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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:32 am 
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BRAIN OF IRELAND wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
BRAIN OF IRELAND wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
BRAIN OF IRELAND wrote:
Funny how Marko seems to only be able to pay SV compliments while simultaneously denigrating (whether accurate or not) his team mate and main opposition.

To be fair most team bosses have done the same over the course of the 2012 season in some form.

That is true. Doesn't make it any more palatable but true.

Has Marko ever been reported as criticizing SV?

No but has SD ever publicly criticised Alonso? Not that I can remember.

Given Marko isn't even the TP of Red Bull, he's just an advisor. He's been there since 1999. Vettel singed for the Red Bull junior team in 1998 so he and Marko go back 13 years. Vettel would likely have been Marko's first real Red Bull protege to guide and it's his job to big the guy up and tout him as the biggest talent around, I guess old habits die hard.

Indeed. However after 3 consecutive WDC's one wonders why Marko still feels the need to 'tout' or even 'defend' SV.

Habit probably.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:21 am 
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Formula1Fan. wrote:
Vettel is the Marko meal ticket, he justifies his position so he'll twist everything in his way so he can pick up his fat pay-cheque from Dieter the liquid caffeine salesman. I can't believe some would actually fall for the biased nonsense he spouts, he was even accusing the FIA of race-fixing and a conspiracy against RB and Vettel mid-season when things weren't going his way.

I'm not sure why he uses Brazil as an example of Vettel's ability to pass either, almost everyone let him through! And yes Webber struggles with technical problems when the title looks on, Domenicali has already raised the question.

Bottom line, people see Vettel is a good (not great) driver but they recognise Red Bull provide a great car and a great team which secures the wins and nothing Marko spouts is going to change that perception.

Red Bull had the opportunity to sign one of the two best drivers on the paddock in Lewis Hamilton, Marko's response:

Quote:
"It doesn't matter if you're the fastest driver or not if it doesn't fit with the team."

I don't care if you're the best, don't touch my meal-ticket...


Normally yes, but is he wrong in this interview?

You mean Domenicali started the psychological war before the RB team. Nice of him, but very unfortunate, he could have chosen another topic

Thet could very well be true. Also it could be that it's totally freaking true. Vettel/RB is working wonders, why change it? The best may not fit the team and it's mentality, 2007 too far for you to remember?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:28 am 
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Kushal Msc-3 wrote:
Interesting comments and replies.

Here's my view-

1) I think Marko is a bit of a dreamer if he thinks MW can't handle the hot kettle. F1 is a highly demanding and competitive sport and a lot of it is down to the driver adapting to the machinery. It has nothing to do with pressure. Sitting on an armchair and passing comments is highly easy. There's no doubt that SV has been better than MW. He totally walloped him in 2011, but I don't think the same can be said about 2010 or 2012. SV excels in making sure his bad days aren't as bad as MW's. Starts and KERS have been an issue for MW and I think it's a bit down to some bad luck. SV is the better driver but if someone is suggesting that MW can't handle the "pressure" after so many years in such a ruthless sport having only received an opprtunity at the big prize so late in his career then they understand little about life. It isn't just always about sport and winning. MW doesn't need to drive for a living any more and he fought the WDC in 2010 with an injury. There's more to life.

2) JS really? Where was he when he was @ 25? Not a triple champion I don't think. I'm with HM on this.


1) KERS has been an issue generally with Renault engines, but starts are totally his fault and not bad luck. Not after the nth time

2) A little unfair to compare them at the same age, different times. And because he wasn't a triple champ at 25 doesn't mean he can't express his opinion; he's earned that much, even if we don't agree with it

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:31 am 
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BRAIN OF IRELAND wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
BRAIN OF IRELAND wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
BRAIN OF IRELAND wrote:
Funny how Marko seems to only be able to pay SV compliments while simultaneously denigrating (whether accurate or not) his team mate and main opposition.

To be fair most team bosses have done the same over the course of the 2012 season in some form.

That is true. Doesn't make it any more palatable but true.

Has Marko ever been reported as criticizing SV?

No but has SD ever publicly criticised Alonso? Not that I can remember.

