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 Post subject: Point for Fastest Lap
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:22 am 
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I think one point for fastest lap of the race will make drivers push the car until the very end and gives us more entertainment especially in such a dull Grand Prix. What do you think?

Edit: One point for fastest lap of the race only if the driver has also finished in the points.

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Last edited by Adit N. on Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:24 am 
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it wont works in Pirelli era. Any driver down the top 10 grid will just pit for fresh tyre and try their luck.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:34 am 
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NvrDieYoung wrote:
it wont works in Pirelli era. Any driver down the top 10 grid will just pit for fresh tyre and try their luck.


True. In that case, they could give that fast lap point ( a good idea BTW) only if the driver has also finished in the points.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:35 am 
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Ah right. And I think it'll work better without the ban of refuelling.

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Last edited by Adit N. on Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:22 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:36 am 
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why not xtra point for Pole......at least it is genuine.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:45 am 
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At least pole position gives driver a better starting position in the race while there is no reward nor advantage given for setting the fastest lap.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:01 am 
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Zekenwolf wrote:
NvrDieYoung wrote:
it wont works in Pirelli era. Any driver down the top 10 grid will just pit for fresh tyre and try their luck.


True. In that case, they could give that fast lap point (a good idea BTW) only if the driver has also finished in the points.


Fair enough, thank you.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:02 am 
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NvrDieYoung wrote:
it wont works in Pirelli era. Any driver down the top 10 grid will just pit for fresh tyre and try their luck.

Agreed.

Dont think its a good idea at all, some drivers will purposely push it on the last lap. Aka Vettel.

Sooner or later Vettel will push it and as a result crash.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:08 am 
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That's pretty much my point. So the drivers will push until the very end. It will be like qualifying battle in the last few laps of the race.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:10 am 
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I think 1 point was awarded for the fastest lap at some point in the 50s or early 60s.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:45 am 
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RaisinChips wrote:
I think 1 point was awarded for the fastest lap at some point in the 50s or early 60s.


1950-1959. Then it changed to the old 1st-6th place points system we had until the early 00s.

I think it didn't work in the old system as the ratios meant there was too much emphasis on the value of a fastest lap. 1 point isn't worth nearly as much in modern Formula 1 as it was back then, so I doubt you'd have everyone scrambling to the pits to get new tyres on. If a driver is in 5th, and they drop to 10th to new tyres, and subsequently only get up to 8th with the fastest lap, that's 5 points instead of 10. It would certainly add a new tactical element to each race, as well as encouraging drivers to push for time as well as places.

The idea that they could only score it if they finished in the points seems like a good idea to me. You'd end up with some very strategic finishes to the Grand Prix in the midfield, where a single point would likely matter the most. It could always affect a championship too (Vettel only won the champ by 3 points this year) so it's another thing to keep an eye on during the race which makes it exciting for the whole Grand Prix! Imagine, in the past it would seem a foregone conclusion that Driver A would finish 1st, but Driver B still had enough points for 4th to seal the champ, and was cruising. Driver A sets a fastest lap on the final tour in the new system to equal points in the champ and take it by virtue of more wins. It really would promote the highest quality of racing as fans would know the drivers are pushing to the limits of their vehicle.

Of course, it may prove quite confusing to the new or casual viewer.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:57 am 
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Pointless. Oh wait, it already is!

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:59 am 
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I do not agree to giving additional points for pole or other grid positions. Starting in front of the next fastest man is reward enough.

But a point - just one - for setting the fastest lap of the race but only for those finishing in the points is a good idea.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:05 am 
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theferret wrote:
RaisinChips wrote:
I think 1 point was awarded for the fastest lap at some point in the 50s or early 60s.


1950-1959. Then it changed to the old 1st-6th place points system we had until the early 00s.

I think it didn't work in the old system as the ratios meant there was too much emphasis on the value of a fastest lap. 1 point isn't worth nearly as much in modern Formula 1 as it was back then, so I doubt you'd have everyone scrambling to the pits to get new tyres on. If a driver is in 5th, and they drop to 10th to new tyres, and subsequently only get up to 8th with the fastest lap, that's 5 points instead of 10. It would certainly add a new tactical element to each race, as well as encouraging drivers to push for time as well as places.

