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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:35 am 
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SchumieRules wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
It won't happen, not while Alonso is there as he's the clear number one driver. Until Alonso has a foot hold over Massa in the championship Massa will be held back massively or just not allowed to open up. That's how it works with the Alonso number one driver policy.
Expect him to struggle behind Alonso for the first part of the season and later in the season to pull out results once Alonso has the foot hold on him in the championship.

Have you seen the policy documents? Awesome!


Have you ever watched F1?

This is an F1 forum? Damn I thought it was a Curling forum... sorry guys I've posted over 1000 comments in here thinking I was somewhere else. Mannnnnnn. x(


A curling forum, maybe that exists, who knows?

Be more careful next time jammin78!!!


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:47 am 
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A2jdl wrote:
ScuderiaFerrari wrote:
I wish he would, and I wish even more Ferrari would give both drivers equality. But that isn't how Ferrari runs the show. Like some one said in this post, he wont start as good as Alonso or pick up from where he left of at the end of 2012, things will get better for him once Alonso has the advantage. It's in the terms and conditions of his contract probably.

It would be good of he did show some form from the get go then Ferrari might win a championship if he did. But they will be back to clockwise tracks now so its unlikely.


Yes hopefully (fingers crossed). Massa has come out with being optimistic that they would allow him to be ahead of Alonso, without using team orders, in todays PF1 article.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:49 am 
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I just hope Felipe doesn't get too ahead of himself and set his season off to disappoint. I hope he goes in and gets the job done. I want to see Felipe at the very least get a win earlier this year, and then another in Brazil. Anything else is bonus.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:52 am 
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jammin78 wrote:
I just hope Felipe doesn't get too ahead of himself and set his season off to disappoint. I hope he goes in and gets the job done. I want to see Felipe at the very least get a win earlier this year, and then another in Brazil. Anything else is bonus.


He doesn't have much to loose, Just to prove his worth at the Scuderia. This is his year to prove to them they can keep him. I don't see them keeping him unless he isn't a significant margin away from Alonso at the end 2013.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:53 am 
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ScuderiaFerrari wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
I just hope Felipe doesn't get too ahead of himself and set his season off to disappoint. I hope he goes in and gets the job done. I want to see Felipe at the very least get a win earlier this year, and then another in Brazil. Anything else is bonus.


He doesn't have much to loose, Just to prove his worth at the Scuderia. This is his year to prove to them they can keep him. I don't see them keeping him unless he isn't a significant margin away from Alonso at the end 2013.

Yeah, if he's not close to Alonso at the end of the year, he won't be there 2014. To be honest I'm actually kinda torn, I want Massa to up his game and make us proud, but I also want Hulk to get into the Scuderia. Tough times.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:59 am 
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Kev627 wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:

A curling forum, maybe that exists, who knows?

Be more careful next time jammin78!!!


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:01 pm 
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Now Schumi's gone for good I had a long hard think about who I would like to support in 2013. And then I realised that there was this guy who almost won the title in 2008, dealt with the pressure massively and then had an accident that almost killed him less than a year later.

Since then it's taken him a long time to get back up to speed - for whatever reason - but I saw the same spark in the latter part of 2012 that I saw in 2008. This is my reason I will be supporting Ferrari's No.2 this season.

2013 will define Felipe Massa.

Go Felipe!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:12 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Massa might be the new DC, next year was always going to be his year

+1 :)

As much as it would be great to see Massa beat Alonso and see the real Alonso come out, if I am being realistic - Its not going to happen.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:13 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
You have to believe. You can't be driving a Ferrari and thinking you can't win a championship.

:thumbup: Agreed, in fact I would go as far as to say that you shouldn't be driving any racing car unless you believe that :D


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:13 pm 
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SchumieRules wrote:
Kev627 wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:

A curling forum, maybe that exists, who knows?

Be more careful next time jammin78!!!


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http://www.englishcurlingforum.com/



I KNEW IT!!!!!

I bet F1Thomas is there somewhere asking if they've ever watched curling...

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:30 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
Ferrari is bigger than Santander. Ferrari is bigger than Fernando.

I wouldn't disagree with that but like i said i wonder what Alonso's take on it would be?

