planetf1.com

It is currently Sat Nov 22, 2014 4:34 pm

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:33 pm
Posts: 5057
Location: Ireland
Museli wrote:
They are the most dirty team in the paddock as well. I wouldn't miss them.

They're all dirty, don't be so naive.

_________________
"I am a believer, but I start each Grand Prix with 195 liters of fuel behind me," he explains. "I don't rely entirely on God, I rely on Prost."


#14 for '14


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 9:53 am
Posts: 2645
Location: Somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert
ferrar1sta wrote:
Balibari wrote:
Without Ferrari:

Less corporate interest and therefore less money in the sport.
A fairer distribution of the commercial revenue.
No single team to have the advantage of vetoing rules, therefore a fairer sport.
No cigarrette money in the sport.
Arguable less animosity, politics and bullshit.
No Luca di Montezemolo.

They are essential to the bloated game of image maintenance and international money-hoovering that F1 has become, but they are not essential to the racing or the health of the sport.

That's really cute. After Ferrari, the most "corporate" team on the circuit is, yeah, McLaren, who are now trying to imitate Ferrari, with their road cars that look like they came out of a Hot Wheels package. :uhoh: Fairer distribution of commercial revenue, well, it helps that Ron Dennis, who went on a crusade to drive Minardi out of business, is out of the sport now. The cigarette money was originally brought in by Lotus and from a certain point of view the current McLaren team was founded by a cigarette company, when you consider that Marlboro orchestrated the takeover of McLaren by Dennis' Marlboro Project Four. You may also recall that Ferrari didn't put non-technical sponsors on their cars until very recently. There would be no less animosity, politics and bullshit, but there would, as you say, be no Luca di Montezemolo.

I think what has damaged the sport more than anything else, aside from Bernie Ecclestone, has been the emphasis on aerodynamics over the last 40 years, which has made close racing more difficult and sent design costs skyrocketing. It's arguable that it's had an impact on road cars, but only to a certain extent; I don't think you'll be seeing front wings and diffusers on your Ford Focus anytime soon. So yeah, anti-Ferrari rants are cute, but often lack real substance.

Sports car racing would welcome Ferrari back, given how mind-numbingly boring it's become, one manufacturer dominates each series because it's hardly worth the others' while to pour money into races that don't mean too much anymore.

I offered a concise view on the question posed. You address just two points (one you misunderstand, the other you simply disagree with me on) but find a way to denigrate McLaren three times in a sprawling response to a post that has nothing to do with them... and then you suggest I'm on an anti-rant?

_________________
I went skating on your name,
And by tracing it twice,
I fell through the ice,
of Alice


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:45 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 3:55 am
Posts: 119
ferrar1sta wrote:
...
Did you take your pills today, amico? :/ You're probably tired of hearing this, but it would be a lot easier to take your posts seriously if you could make them a little... more... coherent.

Image
I've made it easier for you to understand= ho reso più facile per voi capire. I would have thought that you would have been able to comment on some of the post at least, unless of course you know i'm correct.
There again i don't think you wanted to because you know you don't have any room to manoeuvre. You basically stated that Ferrari is everything. I replied no they are not.
OK? easier?
Stating that peoples opinion is "really cute" as you have to Balibari is a way of belittling the things they say or write. Maybe in an effort to a) attempt to get other people (other Ferrari fans) who read this forum on your side and b) to belittle or attempt to bully the people who objectively disagree with you into shutting up!
In a less beligerent world i would agree with Balibari, however people like you bring out the worst in me because of the blind faith and stupid comments you make.
One of the biggest silly comments is that McLaren are trying to emulate Ferrari. They are not. They are bettering them! They do not have a multinational auto maker shovelling money into new wind tunnels and paying wages etc etc. No, of course Ferrari pays it's own way. Of course FIAT don't bankroll them and of course Ferrari only make road cars to go racing, no they go racing to sell road cars thats FIATS, Lancia and Alfa Romeo and a few Ferraris. Just the same as the watch makers who make £3000 watches and £299 watches.
Ask an adult to read it to you! it's marketing. TAG Heuer Make a £3500 watch, give one to Jensen and one to Lewis an sell hundreds of £300 watches.... Jeez!!! :?
Why do i dislike them so much? Because they do things like changing gearbox seals with scant regard for other competitors. Why don't the other competitors complain? They cannot afford to !
You need to look at the bigger picture, but you won't because it's too difficult, there is reward but to be honest it's nice and cosy in red club Ferrari world so why bother......
By the way, I don't dislike anything about FIAT group spa. other than the attutude of those working at Ferrari and their attitude to F1 and the other teams in F1
:lol: Ciao amico!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:42 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 28, 2006 8:01 pm
Posts: 858
Would F1 survive the loss of Ferrari? Certainly yes.

Would F1 be a better sport without Ferrari? No way, and I struggle to understand how people can think the other way round.

F1 has already experienced a similar loss: Lotus (the real one, not the rebadged current Lotus team), a top team that was every bit as political and alledgelly cheater as Ferrari, as well as reputed for producing dangerous cars. For twenty years F1 was mostly Lotus vs. Ferrari vs. others, just as it has been mostly Ferrari vs. McLaren vs. others for the las thirty years. Both were sports car manufacturers whose cars were directly linked to racing. Both had strong personalities at their respective helms. Did F1 survive after Lotus? Yes, and with better health than ever. Do F1 fans miss Lotus? Well, the fact that two teams have been legally fighting for the "Lotus" name 25 years after their last win should provide an answer...

_________________
I'm a racing driver. Always was, always will be.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:52 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:05 pm
Posts: 2973
Porsan wrote:
Would F1 survive the loss of Ferrari? Certainly yes.

Would F1 be a better sport without Ferrari? No way, and I struggle to understand how people can think the other way round.

