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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:18 pm 
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Word has it that Ferrari just replaced Massa's gearbox, he'll now get a five place penalty and will move Alonso up a place to 7th, and more importantly the clean side. Massa also gets the clean side as a result.

https://twitter.com/search?q=massa

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Last edited by sultanofhyd on Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:21 pm 
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That's pretty creative if true, got to give them that at least. I assume you don't have to prove the gearbox is faulty to change it then.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:21 pm 
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Another feather in Alonso's cap and then they wonder why Massa cant compete or why Ferrari sticks to him :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:22 pm 
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How convenient!


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:22 pm 
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Very clever thinking from Ferrari, if true. On this track we will probably see the odd side of the grid take far better start. Even Kimi said after the qualy that he would've rather been 5th because it's the clean side.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:25 pm 
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Well we all knew they would have to do something...cant have the #2 driver doing better than the #1 driver :p

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:25 pm 
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Lojik wrote:
That's pretty creative if true, got to give them that at least. I assume you don't have to prove the gearbox is faulty to change it then.

I thought it was pretty creative too. I even went on to believe that it was one of the most ingenious things ever to be done given the circumstances haha.. although I'm probably way off the mark on that one. Either way, I don't think they'd need to prove that it was faulty, as a team might want to replace a gearbox simply because they feel a brand spanking new one would be more effective on the particular circuit.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:25 pm 
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Lojik wrote:
That's pretty creative if true, got to give them that at least. I assume you don't have to prove the gearbox is faulty to change it then.


They don't have to prove anything if they are ready to accept the penalty.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:29 pm 
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That's a great idea. Good thinking


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:30 pm 
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If there isn't nothing wrong in gearbox this should be investigated by FIA and if that is really just fake bumb for getting Alonso to clean side = DQ to Ferrari in this race. Nothing more than unsportsmanship behaviour. Teams should keep it clean and not try to affect race results by this way (because it's illegal, team orders are ok but this isn't that, it's directly affecting race results before race and it's illegal, clever but illegal).

If there is something wrong in Massa gearbox (highly doubt it tho) then it's ok. More clever would be getting massa starting from pitlane because start will be mayhem where he is now.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:31 pm 
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WJF1 wrote:
If there isn't nothing wrong in gearbox this should be investigated by FIA and if that is really just fake bumb for getting Alonso to clean side = DQ to Ferrari in this race. Nothing more than unsportsmanship behaviour. Teams should keep it clean and not try to affect race results by this way (because it's illegal, team orders are ok but this isn't that, it's directly affecting race results before race and it's illegal, clever but illegal).

If there is something wrong in Massa gearbox (highly doubt it tho) then it's ok. More clever would be getting massa starting from pitlane because start will be mayhem where he is now.


This.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:31 pm 
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WJF1 wrote:
If there isn't nothing wrong in gearbox this should be investigated by FIA and if that is really just fake bumb for getting Alonso to clean side = DQ to Ferrari in this race. Nothing more than unsportsmanship behaviour. Teams should keep it clean and not try to affect race results by this way (because it's illegal, team orders are ok but this isn't that, it's directly affecting race results before race and it's illegal, clever but illegal).

If there is something wrong in Massa gearbox (highly doubt it tho) then it's ok. More clever would be getting massa starting from pitlane because start will be mayhem where he is now.


Really? What exactly will they investigate? There is no rule that states a part may not be replaced unless it's faulty.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:31 pm 
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Clever. I'd probably do the same thing though if I was a team boss with my #1 on the dirty/slippery side fighting for the championship.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:35 pm 
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Good news for Maldonado too. :D

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:37 pm 
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sultanofhyd wrote:
WJF1 wrote:
If there isn't nothing wrong in gearbox this should be investigated by FIA and if that is really just fake bumb for getting Alonso to clean side = DQ to Ferrari in this race. Nothing more than unsportsmanship behaviour. Teams should keep it clean and not try to affect race results by this way (because it's illegal, team orders are ok but this isn't that, it's directly affecting race results before race and it's illegal, clever but illegal).