If Alonso were getting a fair shot at succeeding and Massa was beating him straight up, I think Alonso would understand the team's decision to support the better performer. He's a fierce competitor, and has always seemed to have that chip on his shoulder - a sense of entitlement if you will - but I think he's grown up some at Ferrari. He knows the game now, and likely understands you get what you earn. In his first couple of seasons at Ferrari I think he felt a little overwhelmed by the responsibility that comes with leading THAT team. He's since learned he can do that, and that confidence has allowed him to relax some. If he's the competitor, and the man, I think he is then he'll just relish the opportunity to really compete with a teammate and show his worth.

I do think a lot of the sentiment surrounding his demands for supremacy is more media/public hype than actual substance coming from him.

I would agree with these parts of your post. I think the chip on his shoulder that you refer to was more to do with having absolutely no support in Spain, except for family support, when he first started racing & even after he started in F1 until he won his first WDC, & having to push himself & have that huge self belief to make it. The pressure must have been huge compared to other drivers that had outside support in place before & after they joined F1 &, yes, I guess it can be described as a chip on his shoulder but I can't criticise him for that :D


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:37 pm 
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I hope Massa is up for it.

If nohing else it will make things more interesting at the top.

Would Alonso have been WDC if Massa was up for it in 2012 and took a few points of Seb?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:42 pm 
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jammin78 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
It won't happen, not while Alonso is there as he's the clear number one driver. Until Alonso has a foot hold over Massa in the championship Massa will be held back massively or just not allowed to open up. That's how it works with the Alonso number one driver policy.
Expect him to struggle behind Alonso for the first part of the season and later in the season to pull out results once Alonso has the foot hold on him in the championship.

Have you seen the policy documents? Awesome!


Have you ever watched F1?

This is an F1 forum? Damn I thought it was a Curling forum... sorry guys I've posted over 1000 comments in here thinking I was somewhere else. Mannnnnnn. x(


Maybe you should ask F1thomas where you can visit the forum where he gets all his F1 knowledge from, such as those private contracts and policy statements that he apparently has access to.
;)

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:44 pm 
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Great to see Massa being positive again. If he has regained his best form, I expect him to have a season something like 2007, close to the title fight if Ferrari produce a good car, but ultimately I think Alonso is too good for him without team orders and all the rest of the conspiracies.

Massa beat Kimi in 2008 and had him pegged in 2009 up until Hungary. If Alonso gets a run of bad luck, makes a couple of mistakes, it could be on....very unlikely but who thought Massa was going to contend the 2008 championship? Not many after Kimi's comeback the previous season.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:49 pm 
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Blake wrote:
pokerman wrote:
It depends how you define being competitive though, i don't consider him to have been relly competitive against Schumacher and Alonso


For the most part, few other have been as well. Massa did not embarrass himself while paired with Schumi, certainly not with Kimi, and it is difficult to say against Alonso, due to the aftermath of the injury. If the Massa we saw the second half of last season is the one we see this year, Ferrari will have a very strong pairing indeed.

I'm not sure how you class by not being embarassed by your teammate when he was clearly dominated by Schumacher but then again not much was expected of him back then

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:50 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:
Kev627 wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:

A curling forum, maybe that exists, who knows?

Be more careful next time jammin78!!!


:nod:

http://www.englishcurlingforum.com/



I KNEW IT!!!!!

I bet F1Thomas is there somewhere asking if they've ever watched curling...


Hahahahaha

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:52 pm 
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dizlexik wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
It won't happen, not while Alonso is there as he's the clear number one driver. Until Alonso has a foot hold over Massa in the championship Massa will be held back massively or just not allowed to open up. That's how it works with the Alonso number one driver policy.
Expect him to struggle behind Alonso for the first part of the season and later in the season to pull out results once Alonso has the foot hold on him in the championship.

Have you seen the policy documents? Awesome!


Have you ever watched F1?

Have you got any sense?

I doubt he'd be on an F1 forum if he hasn't watched F1 before.

That said provide proof of "Alonso's number one policy" and we'll move on.

:thumbup:

I would like to add that even "mighty" Santander can't do everything. Alonso once for one season was in team where Santander was (and still is) major sponsor and Alonso still had still to fight his teammate. Current Ferrari management also showed that they won't support at all costs any driver.