F1 has already experienced a similar loss: Lotus (the real one, not the rebadged current Lotus team), a top team that was every bit as political and alledgelly cheater as Ferrari, as well as reputed for producing dangerous cars. For twenty years F1 was mostly Lotus vs. Ferrari vs. others, just as it has been mostly Ferrari vs. McLaren vs. others for the las thirty years. Both were sports car manufacturers whose cars were directly linked to racing. Both had strong personalities at their respective helms. Did F1 survive after Lotus? Yes, and with better health than ever. Do F1 fans miss Lotus? Well, the fact that two teams have been legally fighting for the "Lotus" name 25 years after their last win should provide an answer...

More to do with brand recognition and profit than anything. Most F1 fans are interested in the drivers and the racing.

_________________
We want heroes, but there are few, mainly it's cars - Pedro De La Rosa


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:28 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:44 pm
Posts: 432
veemax wrote:
ferrar1sta wrote:
...
Did you take your pills today, amico? :/ You're probably tired of hearing this, but it would be a lot easier to take your posts seriously if you could make them a little... more... coherent.

I've made it easier for you to understand= ho reso più facile per voi capire. I would have thought that you would have been able to comment on some of the post at least, unless of course you know i'm correct.
There again i don't think you wanted to because you know you don't have any room to manoeuvre. You basically stated that Ferrari is everything. I replied no they are not.
OK? easier?
Stating that peoples opinion is "really cute" as you have to Balibari is a way of belittling the things they say or write. Maybe in an effort to a) attempt to get other people (other Ferrari fans) who read this forum on your side and b) to belittle or attempt to bully the people who objectively disagree with you into shutting up!
In a less beligerent world i would agree with Balibari, however people like you bring out the worst in me because of the blind faith and stupid comments you make.
One of the biggest silly comments is that McLaren are trying to emulate Ferrari. They are not. They are bettering them! They do not have a multinational auto maker shovelling money into new wind tunnels and paying wages etc etc. No, of course Ferrari pays it's own way. Of course FIAT don't bankroll them and of course Ferrari only make road cars to go racing, no they go racing to sell road cars thats FIATS, Lancia and Alfa Romeo and a few Ferraris. Just the same as the watch makers who make £3000 watches and £299 watches.
Ask an adult to read it to you! it's marketing. TAG Heuer Make a £3500 watch, give one to Jensen and one to Lewis an sell hundreds of £300 watches.... Jeez!!! :?
Why do i dislike them so much? Because they do things like changing gearbox seals with scant regard for other competitors. Why don't the other competitors complain? They cannot afford to !
You need to look at the bigger picture, but you won't because it's too difficult, there is reward but to be honest it's nice and cosy in red club Ferrari world so why bother......
By the way, I don't dislike anything about FIAT group spa. other than the attutude of those working at Ferrari and their attitude to F1 and the other teams in F1
:lol: Ciao amico!


Mate, you sound like an arrogant teenager, who thinks he's winning the argument.... i wouldn't be too happy if someone wrote like that to me.

As I and a few others have said, the only thing that matters is that F1 and Ferrari has a mutual need for each other and that both is much better off together. Through their global brand they bring more money to the sport than any other team, and that's just reality.
You say you don't like Ferrari's "dirty tricks", but i wouldn't exactly call the other top teams saints in that matter, they are neither better or worse than Ferrari.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 7:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 3:55 am
Posts: 119
Herbalist wrote:
veemax wrote:
ferrar1sta wrote:
...
Did you take..................

I've made................................. teams in F1
:lol: Ciao amico!

Mate, you sound like an arrogant teenager, who thinks he's winning the argument.... i wouldn't be too happy if someone wrote like that to me.
As I and a few others have said, the only thing that matters is that F1 and Ferrari has a mutual need for each other and that both is much better off together. Through their global brand they bring more money to the sport than any other team, and that's just reality.
You say you don't like Ferrari's "dirty tricks", but i wouldn't exactly call the other top teams saints in that matter, they are neither better or worse than Ferrari.

The o/p asked
VENEKOR wrote:
I'm quite young (in my 20s) so I don't hold that passion for Ferrari that lots of older people do.

Some people, actually probably most people on here seem in complete awe of Ferrari, Ferrari are more worthy, Ferrari are the best team in F1 Ferrari have been in the sport from the very beginning, well actually they have not!, i'm saying i don't like them, i don't look at them and say wow Ferrari! Because if they were as good as some people say they should not need the questionable (at best) ethics. The gearbox seal and the yellow.... no, no! green flag incidents, to name just two are totally pathetic. This is FERRARI, :lol: Yeah i know and look at the levels they stoop to to attempt (and FAIL) to beat Red Bull, a drinks manufacturer. It's laughable, but then so was the spygate scandal. I firmly believe that *** **** knew all about that one long before Stepney walked out of the gates with the paperwork. No i can't prove it but one of the 4 guys involved or someone from ***** will no doubt one day say something. look at grand prix dot com 19473. Top team? Nah, a complete joke? no, not at all but why anyone should treat them like a christian would treat the holy grail really is totally beyond me. So if i come across as a ranting arrogant teenager, i am honestly quite sorry but then so be it! I am bothered but to be honest i feel it needs saying to represent an opinion contrary to the opinion of the herd (of sheep..... Baaa!) and for fairness and because there are not too many who do seem bothered to look at the bigger picture or to read between the lines it should not mean that organisations or companies involved should be able to get away with things unnoticed which i may consider wrong so i feel i am quite correct to point out certain short comings at certain times.
In hindsight i should have stated in my first paragraph that, yes Formula 1 would be worse off without Ferrari, short to medium term without doubt but long term? Hmm, that would depend partly on what Ferrari did next maybe. However other teams such as McLaren? no, not really, Lotus? no, not at all. Williams? no not at all. With the exception of McLaren none of these teams would be missed for more than a couple of seasons at most.....Anyhow it's never going to happen. It's my view and my opinion and it's partly based on the sheep who call themselves Ferrari fans. Yes i know it's a little childish, churlish, immature and if you like mostly badly written but i also know most folks will just label me as a hater so sod it. Sadly for some of you on here i too am allowed an opinion (opinions are like ar*e holes, especially where i'm concerned i hear you say?....yeah ok, thanks!)
Ciao, Forza.............someone else! :lol:
Sorry! :uhoh: :blush: :-((


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:08 am
Posts: 793
Location: Derby
veemax wrote:
Herbalist wrote:
veemax wrote:
ferrar1sta wrote:
...
Did you take..................

