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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:08 am 
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To me Jean was one of those drivers like my favorite webber is and that's a half way there man. When I mean that, had the speed and talent to be champion but fate stood in the way. Opinions


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:11 am 
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Definitely engine problems, engine problems and more engine problems.. I was sure he could have at least win in Monza in the Early 90s but his car blew up too often :| san marino too if I wasn't mistaken

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:04 am 
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Of course he did. A driver of his talent probably deserved a WDC. Certainly more talented than Hill or Villenueve were and they managed to win one each.

Had he gone to Williams in 91 then he could have won at least a couple of world titles. Easy. As it was he chose Ferrari when they were in the middle of the worst lull of their history and he paid the price.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:05 am 
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1995 Monza should be Alesi's 2nd race-win.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:36 am 
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2fast wrote:
1995 Monza should be Alesi's 2nd race-win.

There was another Monza (1994) win that escaped him while he drove for Ferrari; he made his first pitstop while in the lead and when he wanted to pull away the gearbox failed.

Laura23 wrote:
Had he gone to Williams in 91 then he could have won at least a couple of world titles. Easy. As it was he chose Ferrari when they were in the middle of the worst lull of their history and he paid the price.
I'm not so sure it would have been easy; Mansell managed to not win the title in 1991. Jean might have, or he might not.
He didn't go to Ferrari when they were in the worst lull of their history, in my opinion. He went there when Ferrari politics were at their worst. Remember how Prost was taking the championship fight to Senna? The team were never as bad as some would have us believe.

Jean deserved more wins; but then, so do most drivers.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:00 am 
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Sooo good to finally have peole agree with me on Jean. My friends at work said he was overrated, not in the bit slightest massively underrated and yes definatly if he chose Williams he would have been champ,then again who could resist the prancing horse and it's glorious history, always so devistatingly quick in quali and on IMO often a decent match for Schu and his benetton in 1995 more so than hill, but yes poor reliability. Seems like every era has a bad luck ridden mark webber sort of a driver.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:01 am 
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Also loved the unique way he held his wheel, at 10-2


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:22 am 
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I mostly remember him for repeatedly ignoring his team's instructions to pit for fuel and thus running out of fuel during a race.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQN49SnvJ_o


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:32 am 
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Phoenix 1990. He drove for Tyrrell and was leading the race after the start. The duel for the lead with Senna in McLaren was epic. I think he only finished 3 times in the points that season because of mistakes and reliability and 2 times he stood on the podium, the other podium was Monaco. He could really make the difference on street circuits.

Yes mistakes and reliability were main problems that he didn't get more wins plus he also joined Ferrari and one of their least competitive period. I don't think they won anything in 1991-1994. After that it was Benetton and they were also not as strong any more as Schumi took all the best people with him to Ferrari. Had Jean stayed with Ferrari during MS period he would have won certainly some more races but not a WDC. If he had gone to Williams I am sure he would have won several WDC's. Certainly if Patrese had been his teammate he would have won 1992 with ease. If he faced Mansell it woudl have been close. But seeing how strong Williams was during 1991-1997 he surely would have bagged a few WDC's.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:50 am 
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Amon wrote:
Phoenix 1990. He drove for Tyrrell and was leading the race after the start. The duel for the lead with Senna in McLaren was epic. I think he only finished 3 times in the points that season because of mistakes and reliability and 2 times he stood on the podium, the other podium was Monaco. He could really make the difference on street circuits.

Yes mistakes and reliability were main problems that he didn't get more wins plus he also joined Ferrari and one of their least competitive period. I don't think they won anything in 1991-1994. After that it was Benetton and they were also not as strong any more as Schumi took all the best people with him to Ferrari. Had Jean stayed with Ferrari during MS period he would have won certainly some more races but not a WDC. If he had gone to Williams I am sure he would have won several WDC's. Certainly if Patrese had been his teammate he would have won 1992 with ease. If he faced Mansell it woudl have been close. But seeing how strong Williams was during 1991-1997 he surely would have bagged a few WDC's.

This.

It does all depend on where Senna/Prost would have gone had Jean had a Williams seat though. We'll never know but if events had gone as history tells, say Jean took Mansell's seat for 92, Hill's for 93-96 and perhaps even Frentzen's for 97 then he could potentially have been fighting for the title for 6 years straight.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:12 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Of course he did. A driver of his talent probably deserved a WDC. Certainly more talented than Hill or Villenueve were and they managed to win one each.

Had he gone to Williams in 91 then he could have won at least a couple of world titles. Easy. As it was he chose Ferrari when they were in the middle of the worst lull of their history and he paid the price.


