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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:15 am 
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Haribo wrote:
Webber lost the control of the car, and Hamilton had almost overtaken him. It's nonsense to say "Perfect devensive move" when Webber just hit Hamiltons car, overshooting the corner. hamilton was clearly faster, he was ahead, he was almost past, Webber oveshoot the corner & hit Hamilton.



See that Almost, very important word. That means that Lewis hadn't made the overtake and therefore no right to turn in.

Bad video but show me where Webber lost control?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE3-h_02wVM

Webber had the defensive inside line Hammo turned in. He never made the overtake so had no right to turn in. Webber had no need to concede the corner.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:04 pm 
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lamo wrote:
Alonso did not beat Schumacher when the pressure was on, the reality is he lost the title at crunch time (Japan) but Michaels Engine happened to blow up meaning that Alonso went in to the final race 10 points ahead instead of 4 points down.

Had Schumacher finished 1st in Japan with Alonso 2nd, Alonso still would have won the title by a point.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:15 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Webber lost the control of the car, and Hamilton had almost overtaken him. It's nonsense to say "Perfect devensive move" when Webber just hit Hamiltons car, overshooting the corner. hamilton was clearly faster, he was ahead, he was almost past, Webber oveshoot the corner & hit Hamilton.



See that Almost, very important word. That means that Lewis hadn't made the overtake and therefore no right to turn in.

Bad video but show me where Webber lost control?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE3-h_02wVM

Webber had the defensive inside line Hammo turned in. He never made the overtake so had no right to turn in. Webber had no need to concede the corner.


I know you said bad video but wow! My eyes!
Image

And I do agree, Hamilton turned in too much and expected Mark to give way. It's a shame the red bull is made of adamantium (as proven by Vettel in Brazil)


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:20 pm 
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Sevenfest wrote:
I know you said bad video but wow! My eyes!
Image

And I do agree, Hamilton turned in too much and expected Mark to give way. It's a shame the red bull is made of adamantium (as proven by Vettel in Brazil)



That was actually the better of the videos I found .

try this one. It's like a NES game :lol: :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGDhZhRQW3A

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:25 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
Sevenfest wrote:
I know you said bad video but wow! My eyes!
Image

And I do agree, Hamilton turned in too much and expected Mark to give way. It's a shame the red bull is made of adamantium (as proven by Vettel in Brazil)



That was actually the better of the videos I found .

try this one. It's like a NES game :lol: :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGDhZhRQW3A


That's amazing! :lol:

I wonder if the monitors in the stewards offices are this good?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:31 pm 
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I like how people expect mark (a very fair racer) to have just stepped on the brakes and let Lewis through!

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:34 pm 
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mcdo wrote:
lamo wrote:
Alonso did not beat Schumacher when the pressure was on, the reality is he lost the title at crunch time (Japan) but Michaels Engine happened to blow up meaning that Alonso went in to the final race 10 points ahead instead of 4 points down.

Had Schumacher finished 1st in Japan with Alonso 2nd, Alonso still would have won the title by a point.

Thank you. I never once realised that before and it certainly makes Japan that bit less painful.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:36 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Johnston wrote:
I explained to you somewhere else why Webber wasn't at fault. Mainly as Lewis kept him tight which requires a wider exit except Lewis didn't give him room to exit the corner. No driver can simply make his hug the wall to make a corner.

2008 not the best car???? That one is VERY debatable. Many people in the past have suggested the Macca was indeed better than the Ferrari that year.

Had Webbers car no breaks? Hamilton was ahead, on the racing line and had the corner. Webber was beaten he should have backed off.

Interstingly Alonso said himself Ferrari was the car to have the 2nd half of the 2010 season



Webber had the inside line. Lewis didn't have the corner. If he had the corner he could have turned in without touching. Webber wasn't beaten because lewis hadn't completed the overtake got past and around the corner Webber made a perfectly fine defensive move to keep position by forcing Lewis wide. A move Lewis himself has put to great use although the guys he has done it on usually have the sense to go wide and not turn in ending their race.

Having the racing line means nothing and IIRC neither was on the true racing line anyway.

Webber lost the control of the car, and Hamilton had almost overtaken him. It's nonsense to say "Perfect devensive move" when Webber just hit Hamiltons car, overshooting the corner. hamilton was clearly faster, he was ahead, he was almost past, Webber oveshoot the corner & hit Hamilton.