I've made................................. teams in F1
:lol: Ciao amico!

Mate, you sound like an arrogant teenager, who thinks he's winning the argument.... i wouldn't be too happy if someone wrote like that to me.
As I and a few others have said, the only thing that matters is that F1 and Ferrari has a mutual need for each other and that both is much better off together. Through their global brand they bring more money to the sport than any other team, and that's just reality.
You say you don't like Ferrari's "dirty tricks", but i wouldn't exactly call the other top teams saints in that matter, they are neither better or worse than Ferrari.

The o/p asked
VENEKOR wrote:
I'm quite young (in my 20s) so I don't hold that passion for Ferrari that lots of older people do.

Some people, actually probably most people on here seem in complete awe of Ferrari, Ferrari are more worthy, Ferrari are the best team in F1 Ferrari have been in the sport from the very beginning, well actually they have not!, i'm saying i don't like them, i don't look at them and say wow Ferrari! Because if they were as good as some people say they should not need the questionable (at best) ethics. The gearbox seal and the yellow.... no, no! green flag incidents, to name just two are totally pathetic. This is FERRARI, :lol: Yeah i know and look at the levels they stoop to to attempt (and FAIL) to beat Red Bull, a drinks manufacturer. It's laughable, but then so was the spygate scandal. I firmly believe that *** **** knew all about that one long before Stepney walked out of the gates with the paperwork. No i can't prove it but one of the 4 guys involved or someone from ***** will no doubt one day say something. look at grand prix dot com 19473. Top team? Nah, a complete joke? no, not at all but why anyone should treat them like a christian would treat the holy grail really is totally beyond me. So if i come across as a ranting arrogant teenager, i am honestly quite sorry but then so be it! I am bothered but to be honest i feel it needs saying to represent an opinion contrary to the opinion of the herd (of sheep..... Baaa!) and for fairness and because there are not too many who do seem bothered to look at the bigger picture or to read between the lines it should not mean that organisations or companies involved should be able to get away with things unnoticed which i may consider wrong so i feel i am quite correct to point out certain short comings at certain times.
In hindsight i should have stated in my first paragraph that, yes Formula 1 would be worse off without Ferrari, short to medium term without doubt but long term? Hmm, that would depend partly on what Ferrari did next maybe. However other teams such as McLaren? no, not really, Lotus? no, not at all. Williams? no not at all. With the exception of McLaren none of these teams would be missed for more than a couple of seasons at most.....Anyhow it's never going to happen. It's my view and my opinion and it's partly based on the sheep who call themselves Ferrari fans. Yes i know it's a little childish, churlish, immature and if you like mostly badly written but i also know most folks will just label me as a hater so sod it. Sadly for some of you on here i too am allowed an opinion (opinions are like ar*e holes, especially where i'm concerned i hear you say?....yeah ok, thanks!)
Ciao, Forza.............someone else! :lol:
Sorry! :uhoh: :blush: :-((

in not Ferraris biggest fan but they are the most successful team in history your looking at the past 3 years. You cant disregard the whole history of the sport because it doesn't suit your argument, red bull have also been found cheating in regards to their car, or pushing rules to the limit finding loopholes however you want to call it, just the same as them taking the letter of the law in the design factor Ferrari took it with the gear box none or within the spirit of the law but still acceptable, had red bull had points taken off them for the races the car was found to be illegal then Alonso would have won and your argument of them not winning for a while would be defunct. No teams are saints so to highlight one and not the other isn't proving anything, most successful team in f1 history they have won titles before and will do again.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:13 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:54 pm
Posts: 374
Location: York, United Kingdom.
Can't stand Ferrari wouldn't be sad to see them go.

_________________
Lewis Hamilton - 2008 World Drivers Champion! Mercedes - 2014 World Constructors' Champions!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:51 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 3:55 am
Posts: 119
potter84 wrote:
veemax wrote:
Herbalist wrote:
veemax wrote:
ferrar1sta wrote:
...
Did you take..................

I've made................................. teams in F1

Mate, you sound like an arrogant teenager.........
It's my view and my opinion and it's partly based on the sheep who call themselves Ferrari fans. Yes i know it's a little childish, churlish, immature and if you like mostly badly written but i also know most folks will just label me as a hater so sod it. Sadly for some of you on here i too am allowed an opinion (opinions are like ar*e holes, especially where i'm concerned i hear you say?....yeah ok, thanks!)
Ciao.
Sorry!

in not Ferraris biggest fan but they are the most successful team in history*1 your looking at the past 3 years*2. You cant disregard the whole history of the sport because it doesn't suit your argument*3*, red bull have alsobeen found cheating in regards to their car*4 or pushing rules to the limit finding loopholes however you want to call it, just the same as them taking the letter of the law in the design factor Ferrari took it with the gear box none or within the spirit of the law but still acceptable*5, had red bull had points taken off them for the races the car was found to be illegal*6 then Alonso would have won and your argument of them not winning for a while would be defunct*7. No teams are saints so to highlight one and not the other isn't proving anything, most successful team in f1 history they have won titles before and will do again.