That's a fairly big claim to make considering they both won a WDC quite convincingly and were very tallented drivers in their day. I do agree about Jean though, he was a very tallented driver and could have been a WDC in the right car. One of the races I will always remember he could/should of won was Monza '97. He was leading from pole but DC beat him with a faster pit stop.

P.S. A thread about Jean Alesi wouldn't be complete without this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQN49SnvJ_o

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:17 pm 
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Kolby wrote:
Definitely engine problems, engine problems and more engine problems.. I was sure he could have at least win in Monza in the Early 90s but his car blew up too often :| san marino too if I wasn't mistaken


Just to correct you, while at Ferrari Jean never had any engine problems, he had "electrical problems", things like piston heads smashing through ECUs.

On a serious note... he didn't "deserve" more wins, no one "deserves" anything in sport, but he was certainly good enough to have gotten many more wins if luck had have swung his way. But thems the breaks, there have been many F1 drivers plenty good enough to have won titles if circumstance prevailed, who never even won races.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:46 am 
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Jean Alesi did deserve more then 1 win. His career was full of promise and he had to make a choice for the 1991 season to either join Ferrari or Williams. His mind opted for Williams but his heart said Ferrari and the rest is history.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:37 pm 
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He is one of those talented drivers that was always in a wrong car (Laffite, Warwick, Nannini, to name a few). He could have achieved much more than mere 1 win.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:05 pm 
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ofcourse he did,
however he wasnt very good with luck.
i do remember several incidents when he should have won, but luck wasnt on his side.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:40 pm 
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Of course!!

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:49 pm 
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I'm a huge fan of Jean Alesi and unfortunately his results did not match his ability and talent. If he reminds me of any current drivers, it's Alonso, a warrior who gives it his all every lap.

For those people who debate whether Alesi was underrated, obviously you are debating with people who only read the first page of the statistics, see just one win in 201 starts in some big name teams, and reach a conclusion. They obviously never watched him race or were aware of the circumstances surrounding him.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:49 pm 
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He was a good driver, but at the end of the day the 1996 Benneton was a good car. Schumacher would have won races in it. He would probably have also won races in the 1994/5 Ferrari.

Did he deserve better cars? Maybe. But he could also have done better than he did in the cars he had. The bad career choices cost him a run at the championship, but it's his own fault he only got one win.


Banana Man wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
Of course he did. A driver of his talent probably deserved a WDC. Certainly more talented than Hill or Villenueve were and they managed to win one each.

Had he gone to Williams in 91 then he could have won at least a couple of world titles. Easy. As it was he chose Ferrari when they were in the middle of the worst lull of their history and he paid the price.


That's a fairly big claim to make considering they both won a WDC quite convincingly and were very tallented drivers in their day. I do agree about Jean though, he was a very tallented driver and could have been a WDC in the right car. One of the races I will always remember he could/should of won was Monza '97. He was leading from pole but DC beat him with a faster pit stop.

P.S. A thread about Jean Alesi wouldn't be complete without this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQN49SnvJ_o


This is my personal favourite:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5awDdwwXPzg


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:15 pm 
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Watch Alesi's pole lap at Monza in 1994 - I'm in work so unable to search Youtube.

I've never seen the Tifosi go as wild as then (Berger qualified in P2 so all in all a good day!)

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:15 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
2fast wrote:
1995 Monza should be Alesi's 2nd race-win.

There was another Monza (1994) win that escaped him while he drove for Ferrari; he made his first pitstop while in the lead and when he wanted to pull away the gearbox failed.

Laura23 wrote:
Had he gone to Williams in 91 then he could have won at least a couple of world titles. Easy. As it was he chose Ferrari when they were in the middle of the worst lull of their history and he paid the price.
I'm not so sure it would have been easy; Mansell managed to not win the title in 1991. Jean might have, or he might not.
He didn't go to Ferrari when they were in the worst lull of their history, in my opinion. He went there when Ferrari politics were at their worst. Remember how Prost was taking the championship fight to Senna? The team were never as bad as some would have us believe.

Jean deserved more wins; but then, so do most drivers.


Mansell had unreliability in 1991. Alesi might have had the same or he might have got lucky.

Not winning the title, well a lot of guys didn't. Stirling Moss won a lot of races though, I'd rather win lots of races than win four races and win the title. Amazing Alesi only won one race.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:31 pm 
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Lt. Drebin wrote:
He is one of those talented drivers that was always in a wrong car (Laffite, Warwick, Nannini, to name a few).

Not to mention Chris Amon, of whom Mario Andretti said "If he became an undertaker, people would stop dying".


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