This photo confirms that Webber never lost control, and was in fact as far inside as possible before Hamilton chopped down and contact was made.
Image
http://youtu.be/WxynNbw9WO4


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:59 pm 
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Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Johnston wrote:
I explained to you somewhere else why Webber wasn't at fault. Mainly as Lewis kept him tight which requires a wider exit except Lewis didn't give him room to exit the corner. No driver can simply make his hug the wall to make a corner.

2008 not the best car???? That one is VERY debatable. Many people in the past have suggested the Macca was indeed better than the Ferrari that year.

Had Webbers car no breaks? Hamilton was ahead, on the racing line and had the corner. Webber was beaten he should have backed off.

Interstingly Alonso said himself Ferrari was the car to have the 2nd half of the 2010 season



Webber had the inside line. Lewis didn't have the corner. If he had the corner he could have turned in without touching. Webber wasn't beaten because lewis hadn't completed the overtake got past and around the corner Webber made a perfectly fine defensive move to keep position by forcing Lewis wide. A move Lewis himself has put to great use although the guys he has done it on usually have the sense to go wide and not turn in ending their race.

Having the racing line means nothing and IIRC neither was on the true racing line anyway.

Webber lost the control of the car, and Hamilton had almost overtaken him. It's nonsense to say "Perfect devensive move" when Webber just hit Hamiltons car, overshooting the corner. hamilton was clearly faster, he was ahead, he was almost past, Webber oveshoot the corner & hit Hamilton.


This photo confirms that Webber never lost control, and was in fact as far inside as possible before Hamilton chopped down and contact was made.
Image
http://youtu.be/WxynNbw9WO4

Game, set and match.

Lewis cut across way too early, Webber couldn't have gone any nearer the kerb without clattering it and probably skidding into Lewis. Hamilton did the same thing to Kobayashi in Spa 2011.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:01 pm 
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There's no such thing as game set match when debating an on track incident with a non-driver unfortunately.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:14 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Had Webbers car no breaks? Hamilton was ahead, on the racing line and had the corner. Webber was beaten he should have backed off.

Interstingly Alonso said himself Ferrari was the car to have the 2nd half of the 2010 season



Webber had the inside line. Lewis didn't have the corner. If he had the corner he could have turned in without touching. Webber wasn't beaten because lewis hadn't completed the overtake got past and around the corner Webber made a perfectly fine defensive move to keep position by forcing Lewis wide. A move Lewis himself has put to great use although the guys he has done it on usually have the sense to go wide and not turn in ending their race.

Having the racing line means nothing and IIRC neither was on the true racing line anyway.

Webber lost the control of the car, and Hamilton had almost overtaken him. It's nonsense to say "Perfect devensive move" when Webber just hit Hamiltons car, overshooting the corner. hamilton was clearly faster, he was ahead, he was almost past, Webber oveshoot the corner & hit Hamilton.


This photo confirms that Webber never lost control, and was in fact as far inside as possible before Hamilton chopped down and contact was made.
Image
http://youtu.be/WxynNbw9WO4

Game, set and match.

Lewis cut across way too early, Webber couldn't have gone any nearer the kerb without clattering it and probably skidding into Lewis. Hamilton did the same thing to Kobayashi in Spa 2011.

Look the line Webber took, straight into Hamiltons car, he has not turned in like he should , had there not been Hamiltons car he would have probably not made the corner.BTW, he broke Hamiltons rear suspension, thefore Hamilton was almost past, Webber was beaten. Webber was only lucky his car did not brake, too.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:26 pm 
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I rest my case :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:30 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Webber had the inside line. Lewis didn't have the corner. If he had the corner he could have turned in without touching. Webber wasn't beaten because lewis hadn't completed the overtake got past and around the corner Webber made a perfectly fine defensive move to keep position by forcing Lewis wide. A move Lewis himself has put to great use although the guys he has done it on usually have the sense to go wide and not turn in ending their race.

Having the racing line means nothing and IIRC neither was on the true racing line anyway.

Webber lost the control of the car, and Hamilton had almost overtaken him. It's nonsense to say "Perfect devensive move" when Webber just hit Hamiltons car, overshooting the corner. hamilton was clearly faster, he was ahead, he was almost past, Webber oveshoot the corner & hit Hamilton.


This photo confirms that Webber never lost control, and was in fact as far inside as possible before Hamilton chopped down and contact was made.
Image
http://youtu.be/WxynNbw9WO4

Game, set and match.

Lewis cut across way too early, Webber couldn't have gone any nearer the kerb without clattering it and probably skidding into Lewis. Hamilton did the same thing to Kobayashi in Spa 2011.