I'm sorry but i don't agree with your argument in favour of and for Ferrari. History? Did you disregard the Ferrari International assistance years. I'm not going to go into all of that here, i can't be bothrerd but it seems quite obvious you're a Ferrari fan with that in mind i'm quite easily able to disregard some of the things you say!
*1 Ferrari are the most succesful team in history simply because they have been around longer than anyone else!
*2 No, I have been watching for over 30 years and history shows further back than the last three years how "successful" Ferrai have been, take a few years earlier when Schumacher was at Ferrari, very successful especially at taking Hill off the track, at winning races in the pits and other really constructive ways of getting the win! also? :lol: great choice of word, so an admission that Ferrari cheat then!THANK YOU!!!

3* Red Bull have been found Cheating? No i don't believe they have, Pushing the envelope? well the wing in question was passed by the fia. Only after Ferrari could not actually make their own (remember Massa's wing breaking a few times :lol:) was the wing outlawed It's called manipulation. If you can't better the better team you get the rules changed! Then you buy the people from the other team. Newey and Vettel will probably end up at maranello.

4* Pushinmg the limit? Interpretation of the rules, these things Red Bull do, quite legitimately. They get the parts checked by the fia, who pronounce them legal, or not. The hole in the floor was one such thing, it took the fia about a month (iirc) to clarify that technical "innovation"

*5 The gearbox thing, some people still don't want to understand (or am i wrong) It affected other lesser drivers and teams, they do not complain because if one were to upset Ferrari then eventually it costs them money!

*6 Take points from Red Bull? Yes maybe, change the rules so that cars who are sponsored by energy drinks companies have a 100kg weight penalty.
Red Bull have done nothing unsporting or outside the rules. The hole in the floor was not illegal, Red Bull raced with it and were allowed to race with their innovation until the law was clarified.
There seems to have been a length of time where Red Bull gained an advantage, through a technical innovation which was then outlawed. If the fia had stated that the hole in the floor was to be subjected to a technical study and a meeting where a decision was to be made on the legality of it they could also have stated that if Red Bull raced with the hole in the mean time and it was found to be illegal they would lose (for example) 25% of the points gained whilst the said part was under investigation.
I'm quite sure Red Bull would have looked at any advantage again and probably decided that it wasn't worth the trouble, there by negating any need for an fia technical decision etc etc.

*7 They have not won in a while have they....

No teams are saints? No all are sinners! Just some are much, much, much more than others!


I'm genuinely sorry to go on (and on) but i feel a great injustice and i feel that Ferrari and the supporters of Ferrari are pulling the wool over everyones eyes.

Should i say anything about the British Grand Prix in 2011 Ferrari didn't complain (much) no but the Renault powered teams ended up losing most and we all know who gained most... The only win of the season and only because they couldn't get the blown diffuser thingy majig to work properly. If you can't beat 'em get the bloody thing banned!
Remember Ferrari's reliability issues in 2010?

The FIA gave consent to Ferrari to make modifications to their engine, in order to improve the reliability following issues during the opening four races of the season. That's normal, not changing gear box seals to give your driver an advantage neither he or the team has earned! Oh well....

EDIT: Carry on, i'm not going to post on this thread again. The reason? People *may* start to think i'm a little anti, or even worse. Those in their early teans might think i'm a "hater" :lol: Enough is enough because i'm not! I really think the playing field isn't level and has never in the last 30 years been level!
Edited to appease everyone!


Last edited by veemax on Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:38 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:10 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:07 pm
Posts: 5910
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

_________________
Räikkönen - Vettel - Rosberg - Bottas


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 3:55 am
Posts: 119
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm
Posts: 1574
veemax wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?


Year cos Schumacher constantly took Hill off didn't he?!

_________________
Going to Spa? Check out my site. http://visit-spa-francorchamps.page.tl/
My own Google Earth Motor Sport file. http://www.mediafire.com/?jzm1ieatytv
Follow me @asphalt_world
Oh and Bernie, National flags should be raised not flipped. Sort it!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:07 pm
Posts: 5910
veemax wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?

Of course you're entitled to an explanation. I find the style rude and arrogant because you're basically laughing at every other statement you're arguing, and it's hard to read mostly because of the lack of paragraphs.

_________________
Räikkönen - Vettel - Rosberg - Bottas


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:07 pm
Posts: 5750
orbthef1fan wrote:
Can't stand Ferrari wouldn't be sad to see them go.

So what? Many fans would be sad. Ferrari fans are important part of F1, because there are many Ferrari fans.

_________________
..


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:08 am
Posts: 793
Location: Derby
I'm actually a Williams fan :-) i just respect other teams, like red bull i think the dominance they have achieved so soon after being established is remarkable, but people are so quick to slag teams off.

as for your of course Ferrari are the most successful they have been in it longer, then notts county should be the most successful football club.

people keep bringing up red bull being a fizzy drinks company so what where the money comes from? Not many on the grid make their money from selling cars so what does it matter if its a drinks company, airliner, car company or a porno company what matters is they are in the sport to compete against the most competitive teams in the world?

as for red bull being legal i didn't say it wasn't i said people called it different things but had the points they had won with their cars in that condition been invalidated Alonso would have won the title.

yes the gearbox at austin wasn't great but like red bull was within the rules, yes it effected others but so did Schumacher letting vettel through at brazil and they aren't even in the same team.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:24 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 3:55 am
Posts: 119
dizlexik wrote:
orbthef1fan wrote:
Can't stand Ferrari wouldn't be sad to see them go.

So what? Many fans would be sad. Ferrari fans are important part of F1, because there are many Ferrari fans.

O/P was talking about the team really. orbthef1fan merely gave his opinion, which is that he can't stand Ferrari and he would not be sad to see them go.
Asphalt_World wrote:
veemax wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?

Year cos Schumacher constantly took Hill off didn't he?!

Oh.......{ furrowed brow, sigh, eyes to the right } Yeah, once was enough for some of us though.
Covalent wrote:
veemax wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?