The upshot of that though was that Alonso terminated his contract with the team

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:54 pm 
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Kev627 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Blake wrote:
pokerman wrote:
It depends how you define being competitive though, i don't consider him to have been relly competitive against Schumacher and Alonso


I thought that Barrichello was often closer to Schumacher than what Massa was, this injury thing keeps rearing its head, if Massa is unable to compete this season at the same level he finished last season it must be because of his injury, it seems a convenient excuse at times.

Is it an excuse Massa uses or just by other people to explain a poor race?

Massa has always maintained that he is 100% recovered and i believe his doctors too

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:08 pm 
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SchumieRules wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Blake wrote:

Interesting he finds Alonso tougher than Schumacher


Why? Alonso has made him suffer on track. He's beaten him by more than double points last year. Felipe never suffered like this with any other team mate.

Ok, with Schumacher they only shared one season.

Kimi never had such a points/performance advantage over Felipe (I think that Felipe was in his best years when driving against Kimi).

It is understandable he would feel this way

I mean by his perception of it, from the outside it wouldn't be possible for me to tell who was his toughest teammate

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:39 pm 
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hittheapex wrote:
Great to see Massa being positive again. If he has regained his best form, I expect him to have a season something like 2007, close to the title fight if Ferrari produce a good car, but ultimately I think Alonso is too good for him without team orders and all the rest of the conspiracies.

Massa beat Kimi in 2008 and had him pegged in 2009 up until Hungary. If Alonso gets a run of bad luck, makes a couple of mistakes, it could be on....very unlikely but who thought Massa was going to contend the 2008 championship? Not many after Kimi's comeback the previous season.

Didn't this happen in 2010 though which gave Massa a start on Alonso, by the middle of the season it was still close between the two of them but the order still came for Massa to move over for Alonso whilst he was leading the race in Germany

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:41 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Blake wrote:

Interesting he finds Alonso tougher than Schumacher


Why? Alonso has made him suffer on track. He's beaten him by more than double points last year. Felipe never suffered like this with any other team mate.

Ok, with Schumacher they only shared one season.

Kimi never had such a points/performance advantage over Felipe (I think that Felipe was in his best years when driving against Kimi).

It is understandable he would feel this way

I mean by his perception of it, from the outside it wouldn't be possible for me to tell who was his toughest teammate


The moment Massa had to back off in Germany (was it?) back in 2010, he was mentally destroyed by Alonso.

It can't be tougher than being less than double the points than your team mate. He lost something like 18-0 when they both finished in 2012, well if you include the races that he had to move over too that is. I can't imagine something tougher that he had to endure with the other two than that.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:51 pm 
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I dont think Alonso would be as subservient as Massa was no matter who told him what to do. I dont think he will be a number 2 for anyone - Massa is gonna have to graft like crazy all the way through the season to come out on top of this potential great battle. The only fear I have is that Ferrari will look at Mclaren who had two strong drivers who took points away from each other for the WDC and still werent anywhere close in the WCC and realise 2 number 1's isnt that effective.

At the back of 2012 Massa had some good performances, they werent outstanding they were just a hell of a lot better than his previous of that season.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:05 pm 
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SchumieRules wrote:
pokerman wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Blake wrote:

Interesting he finds Alonso tougher than Schumacher


Why? Alonso has made him suffer on track. He's beaten him by more than double points last year. Felipe never suffered like this with any other team mate.

Ok, with Schumacher they only shared one season.

Kimi never had such a points/performance advantage over Felipe (I think that Felipe was in his best years when driving against Kimi).

It is understandable he would feel this way

I mean by his perception of it, from the outside it wouldn't be possible for me to tell who was his toughest teammate


The moment Massa had to back off in Germany (was it?) back in 2010, he was mentally destroyed by Alonso.

It can't be tougher than being less than double the points than your team mate. He lost something like 18-0 when they both finished in 2012, well if you include the races that he had to move over too that is. I can't imagine something tougher that he had to endure with the other two than that.

Massa was very much a #2 driver against Schumacher, a role he was happy to take on from the get go, he was every bit as dominated by Schumacher as he is now by Alonso. I feel perceptions of Massa's performances against Schumacher are somewhat clouded by the fact he often qualified with a fair bit less fuel than Schumacher.

