the Red Bull's would end up near each other no matter how well either of them drove.
So I don't agree that Max was quicker in Baku accept in the closing stages after Ric battled with Hulk for quite a while and I think both Hulk and Ric ruined their tyres in that exchange.
In the end Max was able to overtake Hulk too (hulk 1 stopped) as his tyres had given up.
I remember thinking that Ric was doing a great job to even be fighting with Hulk as Perez beat Raikonen on pace that day to get his podium.

Tone is hard to read in text. If from my posts you think I am saying Ric is the man and he does no wrong, then that is not my intention at all. I have just been pointing out where I think he lost out and where little things might have changed the outcome significantly. Personally I have been disappointed with his recent performances, but on analysis and reflection, I don't think there is a pattern.

Ric certainly makes mistakes. Eg crashing under the bridge in Singapore a few years back, hitting the wall of champions in quali in Canada, crashing in Baku practise.
Some of his late braking moves have been right on the limit of reckless. His move on Raikonen in Monaco last year for example was probably lucky to escape penalty.
I believe some of his moves have been a little in desperation. He came into Red Bull when the car was getting worse (in comparison to rivals). He won 3 times in his first year, and nothing since then.

I believe if they get that Renault engine up to Merc and Ferrari, this reckless side of his driving will go as he will have the proper tools to overtake etc.
Red Bull are always running less downforce than they would like due to the power deficit. (And less than Merc does).

Some drivers have luck on their side. Eg Vettel. (Who I rate very highly) He was lucky that in 2008, his Toro Rosso which had Ferrari power was actually a better package than Red Bull. They easily out scored them in the constructors. That is partly why he was able to get a win in the Toro Rosso.
When Seb got to Red Bull, the car could win its first year (after the FIA let Renault upgrade their under powered V8 for 2009). And it was improving massively until its peak of Seb's huge amount of wins in a row in 2013. The only year Seb hasn't been in a race winning car since 2008 is this year (so Far). (Even though he didn't win a race in 2014, his team mate did)
Contrast that to Ricciardo getting to Red Bull at a time of decline and getting worse.
And then maybe compare that to Max arriving at a time when Red Bull is on a upswing and looking to next year, could be the leading team.
Webber had bad luck, and maybe Ric does too.
Vettel had good luck, and it looks like Max does too.
However you do make your own luck to a certain extent and Max certainly does have the skills to back it up. It is certainly no luck he is in F1, and now in a top team.

I am looking forward to seeing how this battle between Max and Ric progresses. It could be as heated as Hamilton and Rosberg as soon as next year!

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 7:01 am 
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Randine wrote:
Tone is hard to read in text. If from my posts you think I am saying Ric is the man and he does no wrong, then that is not my intention at all.


Well no, I didn't think of it that way. I think we mostly differ in opinion when you say we can't compare them in Baku, Canada or Spain, whereas I feel we can do so. There's no doubt in my mind that more has gone wrong for Ricciardo than for Verstappen. Such was the case in Spain, no doubt, but I still feel we can realistically say Verstappen was on the same pace as Ricciardo that day.

Anyway, as you say they will be together for the rest of the season and for next season as well. We'll see how it all plays out.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 2:25 am 
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Ric fan here. I think max is doing an overall excellent job. Probably a bit better than dan in the races(not Monaco obviously)


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:37 am 
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The PF1 Forum unofficial DOTW says Ric is better than Ves over the course of a weekend for this season so far - that is a whole forum of opinion - I guess there are more Ric fans that Ves fans though... you can find a counter argument and have an opinion for anything.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 12:16 pm 
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DR fans want him to do well, but F1 fans understand that racing is about driving - so currently DR is a bit ahead - if not all ways as MV is fast and doing well at many circuits

so what is the verdict?


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 12:17 pm 
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DR fans want him to do well, but F1 fans understand that racing is about driving - so currently DR is a bit ahead - if not all ways as MV is fast and doing well at many circuits

so what is the verdict?


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 5:28 pm 
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Speaking for all the Dutch MV fans (many...). There is no hatred against Ricciardo. We all want to see who comes out on top (not in the Merc way please). Daniel is a likeable guy with his all day smiling and we want to see hik beat Merc just as much as MV. Daniel just needs to watch out he doesn't get bitter in his effort to beat his younger teammate.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:03 am 
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Ricciardo 'done' with Red Bull after another DNF.

Daniel Ricciardo says he is "done" with his misfiring Red bull car after suffering an eighth DNF of the season at the Mexican Grand Prix. The Australian's pole-position joy of Saturday soon turned to familiar misery on Sunday as he ground to a halt from second position nine laps from the end.

Source: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ricciardo ... sly-drive/

Source: https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/3206 ... xxyYV7OKO8


"Let Gasly drive it!!"