If there is something wrong in Massa gearbox (highly doubt it tho) then it's ok. More clever would be getting massa starting from pitlane because start will be mayhem where he is now.


Really? What exactly will they investigate? There is no rule that states a part may not be replaced unless it's faulty.


Teams aren't allowed to affect on race results, just team orders are ok. If there is nothing wrong then Ferrari have break the rules and should be DQ from race. Atleast in this race the start from clean side is huge advantage and when it comes from this kind of low trick but clever stuff it should be checked and if there isn't nothing wrong with it then it's ok. If there is ofc there should be more penalties to Ferrari as team.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:39 pm 
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Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:41 pm 
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rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari

Are you kidding? Right. :thumbdown:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:41 pm 
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WJF1 wrote:
sultanofhyd wrote:
WJF1 wrote:
If there isn't nothing wrong in gearbox this should be investigated by FIA and if that is really just fake bumb for getting Alonso to clean side = DQ to Ferrari in this race. Nothing more than unsportsmanship behaviour. Teams should keep it clean and not try to affect race results by this way (because it's illegal, team orders are ok but this isn't that, it's directly affecting race results before race and it's illegal, clever but illegal).

If there is something wrong in Massa gearbox (highly doubt it tho) then it's ok. More clever would be getting massa starting from pitlane because start will be mayhem where he is now.


Really? What exactly will they investigate? There is no rule that states a part may not be replaced unless it's faulty.


Teams aren't allowed to affect on race results, just team orders are ok. If there is nothing wrong then Ferrari have break the rules and should be DQ from race. Atleast in this race the start from clean side is huge advantage and when it comes from this kind of low trick but clever stuff it should be checked and if there isn't nothing wrong with it then it's ok. If there is ofc there should be more penalties to Ferrari as team.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:41 pm 
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WJF1 wrote:
rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari

Are you kidding? Right. :thumbdown:


Yes :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:43 pm 
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rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari

hahaha brilliant.

Fair play if true. You gotta do what you gotta do.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:43 pm 
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rife_hypocricy wrote:
WJF1 wrote:
rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari

Are you kidding? Right. :thumbdown:


Yes :lol:


Never mind.

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Last edited by sultanofhyd on Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:43 pm 
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rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari


Real shame that isn't true as it would have been hysterical :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:45 pm 
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rife_hypocricy wrote:
WJF1 wrote:
rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari

Are you kidding? Right. :thumbdown:


Yes :lol:

Oh :(

Can someone make it happen. Go on Red Bull, play them at their own dirty(side of the track) game... Make it interesting.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:46 pm 
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sultanofhyd some people bet money for results. Now if teams are pretty much allowed to do things like this, i and many other people are getting really angry. Ofc i know that Massa isn't allowed to drive ahead of Alonso but still this will make my other bets really hard to be possible.

You think this is ok, but it's not.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:48 pm 
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If it doesn't break the rules

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:49 pm 
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WJF1 wrote:
sultanofhyd some people bet money for results. Now if teams are pretty much allowed to do things like this, i and many other people are getting really angry. Ofc i know that Massa isn't allowed to drive ahead of Alonso but still this will make my other bets really hard to be possible.

You think this is ok, but it's not.


You do know that Alonso lost the championship in 2010 because Massa was allowed to drive in FRONT of him?

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:50 pm 
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WJF1 wrote:
sultanofhyd some people bet money for results. Now if teams are pretty much allowed to do things like this, i and many other people are getting really angry. Ofc i know that Massa isn't allowed to drive ahead of Alonso but still this will make my other bets really hard to be possible.

You think this is ok, but it's not.


Lol what? Gambling is a risk, it is your fault, and anyone else who bets, for not foreseeing such a manoeuvre and factoring that into your decision. Stop being a victim.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:50 pm 
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pretty clever


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:51 pm 
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This rumour broke at about 1pm GMT which is 7am in Texas
It seems odd that Ferrari would roll out of bed and make this decision

I suppose they could have decided yesterday though and someone has only just got hold of it


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:53 pm 
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SamH_123 wrote:
This rumour broke at about 1pm GMT which is 7am in Texas
It seems odd that Ferrari would roll out of bed and make this decision

I suppose they could have decided yesterday though and someone has only just got hold of it

I would imagine there were some late night meetings and strategy discussions about it all, and that the worlds media were in bed/bars in Austin when the decision was made

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:54 pm 
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I'd laugh if Webber did the same, but I highly doubt it's going to happen.

