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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:16 am 
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I wish he did return so awesome to watch, I remember a few years back he tested for mclaren again and wasn't too quick I think Lewis was faster. Seems to me you can't have any down time if f1 now as the cars are consistently changing, look at massa took him 6 months to get back on the pace and schumi, only this year has he really shown his old race winning pace an hakkinen the same seems the longer you are away the longer it takes. Different back when Prost and mansell came back as in my opinion the cars didn't develop as quickly as they do know, people will go but whAt about raikkonen, I think as he was still in the loop by racing top grade rally cars his technical mind was still active. Do you think mikas testing times made his mind up on a possible return?


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:37 am 
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Chriso wrote:
I wish he did return so awesome to watch, I remember a few years back he tested for mclaren again and wasn't too quick I think Lewis was faster. Seems to me you can't have any down time if f1 now as the cars are consistently changing, look at massa took him 6 months to get back on the pace and schumi, only this year has he really shown his old race winning pace an hakkinen the same seems the longer you are away the longer it takes. Different back when Prost and mansell came back as in my opinion the cars didn't develop as quickly as they do know, people will go but whAt about raikkonen, I think as he was still in the loop by racing top grade rally cars his technical mind was still active. Do you think mikas testing times made his mind up on a possible return?


He thought about it but really struggled in initial testing. Compare to Schumacher who was almost immediately half a second faster than Rosberg, although we subsequently discovered Rosberg was really faster (at that point), when pedal to the metal.

Hakkinen would probably have been miles off, if not for a lot more testing. He never had F1 on the mind like Schumacher, and in his time out (4 years to Schumacher's 3) he seemed to lose a lot and the cars changed a lot.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:45 am 
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Why Mikka Retired: http://youtu.be/nwPBWOT6vC0

Mikka Testing Mclaren in 2006 http://youtu.be/iiBRVkAX7tU


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:07 am 
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REPLICATE wrote:
Why Mikka Retired: http://youtu.be/nwPBWOT6vC0

Mikka Testing Mclaren in 2006 http://youtu.be/iiBRVkAX7tU

Good post. I remember seeing this video a few years ago - so respected Mika's decision to retire, even though I was disappointed.

The period when Mika and Schumi were fighting each other for the WDC were the most enjoyable for me. I supported Schumi, but loved Mika too so never begrudged him when he won.

I can't remember either of them blaming the team or 'putting' the other down by implying the other was only so successful 'cos his car was so good. As far as I was concerned, they were both likeable, competitive racers and they respected each other - whilst never 'giving an inch' on the track!

I'll never forget the post-race press conference when Schumi 'broke down'. IIRC, it was Schumi, Mika and Ralf were the top three - but it was Mika who comforted Schumi, not his brother Ralf.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:14 am 
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Same here mike and Mika have givin me some of the fondest memories of f1 , especially the move at spa , as they were going down the straight I knew Mika would go to the outside what a move, was quite surprised schumi let Mika out smart him like that, that is what I thought schumi would have done. That to me was one of the greatest battles I have ever seen.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:28 am 
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Have to agree - it is still the best/most exciting overtaking move I have seen.

We were lucky to enjoy F1 at its finest (IMO obviously). Two great drivers battling for the WDC, both of whom preferred to say nothing negative about each other or make stupid comments about the team etc. when things weren't going their way.

I'm feeling nostalgic now...


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 10:12 am 
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REPLICATE wrote:
Why Mikka Retired: http://youtu.be/nwPBWOT6vC0

Mikka Testing Mclaren in 2006 http://youtu.be/iiBRVkAX7tU


Thx for that I never seen those. That first video explains it all. He was never serious about a come back.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 11:22 am 
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One of the best qualifiers ever. I remember the race in Spain 2001 when his car broke down with just one lap to go. I was devastated.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 11:46 am 
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My best memory of Mika, apart from Spa:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viwllFnipds

What a great driver!