It's hard to believe that Daniel's that much harder on equipment than Max!! We'll see how Pierre does.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:44 am 
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I think Ricciardo realised it was time to leave after Baku. It was his Webber Turkey 2010 moment, and that even if Red Bull were fair with the drivers, it was Max they want to win. Ultimately, he's never going to be given the support to win at Red Bull, it's better to take a gamble on an upcoming team than have his legacy be as the team mate who finished second to Max. Particularly given it was be as a perceived equal rather than a contractually assigned number 2.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:47 am 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Ricciardo 'done' with Red Bull after another DNF.

Daniel Ricciardo says he is "done" with his misfiring Red bull car after suffering an eighth DNF of the season at the Mexican Grand Prix. The Australian's pole-position joy of Saturday soon turned to familiar misery on Sunday as he ground to a halt from second position nine laps from the end.

Source: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ricciardo ... sly-drive/

Source: https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/3206 ... xxyYV7OKO8


"Let Gasly drive it!!"


It's hard to believe that Daniel's that much harder on equipment than Max!! We'll see how Pierre does.

He might want to be careful making comments like that unless he means it.

Feel for the guy this year, 8 DNFs.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:18 am 
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Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
Ricciardo 'done' with Red Bull after another DNF.

Daniel Ricciardo says he is "done" with his misfiring Red bull car after suffering an eighth DNF of the season at the Mexican Grand Prix. The Australian's pole-position joy of Saturday soon turned to familiar misery on Sunday as he ground to a halt from second position nine laps from the end.

Source: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ricciardo ... sly-drive/

Source: https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/3206 ... xxyYV7OKO8


"Let Gasly drive it!!"


It's hard to believe that Daniel's that much harder on equipment than Max!! We'll see how Pierre does.

He might want to be careful making comments like that unless he means it.

Feel for the guy this year, 8 DNFs.

He's leaving in two races. I doubt he'd mind all that much if they did promote Gasly now, although I don't believe he would drive the Toro Rosso in such a case. He'd probably be alright sitting two races out, though,

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:52 am 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
I think Ricciardo realised it was time to leave after Baku. It was his Webber Turkey 2010 moment, and that even if Red Bull were fair with the drivers, it was Max they want to win. Ultimately, he's never going to be given the support to win at Red Bull, it's better to take a gamble on an upcoming team than have his legacy be as the team mate who finished second to Max. Particularly given it was be as a perceived equal rather than a contractually assigned number 2.


I do think the team has backed Max, and whilst not sabotaging Ricciardo, I do feel he is maybe not getting the same level of support.

And.... I mean Max may be getting the better parts from a QA perspective, more human resource spent on car build and set up, etc.

I do believe all teams will do this to their number 1. Number 2s generally seem to have worse luck than the number 1s.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:56 am 
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Exediron wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
Ricciardo 'done' with Red Bull after another DNF.

Daniel Ricciardo says he is "done" with his misfiring Red bull car after suffering an eighth DNF of the season at the Mexican Grand Prix. The Australian's pole-position joy of Saturday soon turned to familiar misery on Sunday as he ground to a halt from second position nine laps from the end.

Source: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ricciardo ... sly-drive/

Source: https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/3206 ... xxyYV7OKO8


"Let Gasly drive it!!"


It's hard to believe that Daniel's that much harder on equipment than Max!! We'll see how Pierre does.

He might want to be careful making comments like that unless he means it.

Feel for the guy this year, 8 DNFs.

He's leaving in two races. I doubt he'd mind all that much if they did promote Gasly now, although I don't believe he would drive the Toro Rosso in such a case. He'd probably be alright sitting two races out, though,


Ideally he'd want to finish the season for his new team as would Gasly, but that would require a bit of shuffling round. It would need Alonso or Vandoorne to step down early to accomadate Sainz too perhaps.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:15 pm 
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Can't say what Daniel's results would be in Brazil and Abu Dhabi, but if they would be repeats of the last couple of races (US & Mexico), I think that Daniel is probably better off sitting them out. He can start spending time with Team McLaren making connections and learning the team in actual race weekends. If Red Bull cuts him loose, then he might even try a test drive in the current car.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:02 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Can't say what Daniel's results would be in Brazil and Abu Dhabi, but if they would be repeats of the last couple of races (US & Mexico), I think that Daniel is probably better off sitting them out. He can start spending time with Team McLaren making connections and learning the team in actual race weekends. If Red Bull cuts him loose, then he might even try a test drive in the current car.


I'm not sure what he'd learn from spending time with Team Mclaren :lol: (I'm being churlish, I know you mean Renault). I'm just not sure who Red Bull would put in his seat for the rest of the season.

If it was Gasly would mean TR would have to find someone else to finish the season. And actually Red Bull would probably be better served by Gasly having more time with a Honda engined car.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:54 pm 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
Ricciardo 'done' with Red Bull after another DNF.

Daniel Ricciardo says he is "done" with his misfiring Red bull car after suffering an eighth DNF of the season at the Mexican Grand Prix. The Australian's pole-position joy of Saturday soon turned to familiar misery on Sunday as he ground to a halt from second position nine laps from the end.