Of course you're entitled to an explanation. I find the style rude and arrogant because you're basically laughing at every other statement you're arguing, and it's hard to read mostly because of the lack of paragraphs.

Every other? Maybe even more than that! I will try to edit for you quite shortly. :lol: If that's all you have to complain about then i'm laughing!
I did say i was done here, obviously i'm not so.......
potter84 wrote:
I'm actually a Williams fan :-) i just respect other teams, like red bull i think the dominance they have achieved so soon after being established is remarkable, but people are so quick to slag teams off.
as for your of course Ferrari are the most successful they have been in it longer, then notts county should be the most successful football club.

Really? So Notts county have done what exactly to create an image or to actually get people to go to Meadow lane to watch them play? Which top players have they enlisted the services of? When did they ever go on a decent cup run? Did they ever do anything other than lend Juventus a few shirts a few decades ago? Cloughie and Forest well now your taliking but that was the red end and a few years after! :lol: You what? Old Big head was the best manager i've ever seen in this country!!!!!
potter84 wrote:
people keep bringing up red bull being a fizzy drinks company so what where the money comes from? Not many on the grid make their money from selling cars so what does it matter if its a drinks company, airliner, car company or a porno company what matters is they are in the sport to compete against the most competitive teams in the world?

I think Montezemolo or some other muppet from their squad first said it as a detrimental comment about the greatest team in F1
potter84 wrote:
as for red bull being legal i didn't say it wasn't i said people called it different things but had the points they had won with their cars in that condition been invalidated Alonso would have won the title.
Why do you feel you (or anyone else) has a right to say that the cars were " in that condition" like they were legal but only just?
or like because Ferrari didn't think of it then it's not fair or it's cheating? points invalidated? What ever gives anyone the right to assume that the points Red Bull earned should be invalidated, by definition you are saying that there is a questsion over the way the points were earned! Fianlly He (Alonso) didn't because they (Red Bull) were not cheating and he Fernando Alonso and the Ferrari F1 team) were not worthy even with the gearbox seal change and the constant complaining about everyone else Alonso was on the radio about every other weekend (Hamilton mainly) they were simply not good enough.
potter84 wrote:
yes the gearbox at austin wasn't great but like red bull was within the rules, yes it effected others but so did Schumacher letting vettel through at brazil and they aren't even in the same team.

It's a sham! This is Ferrari, the " greatest team in F1" Except they are not! Red Bull are!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:29 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2008 4:33 pm
Posts: 1737
Location: Bangor, Gwynedd, Wales
Wow, someone thinks the sun shines out of his pickle...

Back on topic, which team has the most WCC crowns? How about WDC? You know, I'm sure veemax will be desperate to prove me wrong here, but I'm pretty certain Ferrari are somewhere near the top of both of those lists. THAT is how they are the greatest team in F1, and I've never been a fan of them before someone says I'm biased.

_________________
Copper Masked Sunrise
http://www.justgiving.com/CIN-Mystery-P ... 00b9467dcb
https://www.facebook.com/BadExcusesBand


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:59 am
Posts: 112
Tufty wrote:
Wow, someone thinks the sun shines out of his pickle...

Back on topic, which team has the most WCC crowns? How about WDC? You know, I'm sure veemax will be desperate to prove me wrong here, but I'm pretty certain Ferrari are somewhere near the top of both of those lists. THAT is how they are the greatest team in F1, and I've never been a fan of them before someone says I'm biased.


Well if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns nothing is close to Red Bull, I remember Lucawindbag slagging Red Bull off when they won the first WDC and WCC titles I notice he hasn't done it this year.

I'm totally on the line with drivers and teams I don't support anyone I find it more enjoyable then and I can see a more open picture than I used to have when Mansell was at Williams I thought that's where to Sun came from, (Mansells pickle).


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:23 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2008 4:33 pm
Posts: 1737
Location: Bangor, Gwynedd, Wales
kimandsally wrote:
Well if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns nothing is close to Red Bull.

True, although BrawnGP might argue the toss on that. However, you need to be a long term team to be a great one. McLaren, Ferrari, Williams and Lotus had more tan 4 years apiece fighting for the titles, and those under varying regulations while the crux of the 2009-12 ones have been the same. In short, the jury's out as to whether they are a great team in the making or not - they may be gone by the end of 2015 if their performance drops at all.

_________________
Copper Masked Sunrise
http://www.justgiving.com/CIN-Mystery-P ... 00b9467dcb
https://www.facebook.com/BadExcusesBand


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:47 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:22 am
Posts: 2688
Tufty wrote:
Wow, someone thinks the sun shines out of his pickle...

Back on topic, which team has the most WCC crowns? How about WDC? You know, I'm sure veemax will be desperate to prove me wrong here, but I'm pretty certain Ferrari are somewhere near the top of both of those lists. THAT is how they are the greatest team in F1, and I've never been a fan of them before someone says I'm biased.

:thumbup: Which is why it would be a sad day if Ferrari left F1 - even though I seriously dislike the way they occasionally behave, particularly this season.

Off topic for a moment, I LOVE your avatar!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 8:11 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:08 am
Posts: 793
Location: Derby
veemax wrote:
dizlexik wrote:
orbthef1fan wrote:
Can't stand Ferrari wouldn't be sad to see them go.

So what? Many fans would be sad. Ferrari fans are important part of F1, because there are many Ferrari fans.

O/P was talking about the team really. orbthef1fan merely gave his opinion, which is that he can't stand Ferrari and he would not be sad to see them go.
Asphalt_World wrote:
veemax wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?

Year cos Schumacher constantly took Hill off didn't he?!

Oh.......{ furrowed brow, sigh, eyes to the right } Yeah, once was enough for some of us though.
Covalent wrote:
veemax wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Oh what an annoying style of writing. Rude and difficult to read, so a real joy.