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 12:25 pm 
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Indianapolis he retired on last lap too, only to hand schumi the win, but yea the respect they gave each other was quite unique, especially on michaels part , I think schumi saw so much of himself in Mika and like wise. Other great memory is monza 1998 when schumi was chasing hakkinen and Mika made a mistake coming out of the double chicane and schumi pulled Along side for a drag down to the second chicane, when by then the tv camera caught Michael in the lead and all you see is an ocean of red jump to there feet in the grandstand. That sticks in my mind too.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:18 pm 
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Chriso wrote:
Indianapolis he retired on last lap too, only to hand schumi the win


He retired on lap 25 out of a 73 lap race, a long way from the last lap. He was lapping faster than Schumacher when he retired but there was still a long way to go, hardly what I'd call "handing Schumi the win".


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 3:23 pm 
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No I'm pretty sure he neally won in 2001 didn't he? He retired on the last bit of the banking turn on last lap, I remember watching the onboard and seeing the flash of red go by as he pulls over dunno had alot of pipes since then lol


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 4:05 pm 
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froze wrote:
One of the best qualifiers ever. I remember the race in Spain 2001 when his car broke down with just one lap to go. I was devastated.


That was so sad to watch... I was thinking hey maybe he can make it to the finish line but unfortunately he had to pull over. If i remember right he was about 30 seconds ahead of Schumacher. A similar disaster with Damon's Hill one in Hungary 97.

There were some rumors that he could return with the BMW in 2005, however that wasn't meant to be. I find it strange that while he has the same age with his biggest rival, Schumacher went on in F1 eleven years after Hakkinen's retirement.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:25 am 
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Chriso wrote:
No I'm pretty sure he neally won in 2001 didn't he? He retired on the last bit of the banking turn on last lap, I remember watching the onboard and seeing the flash of red go by as he pulls over dunno had alot of pipes since then lol


You're possibly thinking of the 2001 Spanish GP, where he did retire while leading on the final lap. The race I mentioned was the 2000 US GP where he retired with a blown engine. The only other US GP he competed in at Indianapolis was in 2001, which he won.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:32 am 
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Yeah your right I remember his last gp in indianapolis he won, thanx for the refresher, either way to me its quite disappointing we only really got to see the battle for 2 yrs really, as mclaren took a while to supply Mika a decent car, funny how coulthard was quicker before 98 regs came in, guess the grooved tyres and narrower chassis suited Mika better.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:09 pm 
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I would have loved to have seen Hakkinen and Raikkonen as team mates in 2002. Just a shame that by then Mika's motivation had gone completely.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:53 pm 
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I dunno, but for me Mikka only had 3 superb years. He was rather lackluster in the wet throughout his career (had a few really solid runs in the wet) and for me that's a huge blemish on a driver. As well, there were races throughout his career where it looked at times as if he was clearly the fastest but could not maintain that speed for the duration of the race and that goes against him as well. In '98 he was brilliant and in '99 he was really good and both years the car looked to be the best in the field. 2000 the McLaren and Ferrari were closely matched and Mika just couldn't muster the extra little speed consistently enough to win more.

Mika was excellent and certainly had moments of sheer brilliance, but was never consistent enough IMHO and could be forced into making an error. The word sabbatical was used whenever his retirement was mentioned but that's not at all what it was. He simply walked away. Kudos to him though for having the courage to give up a life long ambition and way of life, but I think there was more to it than what he says in that video.

On a scale from 1 - 10 I'd rate Mika as follows:
Favorable conditions: 7.5
Wet weather: 5.5


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVqGpVCUPP0

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6881y ... M9w0qX2z6s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3sUEz9HtkM

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:30 am 
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Its a personal preference but I prefer it when drivers go out close to their best like Miki did.

I know he had that bad year in 2001, but he did not go on for a silly amount of years when he may not have had it anymore. Personally I wish Schumi would have not come back now, a driver as great as him is better than to be mid-fields fodder. So was Miki, and he did not risk becoming that.