The idea that they could only score it if they finished in the points seems like a good idea to me. You'd end up with some very strategic finishes to the Grand Prix in the midfield, where a single point would likely matter the most. It could always affect a championship too (Vettel only won the champ by 3 points this year) so it's another thing to keep an eye on during the race which makes it exciting for the whole Grand Prix! Imagine, in the past it would seem a foregone conclusion that Driver A would finish 1st, but Driver B still had enough points for 4th to seal the champ, and was cruising. Driver A sets a fastest lap on the final tour in the new system to equal points in the champ and take it by virtue of more wins. It really would promote the highest quality of racing as fans would know the drivers are pushing to the limits of their vehicle.

Of course, it may prove quite confusing to the new or casual viewer.


Well said. Thanks.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:31 am 
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I'd enjoy it. It'd be one extra thing to follow in the race. A single point has already been devalued to 2.5x less than what it was worth pre-2010, so what's the harm in providing one for setting the fastest lap? As has been said before, it was used in the 1950s and there was no issue with it then. Just because it's not been used since 1959 doesn't mean it's ridiculous to use it again.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:19 pm 
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Adit N. wrote:
At least pole position gives driver a better starting position in the race while there is no reward nor advantage given for setting the fastest lap.

1 point is a reward and advantage :)

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:49 pm 
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Personally I'd rather see a points system that's goes all the way to last place not just top ten. It also makes it more fair for the lower teams who only need one good race to finish higher than the other team.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:00 pm 
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w1Y! wrote:
Personally I'd rather see a points system that's goes all the way to last place not just top ten. It also makes it more fair for the lower teams who only need one good race to finish higher than the other team.


this.

if the car doesnt finish then you dont get points.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:15 pm 
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no... but a point for pole is fair


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:11 pm 
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While I understand the idea, it will lead to lesser racing, specifically in positions 4-10 (assuming only a points-finisher can score an additional point for fastest lap)...

here's why:

you are in 5th place and the driver in 4th is 4 secs ahead of you with 10 laps to go:

would you put in fast laps and try to get 4th place and the 2 additional points?

or

would you nurse your tyres for 9 laps and put in a fastest lap on the final lap and get 1 additional point?

I can see so many drivers settling for the latter option, even if its one point lesser.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:26 pm 
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Yeah i think it is fair to make drivers try a bit harder in the closing stages (last 3rd) of the race instead of looking after the tyre and will give midfielders the same aim actually.

a single or 2-3 points would be fair i guess.

Points for Saturday? not so sure, anything pre-race should have n scoring IMO.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:29 pm 
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stendec wrote:
While I understand the idea, it will lead to lesser racing, specifically in positions 4-10 (assuming only a points-finisher can score an additional point for fastest lap)...

here's why:

you are in 5th place and the driver in 4th is 4 secs ahead of you with 10 laps to go:

would you put in fast laps and try to get 4th place and the 2 additional points?

or

would you nurse your tyres for 9 laps and put in a fastest lap on the final lap and get 1 additional point?

I can see so many drivers settling for the latter option, even if its one point lesser.


If he is 4 seconds ahead then catching him can get you the fastest lap of the race as well. pass him and you get 2 more points, teams will want to get higher in the WCC and drivers will want to beat their teammates.


Pole already has it's advantage, but FL not and that is why i would think 1 point for it would be fair.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:08 pm 
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It has some Merritt as does a point for finishing or finishing on the same lap s the leader. But to be representative of the effort the points for placing would need to be higher or a car could get most of its points this way.

If you recall how it used to be at Le Mans, some seemed to only take part to record the highest speed down Mulsanne. Interesting in its se;f, but I think it got to over 250 mph and had to be stopped. There could well become a war in F1 for fastest lap using the second cars if the publicity took off

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:08 am 
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I think it is a good idea. It can only change racing for the better. Would've been fun if it were operational in 2007 or 2008.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:21 am 
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Having a point for FL would maybe see teams like Caterham not run at all in quali but save the softest tyre and start the race with very low fuel (not even look to finish races) and go for quali style runs to get a point on the board.

I'm not in favour of points for FL or pole

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:39 am 
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1 Point for fastest lap isn't all that much. I mean over the course of the season there is a maximum of 20 points available then, less if someone outside of the points gets it. It is less than a race win over the whole season. But the point of the race isn't to push the hardest for 1 lap. The point of the race is to cross the finish line ahead of everyone else. If they fastest way to do that is a stream of constant mid range laps, that is what you do. Leave 1 lap pace for qualy, the reward is grid position. The race should have nothing to do with who can put in the fastest lap. It should just be an interesting but useless statistic. Leave it there.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:40 am 
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SilverstoneRegular wrote:
Having a point for FL would maybe see teams like Caterham not run at all in quali but save the softest tyre and start the race with very low fuel (not even look to finish races) and go for quali style runs to get a point on the board.