The main difference against Alonso is that his perception of himself was very much raised after the seasons with Kimi as his teammate and very much saw himself now as a #1 driver, so being battered back down again to the role of a #2 driver must be i agree very tough to take.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:08 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Kev627 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Blake wrote:
pokerman wrote:
It depends how you define being competitive though, i don't consider him to have been relly competitive against Schumacher and Alonso


I thought that Barrichello was often closer to Schumacher than what Massa was, this injury thing keeps rearing its head, if Massa is unable to compete this season at the same level he finished last season it must be because of his injury, it seems a convenient excuse at times.

Is it an excuse Massa uses or just by other people to explain a poor race?

Massa has always maintained that he is 100% recovered and i believe his doctors too

All credit to him for maintaining that he's 100% recovered too, it would have been far too easy for him to blame his poor performances on not being recovered or anything else, but he didn't, and he's come back strong at last. Go Felipe

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:08 pm 
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stevey wrote:
I dont think Alonso would be as subservient as Massa was no matter who told him what to do. I dont think he will be a number 2 for anyone - Massa is gonna have to graft like crazy all the way through the season to come out on top of this potential great battle. The only fear I have is that Ferrari will look at Mclaren who had two strong drivers who took points away from each other for the WDC and still werent anywhere close in the WCC and realise 2 number 1's isnt that effective.

At the back of 2012 Massa had some good performances, they werent outstanding they were just a hell of a lot better than his previous of that season.

Well the performances were good enough to beat Alonso so i think you're playing them down somewhat

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:12 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:
The moment Massa had to back off in Germany (was it?) back in 2010, he was mentally destroyed by Alonso.

It can't be tougher than being less than double the points than your team mate. He lost something like 18-0 when they both finished in 2012, well if you include the races that he had to move over too that is. I can't imagine something tougher that he had to endure with the other two than that.

Massa was very much a #2 driver against Schumacher, a role he was happy to take on from the get go, he was every bit as dominated by Schumacher as he is now by Alonso. I feel perceptions of Massa's performances against Schumacher are somewhat clouded by the fact he often qualified with a fair bit less fuel than Schumacher.

The main difference against Alonso is that his perception of himself was very much raised after the seasons with Kimi as his teammate and very much saw himself now as a #1 driver, so being battered back down again to the role of a #2 driver must be i agree very tough to take.


I just don't think so.

If nothing else he got 3 pols and 2 races wins. He never had to take penalties for Schumacher either.

Anyway

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:19 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
stevey wrote:
I dont think Alonso would be as subservient as Massa was no matter who told him what to do. I dont think he will be a number 2 for anyone - Massa is gonna have to graft like crazy all the way through the season to come out on top of this potential great battle. The only fear I have is that Ferrari will look at Mclaren who had two strong drivers who took points away from each other for the WDC and still werent anywhere close in the WCC and realise 2 number 1's isnt that effective.

At the back of 2012 Massa had some good performances, they werent outstanding they were just a hell of a lot better than his previous of that season.

Well the performances were good enough to beat Alonso so i think you're playing them down somewhat

i don't think he did, but even so being good 1 or 2 races a year is just not good enough.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:22 pm 
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SchumieRules wrote:
pokerman wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:
The moment Massa had to back off in Germany (was it?) back in 2010, he was mentally destroyed by Alonso.

It can't be tougher than being less than double the points than your team mate. He lost something like 18-0 when they both finished in 2012, well if you include the races that he had to move over too that is. I can't imagine something tougher that he had to endure with the other two than that.

Massa was very much a #2 driver against Schumacher, a role he was happy to take on from the get go, he was every bit as dominated by Schumacher as he is now by Alonso. I feel perceptions of Massa's performances against Schumacher are somewhat clouded by the fact he often qualified with a fair bit less fuel than Schumacher.

The main difference against Alonso is that his perception of himself was very much raised after the seasons with Kimi as his teammate and very much saw himself now as a #1 driver, so being battered back down again to the role of a #2 driver must be i agree very tough to take.


I just don't think so.

If nothing else he got 3 pols and 2 races wins. He never had to take penalties for Schumacher either.