Look the line Webber took, straight into Hamiltons car, he has not turned in like he should , had there not been Hamiltons car he would have probably not made the corner.BTW, he broke Hamiltons rear suspension, thefore Hamilton was almost past, Webber was beaten. Webber was only lucky his car did not brake, too.

Haven't you noticed Webber's car is following the tyre marks/rubber of countless other people there? You can see the racing line practically. Hamilton isn't following it, Webber is.

Now I'd support Hamilton over Webber any day, but this incident was more Hamilton's fault. Haribo, you don't have to defend everything Hamilton has been involved in. It's OK for him to be in the wrong sometimes.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:31 pm 
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actually, haribo, if you look at the track line... ie where the rubber is down, Webber does indeed appear to be on line for the corner.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:32 pm 
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Webber was taking the normal line. Hamilton chopped across back onto the normal line too soon. That should be the end.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:33 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Webber was taking the normal line. Hamilton chopped across back onto the normal line too soon. That should be the end.

Note "SHOULD" be the end. It won't be.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:34 pm 
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jammin78 wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
Webber was taking the normal line. Hamilton chopped across back onto the normal line too soon. That should be the end.

Note "SHOULD" be the end. It won't be.

I know, I forgot Saint Hamilton is never in the wrong ever ever ever.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:36 pm 
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I might make it my mission to find a racing collision between any two drivers from some point in time (in Formula 1) that everyone can agree on.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:38 pm 
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Blake wrote:
actually, haribo, if you look at the track line... ie where the rubber is down, Webber does indeed appear to be on line for the corner.

Webber did not hit the appex, look wich line the other cars took, he moved too far inside before he turned in, missed the appex, and used Hamiltons car as "brake"

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:38 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
Blake wrote:
actually, haribo, if you look at the track line... ie where the rubber is down, Webber does indeed appear to be on line for the corner.

Webber did not hit the appex, look wich line the other cars took, he moved too far inside before he turned in, missed the appex, and used Hamiltons car as "brake"

Are you looking at the same picture?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:43 pm 
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He actually did slow a bit, and tighten his entry line...to give Lewis more room. He'd have no trouble making the corner. No McLaren-brake necessary.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:45 pm 
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Inappropriate Post Removed.

No need to call people idiots for not sharing your opinion Pedrosa. Warning.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:52 pm 
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He was not "beat" at any point at which he could do something about it.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:14 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
mcdo wrote:
lamo wrote:
Alonso did not beat Schumacher when the pressure was on, the reality is he lost the title at crunch time (Japan) but Michaels Engine happened to blow up meaning that Alonso went in to the final race 10 points ahead instead of 4 points down.

Had Schumacher finished 1st in Japan with Alonso 2nd, Alonso still would have won the title by a point.

Thank you. I never once realised that before and it certainly makes Japan that bit less painful.

Haha, I hope it has brought about a sense of closure.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:17 pm 
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mcdo wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
mcdo wrote:
lamo wrote:
Alonso did not beat Schumacher when the pressure was on, the reality is he lost the title at crunch time (Japan) but Michaels Engine happened to blow up meaning that Alonso went in to the final race 10 points ahead instead of 4 points down.

Had Schumacher finished 1st in Japan with Alonso 2nd, Alonso still would have won the title by a point.

Thank you. I never once realised that before and it certainly makes Japan that bit less painful.

Haha, I hope it has brought about a sense of closure.

A bit yes! Haha!

That race is the only race I have ever switched off before it finished. I went back to bed a little bit heartbroken.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:35 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
mcdo wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
mcdo wrote:
lamo wrote:
Alonso did not beat Schumacher when the pressure was on, the reality is he lost the title at crunch time (Japan) but Michaels Engine happened to blow up meaning that Alonso went in to the final race 10 points ahead instead of 4 points down.

Had Schumacher finished 1st in Japan with Alonso 2nd, Alonso still would have won the title by a point.

Thank you. I never once realised that before and it certainly makes Japan that bit less painful.

Haha, I hope it has brought about a sense of closure.

A bit yes! Haha!

That race is the only race I have ever switched off before it finished. I went back to bed a little bit heartbroken.

Yep I know that feeling - Suzuka 2012.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:49 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
Look the line Webber took, straight into Hamiltons car, he has not turned in like he should , had there not been Hamiltons car he would have probably not made the corner.BTW, he broke Hamiltons rear suspension, thefore Hamilton was almost past, Webber was beaten. Webber was only lucky his car did not brake, too.