I'm not in favour of points for FL or pole

A good suggestion has been to award the FL point only for points-finishers.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:08 am 
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Covalent wrote:
SilverstoneRegular wrote:
Having a point for FL would maybe see teams like Caterham not run at all in quali but save the softest tyre and start the race with very low fuel (not even look to finish races) and go for quali style runs to get a point on the board.

I'm not in favour of points for FL or pole

A good suggestion has been to award the FL point only for points-finishers.


Consider the end we had to this season and similar seasons recently of 2007 and 2008. Vettel would have wrapped up the championship before the last race simply by putting in fastest laps at the end of the race as he likes to do.

What about the scenario whereby Alonso won it by just one point until Vettel, finishing behind him on track puts in the fastest lap of the race to effectively decide the championship. That type of scenario could easily have applied to 2007/08 as well. It would create a situation where we'd have to wait for ALL the cars to finish just in case one of them puts in the fastest lap and alters the championship again.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 2:53 pm 
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SilverstoneRegular wrote:
Having a point for FL would maybe see teams like Caterham not run at all in quali but save the softest tyre and start the race with very low fuel (not even look to finish races) and go for quali style runs to get a point on the board.

I'm not in favor of points for FL or pole


Yes, but then the leaders at the end of the race on low fuel will almost surely better that.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 2:55 pm 
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rabbit_hole wrote:
Covalent wrote:
SilverstoneRegular wrote:
Having a point for FL would maybe see teams like Caterham not run at all in quali but save the softest tyre and start the race with very low fuel (not even look to finish races) and go for quali style runs to get a point on the board.

I'm not in favour of points for FL or pole

A good suggestion has been to award the FL point only for points-finishers.


Consider the end we had to this season and similar seasons recently of 2007 and 2008. Vettel would have wrapped up the championship before the last race simply by putting in fastest laps at the end of the race as he likes to do.

What about the scenario whereby Alonso won it by just one point until Vettel, finishing behind him on track puts in the fastest lap of the race to effectively decide the championship. That type of scenario could easily have applied to 2007/08 as well. It would create a situation where we'd have to wait for ALL the cars to finish just in case one of them puts in the fastest lap and alters the championship again.


Why is that bad? it makes sure the drivers are pushing till the very end. Don't bash it because a certain driver likes to do it, if it had points almost every other driver would go for it when putting fresh rubber on and during the closing stages of the race.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:26 pm 
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i think its a great idea for both pole and fastest lap

and i dont think they need to be in a points scoring position because much of the time there is not much action at the back of the field, they would always try to get the fastest lap which would result in way more action


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:46 pm 
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I just feel that it would make teams pit on the last lap to get fresh tyres with the lowest amount of fuel. (If they had a window a gap or no points to lose).

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:31 pm 
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Excellent idea....Fastest lap makes you push the car...Maybe fastest through speed trap would be another...

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:34 pm 
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No thanks

This topic seems to come up every month

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:06 pm 
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M.Nader -DODZ- wrote:
rabbit_hole wrote:
Covalent wrote:
SilverstoneRegular wrote:
Having a point for FL would maybe see teams like Caterham not run at all in quali but save the softest tyre and start the race with very low fuel (not even look to finish races) and go for quali style runs to get a point on the board.

I'm not in favour of points for FL or pole

A good suggestion has been to award the FL point only for points-finishers.


Consider the end we had to this season and similar seasons recently of 2007 and 2008. Vettel would have wrapped up the championship before the last race simply by putting in fastest laps at the end of the race as he likes to do.

What about the scenario whereby Alonso won it by just one point until Vettel, finishing behind him on track puts in the fastest lap of the race to effectively decide the championship. That type of scenario could easily have applied to 2007/08 as well. It would create a situation where we'd have to wait for ALL the cars to finish just in case one of them puts in the fastest lap and alters the championship again.


Why is that bad? it makes sure the drivers are pushing till the very end. Don't bash it because a certain driver likes to do it, if it had points almost every other driver would go for it when putting fresh rubber on and during the closing stages of the race.

Exactly, reading rabbit_hole's response made me even more in favor of it! :lol:

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