Source: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ricciardo ... sly-drive/

Source: https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/3206 ... xxyYV7OKO8


"Let Gasly drive it!!"


It's hard to believe that Daniel's that much harder on equipment than Max!! We'll see how Pierre does.

He might want to be careful making comments like that unless he means it.

Feel for the guy this year, 8 DNFs.

He's leaving in two races. I doubt he'd mind all that much if they did promote Gasly now, although I don't believe he would drive the Toro Rosso in such a case. He'd probably be alright sitting two races out, though,


Ideally he'd want to finish the season for his new team as would Gasly, but that would require a bit of shuffling round. It would need Alonso or Vandoorne to step down early to accomadate Sainz too perhaps.

I could see Alonso not minding given his situation, he skipped a race last year to do the Indy500.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:29 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
I could see Alonso not minding given his situation, he skipped a race last year to do the Indy500.

I think he would mind, but purely because it would deny him a proper opportunity to do a farewell race. Doing a final race and knowing it's going to be your last (which, realistically, it will be) is different from just suddenly retiring with two races to go because someone wanted to stop driving a different car. I don't see Alonso going for it purely because of that: he'll want to make a proper event of his final race.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:30 am 
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Exediron wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I could see Alonso not minding given his situation, he skipped a race last year to do the Indy500.

I think he would mind, but purely because it would deny him a proper opportunity to do a farewell race. Doing a final race and knowing it's going to be your last (which, realistically, it will be) is different from just suddenly retiring with two races to go because someone wanted to stop driving a different car. I don't see Alonso going for it purely because of that: he'll want to make a proper event of his final race.

:thumbup: :nod:

Yeah, I don't see Fernando getting out of the seat just so Daniel can sit down.

OTOH, I would love to see Sky Sports engage Daniel as a commentator for the last two races. He could probably tell some wonderful stories. Even better, have him do the broadcast and give us a break from Crofty for the last two races. :D

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:57 am 
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Exediron wrote:
pokerman wrote:
I could see Alonso not minding given his situation, he skipped a race last year to do the Indy500.

I think he would mind, but purely because it would deny him a proper opportunity to do a farewell race. Doing a final race and knowing it's going to be your last (which, realistically, it will be) is different from just suddenly retiring with two races to go because someone wanted to stop driving a different car. I don't see Alonso going for it purely because of that: he'll want to make a proper event of his final race.

Yeah I totally forgot about Alonso's own ego as such.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:57 am 
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Realistically I'm certain Daniel will finish the season with Red Bull. He was emotional and angry after the back to back painful weekends. In essence he simply threw a tantrum.

When the dust settles, he'll be a pro and turn up to Brazil and Abu Dhabi.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:53 am 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
Realistically I'm certain Daniel will finish the season with Red Bull. He was emotional and angry after the back to back painful weekends. In essence he simply threw a tantrum.

When the dust settles, he'll be a pro and turn up to Brazil and Abu Dhabi.

Image
Source: https://gifrific.com/

I am not convinced. I will be watching.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:27 pm 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
Realistically I'm certain Daniel will finish the season with Red Bull. He was emotional and angry after the back to back painful weekends. In essence he simply threw a tantrum.

When the dust settles, he'll be a pro and turn up to Brazil and Abu Dhabi.

Yes, this is what I think too. They are professionals


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:36 pm 
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Ricciardo's stock is significantly lower than it was after 2014. Back then he looked like a champion in waiting, Red Bull's new rising star. Now it's looking entirely possible that he'll never be world champ. He has taken a career defining gamble.

Verstappen's emergence shook things up big time at Red Bull. But Ricciardo was back in a strong bargaining position in early 2018, podiums, an opportunistic China win and a stunning Monaco performance all while Max seemed to be making constant mistakes.

Since that point though, Max has strung together a lot of results while Ricciardo has had mechanical failure after mechanical failure. And there is no escaping the fact that Max has looked the quicker of the two more often than not.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:40 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
OTOH, I would love to see Sky Sports engage Daniel as a commentator for the last two races. He could probably tell some wonderful stories. Even better, have him do the broadcast and give us a break from Crofty for the last two races. :D


That would be awesome :D

Here's an idea... we currently have 21 races and 20 drivers. Each driver sits out a race weekend and has to commentate for that weekend. The best gets a special trophy at the end of the season and the privilege of commentating for a second time in the final race 8)


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:50 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
OTOH, I would love to see Sky Sports engage Daniel as a commentator for the last two races. He could probably tell some wonderful stories. Even better, have him do the broadcast and give us a break from Crofty for the last two races. :D


That would be awesome :D

Here's an idea... we currently have 21 races and 20 drivers. Each driver sits out a race weekend and has to commentate for that weekend. The best gets a special trophy at the end of the season and the privilege of commentating for a second time in the final race 8)


That idea is not without merit. Don't know how you would get the winning driver out of the car in the last race though!! :?

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