Hi Covalent, If you can't read it or you don't like it don't have to read it. You have a choice much the same as anyone else. I have an opinion and a right to express it.
I would however like to know why you think it's rude and why you are having difficulty reading it?

Of course you're entitled to an explanation. I find the style rude and arrogant because you're basically laughing at every other statement you're arguing, and it's hard to read mostly because of the lack of paragraphs.

Every other? Maybe even more than that! I will try to edit for you quite shortly. :lol: If that's all you have to complain about then i'm laughing!
I did say i was done here, obviously i'm not so.......
potter84 wrote:
I'm actually a Williams fan :-) i just respect other teams, like red bull i think the dominance they have achieved so soon after being established is remarkable, but people are so quick to slag teams off.
as for your of course Ferrari are the most successful they have been in it longer, then notts county should be the most successful football club.

Really? So Notts county have done what exactly to create an image or to actually get people to go to Meadow lane to watch them play? Which top players have they enlisted the services of? When did they ever go on a decent cup run? Did they ever do anything other than lend Juventus a few shirts a few decades ago? Cloughie and Forest well now your taliking but that was the red end and a few years after! :lol: You what? Old Big head was the best manager i've ever seen in this country!!!!!
potter84 wrote:
people keep bringing up red bull being a fizzy drinks company so what where the money comes from? Not many on the grid make their money from selling cars so what does it matter if its a drinks company, airliner, car company or a porno company what matters is they are in the sport to compete against the most competitive teams in the world?

I think Montezemolo or some other muppet from their squad first said it as a detrimental comment about the greatest team in F1
potter84 wrote:
as for red bull being legal i didn't say it wasn't i said people called it different things but had the points they had won with their cars in that condition been invalidated Alonso would have won the title.
Why do you feel you (or anyone else) has a right to say that the cars were " in that condition" like they were legal but only just?
or like because Ferrari didn't think of it then it's not fair or it's cheating? points invalidated? What ever gives anyone the right to assume that the points Red Bull earned should be invalidated, by definition you are saying that there is a questsion over the way the points were earned! Fianlly He (Alonso) didn't because they (Red Bull) were not cheating and he Fernando Alonso and the Ferrari F1 team) were not worthy even with the gearbox seal change and the constant complaining about everyone else Alonso was on the radio about every other weekend (Hamilton mainly) they were simply not good enough.
potter84 wrote:
yes the gearbox at austin wasn't great but like red bull was within the rules, yes it effected others but so did Schumacher letting vettel through at brazil and they aren't even in the same team.

It's a sham! This is Ferrari, the " greatest team in F1" Except they are not! Red Bull are!

first the notts county comment was in response to you saying Ferrari are the most successful because they are the oldest, as notts county is regarded as the oldest club. Red bull are currently the best team in f1 where did i state anywhere they weren't? All i said was that Ferrari were the most successful (this is true) and that they will win titles again (most probably true) they have the budget and can lure just about anyone. Saying that i don't think newey would go his wife didn't want to relocate earlier in his career but newey wont be around too much longer in f1 imo


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 28, 2006 8:01 pm
Posts: 858
kimandsally wrote:
Well if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns nothing is close to Red Bull.


Wrong, if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns, Brawn GP is very obviously the best team ever, with 100% success on WDC and 100% success on WCC. However, both Brawn GP and Red Bull Racing were/are rebadged iterations of previous teams: BAR/Honda/Brawn/Mercedes or Stewart/Jaguar/RBR. If we compare the success ratio of those two teams on the long run, along their different names, with Ferrari's, I don't think it's any better.

That said, some may agree that Ferrari is the best team ever, some may not but what is simply ridiculous is to pretend that Ferrari is NOT one of the great names in the History of motorsport and an integral part of F1 History.

_________________
I'm a racing driver. Always was, always will be.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:33 pm
Posts: 5057
Location: Ireland
Porsan wrote:
kimandsally wrote:
Well if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns nothing is close to Red Bull.


Wrong, if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns, Brawn GP is very obviously the best team ever, with 100% success on WDC and 100% success on WCC. However, both Brawn GP and Red Bull Racing were/are rebadged iterations of previous teams: BAR/Honda/Brawn/Mercedes or Stewart/Jaguar/RBR. If we compare the success ratio of those two teams on the long run, along their different names, with Ferrari's, I don't think it's any better.

That said, some may agree that Ferrari is the best team ever, some may not but what is simply ridiculous is to pretend that Ferrari is NOT one of the great names in the History of motorsport and an integral part of F1 History.

Yep.

The team currently known as Red Bull have won 6 out a possible 32 titles between 1997 and today, or a success rate of 18.75%.

Ferrari have won 31 out of a possible 118 titles (note: no constructors titles until 1958), or a success rate of 26.27%.
Williams - 16 out of a possible 72, or 22.22%.
McLaren - 20 out of a possible 94, or 21.28%.

2 more titles next year and Red Bull will overtake Williams and McLaren in terms of success rate. They will still trail Ferrari.

_________________
"I am a believer, but I start each Grand Prix with 195 liters of fuel behind me," he explains. "I don't rely entirely on God, I rely on Prost."


#14 for '14


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm
Posts: 1574
Porsan wrote:
kimandsally wrote:
Well if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns nothing is close to Red Bull.


Wrong, if you divide the number of years in the sport by the amount of WCC and WDC crowns, Brawn GP is very obviously the best team ever, with 100% success on WDC and 100% success on WCC. However, both Brawn GP and Red Bull Racing were/are rebadged iterations of previous teams: BAR/Honda/Brawn/Mercedes or Stewart/Jaguar/RBR. If we compare the success ratio of those two teams on the long run, along their different names, with Ferrari's, I don't think it's any better.