Anyway

These wouldn't have been fuel corrected poles though and the 2 wins were when Schumacher had a problem

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:24 pm 
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A2jdl wrote:
pokerman wrote:
stevey wrote:
I dont think Alonso would be as subservient as Massa was no matter who told him what to do. I dont think he will be a number 2 for anyone - Massa is gonna have to graft like crazy all the way through the season to come out on top of this potential great battle. The only fear I have is that Ferrari will look at Mclaren who had two strong drivers who took points away from each other for the WDC and still werent anywhere close in the WCC and realise 2 number 1's isnt that effective.

At the back of 2012 Massa had some good performances, they werent outstanding they were just a hell of a lot better than his previous of that season.

Well the performances were good enough to beat Alonso so i think you're playing them down somewhat

i don't think he did, but even so being good 1 or 2 races a year is just not good enough.

I believe it was 3 out of the last 5 races were Massa was quicker than Alonso, so it starts to become a pattern more than 1 or 2 flukey races

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:34 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
A2jdl wrote:
pokerman wrote:
stevey wrote:
I dont think Alonso would be as subservient as Massa was no matter who told him what to do. I dont think he will be a number 2 for anyone - Massa is gonna have to graft like crazy all the way through the season to come out on top of this potential great battle. The only fear I have is that Ferrari will look at Mclaren who had two strong drivers who took points away from each other for the WDC and still werent anywhere close in the WCC and realise 2 number 1's isnt that effective.

At the back of 2012 Massa had some good performances, they werent outstanding they were just a hell of a lot better than his previous of that season.

Well the performances were good enough to beat Alonso so i think you're playing them down somewhat

i don't think he did, but even so being good 1 or 2 races a year is just not good enough.

I believe it was 3 out of the last 5 races were Massa was quicker than Alonso, so it starts to become a pattern more than 1 or 2 flukey races

Well not long to get then to see if he can carry on his form, and earn the team some decent points.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:08 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
jammin78 wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
It won't happen, not while Alonso is there as he's the clear number one driver. Until Alonso has a foot hold over Massa in the championship Massa will be held back massively or just not allowed to open up. That's how it works with the Alonso number one driver policy.
Expect him to struggle behind Alonso for the first part of the season and later in the season to pull out results once Alonso has the foot hold on him in the championship.

Have you seen the policy documents? Awesome!


Have you ever watched F1?

Have you got any sense?

I doubt he'd be on an F1 forum if he hasn't watched F1 before.

That said provide proof of "Alonso's number one policy" and we'll move on.

All do respect, I think by now it's a forgone conclusion that Alonso does indeed command #1 status at Ferrari. The whole "Fernando is Faster than You" incident was all we needed for confirmation of that distinction and we certainly got it. Having said that, "IF" Felipe Baby shoots right out of the gate and bests Fernando in at least 3 of the first 5 races, I think Ferrari may begin to realize they should make every effort to support Felipe. that being said, Fernando will not take something of that nature lying down so a real fight will begin and we could see another Senna/Prost like inter team dynamic. Massa may have played lap dog the last couple of seasons but he was not in the hunt for the championship. While he's visibly upset at times, he's kept pretty quiet and gone with the flow regardless of how he felt. If he finds himself in a position where he is leading Fernando and the team decides to step in, I don't think Felipe will lie down and would call BS on the team. He's a sweet person but he is also feisty and fiery when he feels the need for it. Ferrari has for the last 18 years employed a policy of #1 & #1 drivers. Schumacher for instance was always the CLEAR #1 on the team and then when Kimi was brought on by di Montezemolo it was as the lead driver. Then when they forced Kimi out for Alonso, it was again to have who they felt was the best driver and again as the lead driver on the team. Some will disagree and call BS on this but all you have to do is imagine both drivers going to Ferrari and saying they can't work together and one of them has to go!…

I think everyone on the planet knows Fernando wont be the one they send packing.

I think 'Nuff said on this.



As for Felipe, I've read that he sought help from a sports psychologist last season and that it really helped him gain a better perspective on things and his career and that was the difference towards the end of the year. I hope for him that he can maintain that form for all of 2013 and I will certainly be cheering for him. Go Felipe Baby!!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:42 pm 
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the incubus points it out as well as possible.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:23 pm 
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F1Thomas wrote:
the incubus points it out as well as possible.


Yes, he does... much better than you running around here claiming that is written policy as though you have seen the contracts and policies.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:31 pm 
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F1Thomas wrote:
the incubus points it out as well as possible.