1998 is still Miki's best year.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:49 am 
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the incubus wrote:
I dunno, but for me Mikka only had 3 superb years. He was rather lackluster in the wet throughout his career (had a few really solid runs in the wet) and for me that's a huge blemish on a driver. As well, there were races throughout his career where it looked at times as if he was clearly the fastest but could not maintain that speed for the duration of the race and that goes against him as well.

Your post reminded me of Prost, and I think that both these drivers only went as fast as needed for a very good reason: Prost had seen drivers die, or having to leave the sport injured, while Mika's accident in Australia must have left him with something to ponder.
No matter how good you are, racing in the rain remains a lottery.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:58 am 
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REPLICATE wrote:
Why Mikka Retired: http://youtu.be/nwPBWOT6vC0

Mikka Testing Mclaren in 2006 http://youtu.be/iiBRVkAX7tU

The Ron lols : )


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:03 am 
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Maky wrote:
REPLICATE wrote:
Why Mikka Retired: http://youtu.be/nwPBWOT6vC0

Mikka Testing Mclaren in 2006 http://youtu.be/iiBRVkAX7tU

The Ron lols : )


And the Hugo!

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:12 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
the incubus wrote:
I dunno, but for me Mikka only had 3 superb years. He was rather lackluster in the wet throughout his career (had a few really solid runs in the wet) and for me that's a huge blemish on a driver. As well, there were races throughout his career where it looked at times as if he was clearly the fastest but could not maintain that speed for the duration of the race and that goes against him as well.

Your post reminded me of Prost, and I think that both these drivers only went as fast as needed for a very good reason: Prost had seen drivers die, or having to leave the sport injured, while Mika's accident in Australia must have left him with something to ponder.
No matter how good you are, racing in the rain remains a lottery.

Mika does mention his accident in Australia in the video about why he retired & that, when he had a child, that was on his mind & who could blame him. I can still remember the accident like it was yesterday. At the time, I didn't really know much about him but I liked him a lot just from his interviews. Thank God for the medical staff at that race as things could have been so different & we would have missed out on seeing all that happened after that. He has such a great sense of humour. A lot of people don't seem to get it but he has made me laugh more than any other driver in F1 that I can remember. And it was so Mika to say, when he first mentioned going to see Ron Dennis about retiring, that he went to see "the Ron". He quite often said "the Michael" about Schumacher in interviews when he was still racing. Made me laugh every time.

After watching the video of him explaining why he retired, which I had never seen before, there was also a video I clicked on that had him being interviewed about Michael's comeback to F1. It looked like it was in Monaco looking at the background, (bit of a giveaway that it took place on a boat), & I have never seen him talk so much. Mind you, it was in Finnish so he probably felt more comfortable. He was asked a question about how things were now that he & Michael both worked for Mercedes rather than for competitive teams as they did when they raced in F1. His answer was along the lines that they always had a huge respect for each other as competitors, aside from a few hiccups, but their personal relationship was getting closer all the time now that they worked for the same manufacturer & that they enjoyed spending time together.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:23 pm 
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Ohh yeah that 1995 aus gp accident was massive, if you watch the onboard footage can't believe how far his head moved in the imPact was shocking, wonder how he didn't break his neck, and to still make it on the grid for the opening race of 1996, felt quite proud, that he was willing to still tame that beast.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 3:10 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
the incubus wrote:
I dunno, but for me Mikka only had 3 superb years. He was rather lackluster in the wet throughout his career (had a few really solid runs in the wet) and for me that's a huge blemish on a driver. As well, there were races throughout his career where it looked at times as if he was clearly the fastest but could not maintain that speed for the duration of the race and that goes against him as well.

