I stuck this up not long ago in one of the other threads. As they're soon to be no more I've c&p'd it here. Would still love to actually get some specific feedback from anyone who agrees with the statements in blue. It's not exactly about whether Pirelli got it right but if this is the official tyre thread it will have to diversify a little. Duped post follows, if you read it already there's nothing new:
We're going round in circles, I'd love to hear responses to these specific points, maybe we can get this debate moving somewhere interesting!Sorry to shout but I can't bring myself to start a new thread on this!
I suggest:
1. The tyre sweet spot is so small and hard to identify that teams can only find it with a dose of luck. It’s so important that whoever finds it has a good chance of winning the race. Therefore there is significantly more luck involved in winning than there used to be.
2. The way the tyres degrade means that drivers are simply cruising around 4 seconds within the limit rather than adapting their style to reign in the limit and lap close to it.I've taken some specific views, expressed repeatedly in these threads (the blue text), and responded in the way I think makes sense (the normal text underneath the blue). I'd love to get some specific responses countering my opinion.
(F1) Drivers haven't been going "flat out" all race for years.No they haven’t. I’d argue they never have and in grand prix racing they shouldn’t. But preserving the tyres should be a skill, not a game of patience. See below.
If (legendary tyre destroyer) Hamilton can make them last then what's everyone else's excuse?It's not just about making them last but making them work. But this demonstrates one of the key points: it doesn’t matter how you drive the tyres, it only matters how fast you drive them. All you can do to make them last is drive to a delta time. It’s about self control more than skill or style. Figuring out how to go fast whilst preserving the tyre has always been a key F1 skill, but with the current Pirelli’s it’s become comparatively redundant. Previously you were usually on the edge of adhesion given the temperatures you were trying to maintain and the style you were deploying etc. With these tyres you aren’t. They’ve also neutralised a key ‘weakness’: having a driving style that’s inherently hard on the tyres. Hamilton can make his tyres last as long as Button because the way you drive them doesn’t really matter, only how fast you go. And when you’re driving 4 seconds a lap within yourself, even the most wild style is smooth.
They all get the same tyres. If one team can make them work then the others just need to work harder/be cleverer/change their car.Normally, yes. But if the sweet spot is so small that the best engineers in the world can only find it occasionally, or by accident, then it’s too small. There has to be a point where the sweet spot becomes impractically small, and if this isn’t it, where is it?
McLaren/Lotus are always quick, they must be making them work.The pattern so far is McLaren and Lotus are vaguely up there with whatever team has managed to make the tyres work any given weekend. To me that suggests Macca and Lotus have cars good enough to be near the front without getting the best out of the tyres. Sauber, Ferrari, Mercedes, Red Bull and Williams all
seem to have slower cars, but all have been quicker than Macca/Lotus in one race or other. So if McLaren and Lotus really can make the tyres work, how have they been outpaced (not just beaten, but genuinely outpaced) by the likes of Williams, Sauber etc.?
It’s created competition/The more teams we see being competitive the better positioned we are to see who's the best or the most talented.I think people define competition differently. To me it’s reduced competition (by introducing an effectively random differentiator), to others that random element
is competition. The team that makes the tyres work will give their driver a potential showcase, but that's randomly diversifying competition, not improving it. (I can’t remember a season when the competitive order has been less clear at this stage, how can we be in a better positioned to judge anything? Except whether a random midfield driver has the racecraft skills to win when given a chance.)
I like all the unpredictability/seeing smaller teams get a chance/having different winners. Why do you want another walkover like last year?Fair enough. I support Williams beyond any driver or team so I’m over the moon about their win (even though the circumstances devalue it in real terms, to me anyway). I can understand if this stuff doesn’t matter to you, obviously that’s fair enough, I’m not telling you not to like it like this. But it doesn’t alter the fact that it is like this, and if it avoids another walkover that will be a very small positive compared to the negative of devalued results.
At least it gives ‘lesser’ drivers a chance to shine and show what they can do.This I agree with, though there will still be many that aren’t lucky enough to get that chance and I don't know if it gives much idea of their raw pace. Maldonado in particular had the opportunity to show us all he has talent, and that’s great.
EDIT
One I forgot:
Back in the turbo days drivers were often having to conserve fuel, which meant the cars weren't always as quick as they could be. Now that's seen as a classic era, what's the difference?The difference is total. For arguments sake let's say lapping at full speed in a turbo car used two litres of fuel, and 1.5 when conserving it. The key is the drivers were still going as fast as they could, they had to keep the car on the edge of adhesion. It may have been going more slowly but we were still watching a driver in the same way, the difference in their skill was still a differentiator. They were not driving to a delta time but a delta quantity of fuel, if you like. This is the case with any number of imposed performance limitations, but it isn't the case with these tyres. A more accurate comparison would be if turbo era drivers saved fuel by driving 5% within the limit all the time, particularly when cornering. This is a difficult point to get across and maybe I'm not very good at it.
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