He manages it without sounding like a patronising know it all though.

We all may know that Alonso is likely to get the better strategies and better car parts but if you are going to go around saying it IS policy then you'll have to provide proof for that. If not then don't stat it as fact.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:30 pm 
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Awe guys. :blush:

Are you starting to take a liking to me? LOL :P



What a day, what aday, whataday!!!! Is it 6 yet??!?!?

More importantly is it time for Q1 yet??!?!?!? Normally this time of year I'm ripping it up on the track every weekend but my teammate packed up and moved away without notice and took the Trailer and all our/my tools with him, so now I have to find a damn Trailer and do it all up again like the one we had. This has me stressing in the back of my mind to the point it's almost depressing. Going to rebuild my Carb and dial my engine in tomorrow and take it around the block a few times. LOL

Yes… Crackhead, I know! :nod:

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:37 pm 
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I'm just going soft in my old age. I'll be 22 next week. :cry:

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:44 pm 
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the incubus wrote:
All do respect, I think by now it's a forgone conclusion that Alonso does indeed command #1 status at Ferrari. The whole "Fernando is Faster than You" incident was all we needed for confirmation of that distinction and we certainly got it. Having said that, "IF" Felipe Baby shoots right out of the gate and bests Fernando in at least 3 of the first 5 races, I think Ferrari may begin to realize they should make every effort to support Felipe. that being said, Fernando will not take something of that nature lying down so a real fight will begin and we could see another Senna/Prost like inter team dynamic. Massa may have played lap dog the last couple of seasons but he was not in the hunt for the championship. While he's visibly upset at times, he's kept pretty quiet and gone with the flow regardless of how he felt. If he finds himself in a position where he is leading Fernando and the team decides to step in, I don't think Felipe will lie down and would call BS on the team. He's a sweet person but he is also feisty and fiery when he feels the need for it. Ferrari has for the last 18 years employed a policy of #1 & #1 drivers. Schumacher for instance was always the CLEAR #1 on the team and then when Kimi was brought on by di Montezemolo it was as the lead driver. Then when they forced Kimi out for Alonso, it was again to have who they felt was the best driver and again as the lead driver on the team. Some will disagree and call BS on this but all you have to do is imagine both drivers going to Ferrari and saying they can't work together and one of them has to go!…

I think everyone on the planet knows Fernando wont be the one they send packing.

I think 'Nuff said on this.



As for Felipe, I've read that he sought help from a sports psychologist last season and that it really helped him gain a better perspective on things and his career and that was the difference towards the end of the year. I hope for him that he can maintain that form for all of 2013 and I will certainly be cheering for him. Go Felipe Baby!!!


There is, of course, a "status" line at Ferrari, and why shouldn't there be. Schumi was #1 because he was better.... it is that simple. Rubens was not his equal, nor was anyone else in the game at the time.

Kimi came in without a WDC to his name, just as his teammate Massa. Kimi as fast as he is made people think he would be #1, but still he had to prove himself... this time against a teammate who was more familiar with the team and how it works. As a result, we had tight competition between the two drivers. Kimi won in 2007 with the support of Massa and in 2008, Massa came within a hair of winning the WDC for himself. So in those years, I think you saw Ferrari's policy. If a driver, either driver establish themselves as the team's best chance at post season glory, then that driver becomes the lead driver, and the other driver is expected to fill the support role.

Then we move on to the Alonso years... he comes in as a 2x WDC, Massa a solid team driver. Unfortunately for Massa, things take a bad turn with his accident, and he struggles to get back to the consistently fast form that he had before. I have seen several in here take pop shots at Massa basically saying that the accident was no excuse, but to be honest with those of you, I think that is bullshit. The man not only was fighting for his health, but he was also losing time in his car all the while Alonso was getting more and more accustomed to the cars and the team.

When Massa came back, he showed some flashes of the 2008 Massa, but never really developed the consistency he had before. To his credit, he did not use it as an excuse, but can anyone really say that the post accident Massa was the same driver as the 2008 Massa? Prior to the accident we did not see people screaming for him to be fired, yet in 2011 and 2012 we sure did. Why is that? It is because he was not the same driver. I don't know if it was/is a lingering effect of the accident physically, a mental block or just a lack of confidence brought on by his struggles AND being told Alonso is faster than you. What I do know is that in the second half of 2012, we saw what Massa used to be, and that made me pretty damn happy. I sincerely hope that it is the Massa we see to start 2013, and if it is, he can compete for the WDC... Alonso or not.