As much as I don't like it, I still have to give all credit to Ferrari for using every allowed method they can to give their WDC candidate the best possible situation for the race. It's not against the rules and they're free to do so.

Shows why they kept Massa.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:56 pm 
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If RBR and Vettel has done this, we would have never seen the end of cheating, unsportsmanship conduct etc :)

Also does Ferrari realize that Alonso would be starting on the same row with Grosjean side by side if Massa gets penalty? You never know where Grosjean will drift in the start....


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:59 pm 
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Water wrote:
I'd laugh if Webber did the same, but I highly doubt it's going to happen.

As much as I don't like it, I still have to give all credit to Ferrari for using every allowed method they can to give their WDC candidate the best possible situation for the race. It's not against the rules and they're free to do so.

Shows why they kept Massa.


Nothing stopped Red Bull from taking a front wing off 'rebel' Webber's car. No driver will have a choice in such a situation.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:11 pm 
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PacificBeach wrote:
If RBR and Vettel has done this, we would have never seen the end of cheating, unsportsmanship conduct etc


I get the feeling several on here are calling Ferrari cheats

Basically RB did a different tactic in Abu Dhabi to get Vettel up there, & Ferrari are taking another different approach to get Alonso up there

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:14 pm 
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sultanofhyd wrote:
rife_hypocricy wrote:
WJF1 wrote:
rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari

Are you kidding? Right. :thumbdown:


Yes :lol:


Never mind.


Raikkonen also changed his because Hamilton changed his... but then, oh no! Schumacher changes his!


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:16 pm 
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Water wrote:
I'd laugh if Webber did the same, but I highly doubt it's going to happen.

As much as I don't like it, I still have to give all credit to Ferrari for using every allowed method they can to give their WDC candidate the best possible situation for the race. It's not against the rules and they're free to do so.

Shows why they kept Massa.


It would be most foolish because they would sacrifice track position by doing so!

Better to use Webber to block Alonso when he comes through the field.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:18 pm 
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Clever thinking by Ferrari as far as I'm concerned. At this stage of the championship with so much at stake and with the odds stacked clearly against them you can't blame them for doing it.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:18 pm 
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I haven't been alonsos biggest fan but he won me over with some good races this year, but i get annoyed when they tell massa to back off because hes getting to close or to get out of alonsos way or in this case the alleged gearbox change for massa, moving alonso up a place, some would call it a brilliant move, i would call it not being good enough to win. Ticks me off, just get on with the races if your good enough you will win. That being said i will still be cheering on alonso just because i want the brazil gp to be worth something!


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:20 pm 
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rife_hypocricy wrote:
Webber changes his too, touche Ferrari


Haha, I was about to post this too. Would be so awesome tbh :D


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:23 pm 
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Eva09 wrote:
Water wrote:
I'd laugh if Webber did the same, but I highly doubt it's going to happen.

As much as I don't like it, I still have to give all credit to Ferrari for using every allowed method they can to give their WDC candidate the best possible situation for the race. It's not against the rules and they're free to do so.

Shows why they kept Massa.


It would be most foolish because they would sacrifice track position by doing so!

Better to use Webber to block Alonso when he comes through the field.

Knowing Webber, he will only go as as long as its fair to Alonso. He will not try to do silly things to keep Alonso behind regardless what RedBull instructs him.


As far as this rumor is concerned, I dont know if Ferrari really wants to do that when Massa can effectively move over whenever they want him to. But yes, if the even number side is too dirty, I can understand why they would want to do this. This is exploiting the rules for sure, but then they wont be the first and last one to do that. We have seen teams getting away with illegal parts on cars this year to avoid controversy, this is nothing compared to that.


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