That said, some may agree that Ferrari is the best team ever, some may not but what is simply ridiculous is to pretend that Ferrari is NOT one of the great names in the History of motorsport and an integral part of F1 History.


Exactly. I also hear that Messi is currently Barcelona's second highest scorer in 2013.....

Don't you just love stats?

_________________
Going to Spa? Check out my site. http://visit-spa-francorchamps.page.tl/
My own Google Earth Motor Sport file. http://www.mediafire.com/?jzm1ieatytv
Follow me @asphalt_world
Oh and Bernie, National flags should be raised not flipped. Sort it!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:38 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 4:12 pm
Posts: 3553
Location: Nebraska, USA
:lol:
I have to admit, when I first started reading this thread I was laughing my donkey off at the ignorance of F1, F1 history, and Ferrari being posted, usually by some whose vast knowledge of F1 starts with the mid 2000s. Of course, that is not unexpected as it is pretty much a monthly happening on the forum anyway.

I often wonder why it is that oh so many refuse to do their homework and actually LEARN about something before the speak out, but then, when I go back to my 25 years of teaching High School, it makes perfect sense. You see, there is a tendency to dismiss history and think that only today matters, or only what you personally have experienced. Why do research that might cause you to have to change your views, much easier to just put down what you don't know as unimportant. Like it or not, F1 did not start with Red Bull, or even with McLaren and Senna.

There are few things here in this thread that are really based on reality, and a whole bunch of crap that is merely based on personal biases, ie... intense dislike of Ferrari, intense support for "local" teams, etc. Some have made some legitimate cases (mostly on pages 2 & 3 after we got through the bullshit page) as to why Ferrari might get more "credit" than they deserve, and some have pointed out the simple fact that Ferrari has the history to back up the claim of them being critical to F1.

Why does Ferrari have such an elevated place in F1? As Tufty said, more WCCs & more WDCs than any other team. Higher marketing value than any other team. Higher world-wide recognition as a racing entity than any other F1 team. Larger fan base than any other team. and... yes, many drivers aspire to sit in a Ferrari seat as a part of their F1 career. You can make all the excuses you want, but those items are pretty much undeniable (except by some of our most fervent anti-Ferrari members, of course).

As I have pointed out before, We here in the forum represent only the most avid of racing fans, which in turn is only a very small part of the world population. More than that, this being an UK based forum, we also have a predominance of members from that country, and of course, they are as patriotic as the citizens of most countries. Oh, I know you will deny it, you will tell me for what is probably the 1000th time of the past 12 years of membership on this forum, how you are unbiased and totally fair in your assessments, but face it, we all have our biases, and to deny that only makes you look foolish. What we need to remember is that F1 is about much more than the few thousand F1 fans that belong to forums, we merely represent the most avid. We are dwarfed by less fanatical fans.

The point is, Ferrari is the face of F1. Not McLaren, not Red Bull, not Williams, not Renault, not Mercedes. Most of the world know who Mercedes is, but as a manufacturer. Most people know who Red Bull is, but a relatively small percentage know that they have been winning in F1 lately. The Williams recognition factor outside of the F1 fan and the UK, is almost non-existent. And McLaren? As much as I hate to tell you, they too suffer from brand recognition, though their two road cars (the F1 and today's sports car) are increasing their brand recognition. However, mention Ferrari and see what reaction you get among the populace. Fast sports cars and racing... and not necessarily in that order. The Ferrari logo is one of the most recognized automotive, if not the most, logo in the world. Thus that adds great value to F1 in the commercial sense. Whether it is the fans that attends the races, the fans who watch the races on TV or the fans that buy the clothing or promotionals, F1 benefits by Ferrari's participation. Yes, even the other teams get benefits from the Ferrari shirts that are sold. That is why they are so important to the financial aspect of F1.

Would F1 survive without Ferrari? Probably so, but it would be a different F1 than you see today... at least for a while. Would Ferrari survive without F1? No doubt. Ferrari is extremely healthy as a car manufacture, their name is made (yes in large part do to F1), but the name recognition is there, the Ferrari "mystique" is there. That is not going away if Ferrari quits F1. Besides, Ferrari will race, if for no other reason than to stay on top of technological developments.

Obviously, it is better for F1 if Ferrari stays, and better for Ferrari as well. And better for the forum, as some of you would be lost if you didn't have them to kick around!
:nod:

Just a couple of previous comments to address...
Sabrina,
Williams and McLaren will warrant a larger share of the F1 historical monies as soon as they have more years in the sport than does Ferrari. Pretty simple really.

to whoever said.
"Team Lotus and Cooper F1 team have arguably done more for the sport than the team that Enzo created"... bullshit. Cooper was innovative, as was Chapman... and they deserve great credit for it, but to randomly dismiss 62 years of participation in F1, outlasting all other teams, including Lotus & Cooper, and helping to build the sport into what it is today... you can't just brush that aside.

and one of the most laughable of all...
"They would be no more missed than Williams, McLaren, Sauber or any other long standing team with the same name".
You just keep believing that... while the rest of the forum shakes their head in wonderment. Better than half of this forum could even tell you who Sauber's drivers were this year...
:lol:

_________________
Forza Ferrari
WCCs = 16
WDCs = 15


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 11:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:22 am
Posts: 2688
Blake - Excellent post that summed up the situation v well IMO.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:08 am
Posts: 793
Location: Derby
Blake wrote:
:lol:
I have to admit, when I first started reading this thread I was laughing my donkey off at the ignorance of F1, F1 history, and Ferrari being posted, usually by some whose vast knowledge of F1 starts with the mid 2000s. Of course, that is not unexpected as it is pretty much a monthly happening on the forum anyway.