If Hammy hadn't have turned in he wouldn't have made the corner. He was on the outside he was going wide. Bit like Seb on JB in Germany except Seb decided to go wide and avoid the accident rather than close the door.

This is car racing you cannot simply add in extra lock to make the corner. It simply does not work like that.

The fact as you admit that Hamilton was ALMOST past means he had no right to close the door he hadn't completed the overtake. He should have also realised that he needed to leave room because they are racing not driving around the supermarket carpark in Nissan Micras.

I suppose the following year was Massas fault? Same corner IIRC too.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:52 pm 
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I want to drive around a supermarket carpark with F1 drivers in Nissan Micras. I feel a Top Gear segment is in order.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:54 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
I want to drive around a supermarket carpark with F1 drivers in Nissan Micras. I feel a Top Gear segment is in order.



You wanna try in a 4 wheel steer Prelude with Rally men :lol: :lol:

That was fun. the locals were a bit weirded out though.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:57 pm 
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I drove an e36 widebody race car with no doors or windshield to a shopping center with a dutch touring car driver in an e90 Grand-Am ST car once (don't ask) and got in a lot of trouble with the police :( At least with Nissans we'd be less conspicuous.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:03 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
I drove an e36 widebody race car with no doors or windshield to a shopping center with a dutch touring car driver in an e90 Grand-Am ST car once (don't ask) and got in a lot of trouble with the police :( At least with Nissans we'd be less conspicuous.



Know that feeling, we stuck a new engine in a G3 escort (That will mean nothing to you.) But RWD wide arched Ford escort. Something like a rs1700T idea. It needed ran in because a guy was having a test drive to buy it. the last time the owner skipped the run in and the engine blew a gasket on the prospective buyer :uhoh: :uhoh:

So I thought chocolate fudge cake it, went to the workshop picked it up and drove it to work. It was not the most comfortable of rides and the police were a bit iffy the town centre :lol: :lol:

I think they thought it was a boy racer stickered up until I got out they seen the buckets and the proper cage . Gotta love the clunk of first in a dog box when sitting at the lights when some chav is revving his nuts off beside you :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:17 pm 
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jammin78 wrote:
Haribo wrote:
Blake wrote:
actually, haribo, if you look at the track line... ie where the rubber is down, Webber does indeed appear to be on line for the corner.

Webber did not hit the appex, look wich line the other cars took, he moved too far inside before he turned in, missed the appex, and used Hamiltons car as "brake"

Are you looking at the same picture?



Yes through Hamilton tinted glasses, the tint is rosey when you look at the things Lewis has done right but black as night when looking at anything else

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:28 pm 
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Hamilton tinted glasses hahahaha I wonder what those might look like. Surely they'd be oversized and diamond encrusted.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:31 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
Hamilton tinted glasses hahahaha I wonder what those might look like. Surely they'd be oversized and diamond encrusted.



With H.A.M written over them somewhere.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:44 pm 
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I searched "hammy glasses" and this was all I found.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:40 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
He was not "beat" at any point at which he could do something about it.


No so thats why he drove right into the BACK of Lewis's car. You can see with your eyes that lewis was clearly ahead that called a overtake.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:47 pm 
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the point of contact is not more relevant than how they got to that point

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:51 pm 
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..This is another one of those threads where I feel bad for being a Hamilton fan isn't it.


Can I ask Haribo and A.rellum; Spa 2011 - Hamilton and Kobayashi; Who do you think was at fault?
Because it was the same thing as Singapore 2010.

The fact is he closed the door too early in an overtake and took himself out.


I think he's a bloody great driver and one of my favourite, but Christ alive, the amount of times I've gone "Oh Hami,Hami,Hami...what are you doing?" over the past 5 years.... It's ok to admit your favourite driver makes mistakes.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:10 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
I searched "hammy glasses" and this was all I found.

Image


Someone gotta photoshop a ham helmet on that thing lol

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:12 pm 
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Sevenfest wrote:
..This is another one of those threads where I feel bad for being a Hamilton fan isn't it.


Can I ask Haribo and A.rellum; Spa 2011 - Hamilton and Kobayashi; Who do you think was at fault?
Because it was the same thing as Singapore 2010.

The fact is he closed the door too early in an overtake and took himself out.


I think he's a bloody great driver and one of my favourite, but Christ alive, the amount of times I've gone "Oh Hami,Hami,Hami...what are you doing?" over the past 5 years.... It's ok to admit your favourite driver makes mistakes.


I like this forummer a lot! Can support a driver and see his mistakes! Guys we've got another good one here!

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It ain't hating just 'cause it's not love


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