Your post reminded me of Prost, and I think that both these drivers only went as fast as needed for a very good reason: Prost had seen drivers die, or having to leave the sport injured, while Mika's accident in Australia must have left him with something to ponder.
No matter how good you are, racing in the rain remains a lottery.

I disagree on any similarity with Prost. Make no mistake, Prost was fast. However, his approach to races was more methodical in the sense that he was always aware of the likelihood of how pushing cars to the limit in those days would end in kablamo or lead to mistakes and he would push hard initially to get the lead and would then drive only as fast as necessary to remain there. Sure there were races where he could have pushed harder and won be huge margins, but he was always ultra aware of what was going on around him and who was in what position to ensure he was ready to make any adjustments to keep his gap time. Mika would usually be in the top 5 and would pull out lap times that show his car had the speed to pass those ahead but he wouldn't. He wasn't a schlep, but I don't doubt for a second he left a few wins on the table throughout his career that were easily his if he pushed to the limit. Sure his accident was huge and it certainly did do a number on him mentally, but it took him a couple of years to put it completely behind him and develop into a better driver. Interestingly enough, the timeline is pretty consistent to Massa's after his accident, though Massa was back on form almost straight away until the whole "Fernando is faster than you" took the wind out of his sails.

Rain is always difficult to master but there's a difference between not mastering it and simply doing poorly in the wet. While Prost was no rain meister per say, he was still pretty good relative to his performance in the dry. With Mika there's a significant disparity when comparing how he did in the wet as opposed to when it was dry, which why I feel it's a huge strike against him. Overall I'd rate him as excellent but not complete enough for my tastes.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:54 pm 
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Chriso wrote:
Yeah your right I remember his last gp in indianapolis he won, thanx for the refresher, either way to me its quite disappointing we only really got to see the battle for 2 yrs really, as mclaren took a while to supply Mika a decent car, funny how coulthard was quicker before 98 regs came in, guess the grooved tyres and narrower chassis suited Mika better.


I think Mika was quicker in 97 as well he retired from the lead 3 times that year. 98 aside the gap between Mika and David was never that large to be honest.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:09 pm 
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Maky wrote:
The Ron lols : )

SchumieRules wrote:
And the Hugo!


I laughed too when I heard it, but I just realized we don't say 'the' before a name in Dutch, but we do in just about every Flemish dialect. "De Ron" and "den Hugo". Influence from the Normans? :D

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:26 pm 
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I thought Mika was pretty clear about his retirement with issues relating to his back. He would struggle to make it through the races toward the end of his career. I've seen him speak about it a few times but can't locate the videos. In comparison to Schumacher, Schoom was always fit and really didn't suffer physical ailments the way Mika did which allowed him to continue on for so long.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:40 pm 
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Bentrovato wrote:
I thought Mika was pretty clear about his retirement with issues relating to his back. He would struggle to make it through the races toward the end of his career. I've seen him speak about it a few times but can't locate the videos. In comparison to Schumacher, Schoom was always fit and really didn't suffer physical ailments the way Mika did which allowed him to continue on for so long.


That's not entirely true, Schumacher broke both his legs in 1999.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:01 pm 
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And schumi missed 7 races and still finished 5th in standings, pretty impressive,as for Mika and dc.1997 I believe dc was slightly quicker, but 1998 your right wasn't much between them at all. Still think spa 1998 dc pulled car to left a tad to much,seems to me and still does dc did it on purpose.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:49 pm 
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kalikarios wrote:
Bentrovato wrote:
I thought Mika was pretty clear about his retirement with issues relating to his back. He would struggle to make it through the races toward the end of his career. I've seen him speak about it a few times but can't locate the videos. In comparison to Schumacher, Schoom was always fit and really didn't suffer physical ailments the way Mika did which allowed him to continue on for so long.


That's not entirely true, Schumacher broke both his legs in 1999.


Actually two breaks in his right leg

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:40 pm 
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Saw this outside a beauty parlour while visiting Germany, seems he's got better things to do:
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