I often wonder why it is that oh so many refuse to do their homework and actually LEARN about something before the speak out, but then, when I go back to my 25 years of teaching High School, it makes perfect sense. You see, there is a tendency to dismiss history and think that only today matters, or only what you personally have experienced. Why do research that might cause you to have to change your views, much easier to just put down what you don't know as unimportant. Like it or not, F1 did not start with Red Bull, or even with McLaren and Senna.

There are few things here in this thread that are really based on reality, and a whole bunch of crap that is merely based on personal biases, ie... intense dislike of Ferrari, intense support for "local" teams, etc. Some have made some legitimate cases (mostly on pages 2 & 3 after we got through the bullshit page) as to why Ferrari might get more "credit" than they deserve, and some have pointed out the simple fact that Ferrari has the history to back up the claim of them being critical to F1.

Why does Ferrari have such an elevated place in F1? As Tufty said, more WCCs & more WDCs than any other team. Higher marketing value than any other team. Higher world-wide recognition as a racing entity than any other F1 team. Larger fan base than any other team. and... yes, many drivers aspire to sit in a Ferrari seat as a part of their F1 career. You can make all the excuses you want, but those items are pretty much undeniable (except by some of our most fervent anti-Ferrari members, of course).

As I have pointed out before, We here in the forum represent only the most avid of racing fans, which in turn is only a very small part of the world population. More than that, this being an UK based forum, we also have a predominance of members from that country, and of course, they are as patriotic as the citizens of most countries. Oh, I know you will deny it, you will tell me for what is probably the 1000th time of the past 12 years of membership on this forum, how you are unbiased and totally fair in your assessments, but face it, we all have our biases, and to deny that only makes you look foolish. What we need to remember is that F1 is about much more than the few thousand F1 fans that belong to forums, we merely represent the most avid. We are dwarfed by less fanatical fans.

The point is, Ferrari is the face of F1. Not McLaren, not Red Bull, not Williams, not Renault, not Mercedes. Most of the world know who Mercedes is, but as a manufacturer. Most people know who Red Bull is, but a relatively small percentage know that they have been winning in F1 lately. The Williams recognition factor outside of the F1 fan and the UK, is almost non-existent. And McLaren? As much as I hate to tell you, they too suffer from brand recognition, though their two road cars (the F1 and today's sports car) are increasing their brand recognition. However, mention Ferrari and see what reaction you get among the populace. Fast sports cars and racing... and not necessarily in that order. The Ferrari logo is one of the most recognized automotive, if not the most, logo in the world. Thus that adds great value to F1 in the commercial sense. Whether it is the fans that attends the races, the fans who watch the races on TV or the fans that buy the clothing or promotionals, F1 benefits by Ferrari's participation. Yes, even the other teams get benefits from the Ferrari shirts that are sold. That is why they are so important to the financial aspect of F1.

Would F1 survive without Ferrari? Probably so, but it would be a different F1 than you see today... at least for a while. Would Ferrari survive without F1? No doubt. Ferrari is extremely healthy as a car manufacture, their name is made (yes in large part do to F1), but the name recognition is there, the Ferrari "mystique" is there. That is not going away if Ferrari quits F1. Besides, Ferrari will race, if for no other reason than to stay on top of technological developments.

Obviously, it is better for F1 if Ferrari stays, and better for Ferrari as well. And better for the forum, as some of you would be lost if you didn't have them to kick around!
:nod:

Just a couple of previous comments to address...
Sabrina,
Williams and McLaren will warrant a larger share of the F1 historical monies as soon as they have more years in the sport than does Ferrari. Pretty simple really.

to whoever said.
"Team Lotus and Cooper F1 team have arguably done more for the sport than the team that Enzo created"... bullshit. Cooper was innovative, as was Chapman... and they deserve great credit for it, but to randomly dismiss 62 years of participation in F1, outlasting all other teams, including Lotus & Cooper, and helping to build the sport into what it is today... you can't just brush that aside.

and one of the most laughable of all...
"They would be no more missed than Williams, McLaren, Sauber or any other long standing team with the same name".
You just keep believing that... while the rest of the forum shakes their head in wonderment. Better than half of this forum could even tell you who Sauber's drivers were this year...
:lol:

big post but all makes perfect sense, especially brand recognition for teams around the world and out of f1.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 4:12 pm
Posts: 30
metamorphomisk wrote:
If F1 is soda, then Ferrari would be Coca-Cola I guess...


Make that a Campari soda.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:07 pm
Posts: 5910
boing007 wrote:
metamorphomisk wrote:
If F1 is soda, then Ferrari would be Coca-Cola I guess...


Make that a Campari soda.

...with a cigarette butt floating in it.

_________________
Räikkönen - Vettel - Rosberg - Bottas


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:44 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:29 pm
Posts: 870
Location: Qart-Hadast
Blake wrote:
my 25 years of teaching High School.
It's great to read that!

Blake wrote:
And McLaren? As much as I hate to tell you, they too suffer from brand recognition, though their two road cars (the F1 and today's sports car) are increasing their brand recognition.
I wouldn't be so sure... :twisted:

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:48 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:59 am
Posts: 112
One of the things I hate about Ferrari is the extra money they get from Berni and Montezemalo's attitude when you see the small teams struggling for cash and do a great job with a minimal amount of money.

I suppose it's like people the rich get richer and poor get poorer as the saying goes.
But one thing I will never understand is the drivers that go to Ferrari the number 2 will never win unless number 1 can't win which if I was a driver I would not want, every win I would get I would want to have earned and if I was leading and had to pull over to let my team mate through I wouldn't like that either.
The only times I would find this acceptable is if mathematically I could not win the DC but if I did give a win up I would expect it to be returned next season so when I retire the number of wins I have would reflet the true number of wins.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: A2jdl, Alexa [Bot], davidheath461, Guia, jrwb6e, Lentulus, Malkiiin, pokerman, pubpokerplayer, RaisinChips, ryan2032, tgroadster, VDV23, Vyse, Wingers66 and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group