Given Marko isn't even the TP of Red Bull, he's just an advisor. He's been there since 1999. Vettel singed for the Red Bull junior team in 1998 so he and Marko go back 13 years. Vettel would likely have been Marko's first real Red Bull protege to guide and it's his job to big the guy up and tout him as the biggest talent around, I guess old habits die hard.

Indeed. However after 3 consecutive WDC's one wonders why Marko still feels the need to 'tout' or even 'defend' SV.


Good point, he doesn't really need to, the WDC's speak for themselves. But the same criticisms of Vettel and Red Bull have lingered, wilfully ignoring the facts, and everybody has limits to their patience.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:57 am 
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Johnston wrote:
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2) JS really? Where was he when he was @ 25? Not a triple champion I don't think. I'm with HM on this.


You can't really use the age argument . As far as thats concerned it's a different world. In JS day someone Sebs age would hardly get the chance to touch an F1 car nevermind race one.


I can't use the age argument may be. SV has already achieved what JS ever did and any sane human would not put it past SV to win another WDC before he's finished and unforseen circumstances aside, that sounds like a good decade at the very least from now on.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:34 am 
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So much for Aussie Grit.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:40 am 
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He's already achieved what JS did. But things have changed so much the age thing is worlds apart. Back in the 60's most guys had to wait until they had jobs to fund there own local club racing.

Seb and Co were able to start much younger as parents and then the Likes of Red Bull picked up the tabs. It's a more fast track approach to getting into F1 now. JS was 26 when he started racing. What would have been considered a young buck then. Today a driver at 26 would be on the verge of over the hill for their first start.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:07 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
He's already achieved what JS did. But things have changed so much the age thing is worlds apart. Back in the 60's most guys had to wait until they had jobs to fund there own local club racing.

Seb and Co were able to start much younger as parents and then the Likes of Red Bull picked up the tabs. It's a more fast track approach to getting into F1 now. JS was 26 when he started racing. What would have been considered a young buck then. Today a driver at 26 would be on the verge of over the hill for their first start.

History will probably show that Damon Hill was the last F1 World Champion not to have raced karts as a kid. If you look back at the last 16 seasons you'll find that in each case the champion driver began kart racing well before becoming old enough to drive on the road - and in most cases before he was ten years old. Jacques Villeneuve is the only exception - he didn't start in karts until he was a geriatric 14. Before Damon Hill you have to go back to Niki Lauda in 1984 to find a WDC who didn't begin in karts.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:04 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
Not any different than "old" Marko...there's always a hard truth in what he says.

I was expecting to see feathers ruffled about his "phenomenon" comment. I think its YOU guys that are becoming more reasonable, not Dr. Marko ;)

I've read the article again, i don't see the word phenomenon

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:22 pm 
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Formula1Fan. wrote:
I'm not sure why he uses Brazil as an example of Vettel's ability to pass either, almost everyone let him through!


Oh come on, stop exaggerating. Even apart from the few that let him by instead of racing him (because most of them did), it was still an immense return through the field in conditions that were far from perfect. Why always focus on the 4 cars that let him by if he made a whole string of overtakings on the others?

Personally, I feel h should have mentioned Spa too.

Ontopic: Marko is known for acting quite the idiot, but I don't see anything really wrong with what he's saying here.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:28 pm 
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mds wrote:
Formula1Fan. wrote:
I'm not sure why he uses Brazil as an example of Vettel's ability to pass either, almost everyone let him through!


Oh come on, stop exaggerating. Even apart from the few that let him by instead of racing him (because most of them did), it was still an immense return through the field in conditions that were far from perfect. Why always focus on the 4 cars that let him by if he made a whole string of overtakings on the others?

Personally, I feel h should have mentioned Spa too.

Ontopic: Marko is known for acting quite the idiot, but I don't see anything really wrong with what he's saying here.

I agree and i found some of the things he said very insightfull

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:16 pm 
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Funnily enough, if you ignore the age difference, there are several parallels between the early careers of Jackie Stewart and Sebastian Vettel:

Both reached F1 within four years of starting to race cars;

both won their first World Championship Grand Prix in their first full season;

and in both cases it was the Italian GP;

both finished second (to an Englishman) in the championship the year before they won their first WDC


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:22 pm 
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mds wrote:
Formula1Fan. wrote:
I'm not sure why he uses Brazil as an example of Vettel's ability to pass either, almost everyone let him through!


Oh come on, stop exaggerating. Even apart from the few that let him by instead of racing him (because most of them did), it was still an immense return through the field in conditions that were far from perfect. Why always focus on the 4 cars that let him by if he made a whole string of overtakings on the others?

Personally, I feel h should have mentioned Spa too.

Ontopic: Marko is known for acting quite the idiot, but I don't see anything really wrong with what he's saying here.

Spa was one of his best drives ever. Racing from the back at AD and Brazil was immense, but in terms of a more normal race, Spa was so impressive.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:31 pm 
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I agree, Spa was immense. It wasn't the result per sé, but the way it was done. Everybody was happily overtaking on the Kemmel straight (with DRS and KERS), Vettel had a car without top speed and I don't think he pulled off a single overtake on that straight, instead they all were genuine skillful racing overtakes.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:43 pm 
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I think overtaking is one aspect of his driving that he's definitely improved during his time in F1, in the early years some of his attempts were somewhat clumsy resulting in missing pieces of bodywork

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:54 pm 
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They were more impatient than clumsy. Clumsy is failing to execute, impatience is forcing what won't work. He's been making impatient moves since FBMW.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:06 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
They were more impatient than clumsy. Clumsy is failing to execute, impatience is forcing what won't work. He's been making impatient moves since FBMW.

Well either clumsy or impatient this is part of his game that he has improved a lot to the point where he can no longer be accused as someone who can't overtake

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:48 pm 
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Marko has to be wrong on this one:

"Sebastian's driving was virtually flawless," Marko said. "But he is a phenomenon: it is always like that. After the summer break, his performance curve shoots up. That's what happened in previous years, too. I don't know how he does it, but to keep doing it cannot be a coincidence. That brings us back to his method of preparation, the way he shuts himself off from the rest of the world, so that he can still call on reserves that other drivers might not have: Fernando Alonso, for example, who is busy with politics and funny comments. Vettel ignores it all, he doesn't read the newspapers, or the internet. And that's the point, you see, we concentrate on our job: to make the fastest car and the best team possible."

http://en.espnf1.com/redbull/motorsport/story/98380.html

Surely Vettel logs onto this forum everyday to read about 'Newey's rocket ship' all other important 'wisdom' from the 'experts'. :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 7:23 pm 
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I'm convinced that whenever you see a group of drivers huddled around a smart phone laughing they are reading forums and looking at photoshops of themselves.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 9:45 pm 
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He has a far point, but I think he's being out of line by putting Webber down in Red Bull's own magazine. That fairy cakes just isn't right IMO.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 3:25 am 
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Helmut Marko via another_finger wrote:
After the summer break, his performance curve shoots up. That's what happened in previous years, too. I don't know how he does it, but to keep doing it cannot be a coincidence. That brings us back to his method of preparation, the way he shuts himself off from the rest of the world, so that he can still call on reserves that other drivers might not have

Ah yes, it's all down to Seb's supernatural ability to close his eyes and stick his fingers in his ears, that's the X-factor right there. Nothing to do with the post-summer break car upgrades then Helmut?

Quote:
Surely Vettel logs onto this forum everyday to read about 'Newey's rocket ship' all other important 'wisdom' from the 'experts'.

He might not go online (yeah right...) but Vettel knows what people think about Newey etc. because the journalists put the questions to him often enough.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:32 am 
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Formula1Fan. wrote:
Helmut Marko via another_finger wrote:
After the summer break, his performance curve shoots up. That's what happened in previous years, too. I don't know how he does it, but to keep doing it cannot be a coincidence. That brings us back to his method of preparation, the way he shuts himself off from the rest of the world, so that he can still call on reserves that other drivers might not have

Ah yes, it's all down to Seb's supernatural ability to close his eyes and stick his fingers in his ears, that's the X-factor right there. Nothing to do with the post-summer break car upgrades then Helmut?


Yes, drivers do that. Schumacher was so remote in his first career, wouldn't let anything get to him. Same as Kimi. Same as Senna. Same as other drivers.

They do that

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