Ferrari are not idiots, they recognize that the WCC can only be won with both cars scoring big points... so there won't be any sabotaging of Massa's car for the benefit of Alonso, no matter what some may want to think.
;)

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:46 pm 
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the incubus wrote:
Awe guys. :blush:

Are you starting to take a liking to me? LOL :P


Lets not get carried away here, incubus.... Next thing we know you will be saying it is written policy that we "like you".
:nod: :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:47 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
I'm just going soft in my old age. I'll be 22 next week. :cry:



FFS your still only a baby :P

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:10 pm 
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Blake wrote:
the incubus wrote:
All do respect, I think by now it's a forgone conclusion that Alonso does indeed command #1 status at Ferrari. The whole "Fernando is Faster than You" incident was all we needed for confirmation of that distinction and we certainly got it. Having said that, "IF" Felipe Baby shoots right out of the gate and bests Fernando in at least 3 of the first 5 races, I think Ferrari may begin to realize they should make every effort to support Felipe. that being said, Fernando will not take something of that nature lying down so a real fight will begin and we could see another Senna/Prost like inter team dynamic. Massa may have played lap dog the last couple of seasons but he was not in the hunt for the championship. While he's visibly upset at times, he's kept pretty quiet and gone with the flow regardless of how he felt. If he finds himself in a position where he is leading Fernando and the team decides to step in, I don't think Felipe will lie down and would call BS on the team. He's a sweet person but he is also feisty and fiery when he feels the need for it. Ferrari has for the last 18 years employed a policy of #1 & #1 drivers. Schumacher for instance was always the CLEAR #1 on the team and then when Kimi was brought on by di Montezemolo it was as the lead driver. Then when they forced Kimi out for Alonso, it was again to have who they felt was the best driver and again as the lead driver on the team. Some will disagree and call BS on this but all you have to do is imagine both drivers going to Ferrari and saying they can't work together and one of them has to go!…

I think everyone on the planet knows Fernando wont be the one they send packing.

I think 'Nuff said on this.



As for Felipe, I've read that he sought help from a sports psychologist last season and that it really helped him gain a better perspective on things and his career and that was the difference towards the end of the year. I hope for him that he can maintain that form for all of 2013 and I will certainly be cheering for him. Go Felipe Baby!!!


There is, of course, a "status" line at Ferrari, and why shouldn't there be. Schumi was #1 because he was better.... it is that simple. Rubens was not his equal, nor was anyone else in the game at the time.

Kimi came in without a WDC to his name, just as his teammate Massa. Kimi as fast as he is made people think he would be #1, but still he had to prove himself... this time against a teammate who was more familiar with the team and how it works. As a result, we had tight competition between the two drivers. Kimi won in 2007 with the support of Massa and in 2008, Massa came within a hair of winning the WDC for himself. So in those years, I think you saw Ferrari's policy. If a driver, either driver establish themselves as the team's best chance at post season glory, then that driver becomes the lead driver, and the other driver is expected to fill the support role.

Then we move on to the Alonso years... he comes in as a 2x WDC, Massa a solid team driver. Unfortunately for Massa, things take a bad turn with his accident, and he struggles to get back to the consistently fast form that he had before. I have seen several in here take pop shots at Massa basically saying that the accident was no excuse, but to be honest with those of you, I think that is bullshit. The man not only was fighting for his health, but he was also losing time in his car all the while Alonso was getting more and more accustomed to the cars and the team.

When Massa came back, he showed some flashes of the 2008 Massa, but never really developed the consistency he had before. To his credit, he did not use it as an excuse, but can anyone really say that the post accident Massa was the same driver as the 2008 Massa? Prior to the accident we did not see people screaming for him to be fired, yet in 2011 and 2012 we sure did. Why is that? It is because he was not the same driver. I don't know if it was/is a lingering effect of the accident physically, a mental block or just a lack of confidence brought on by his struggles AND being told Alonso is faster than you. What I do know is that in the second half of 2012, we saw what Massa used to be, and that made me pretty damn happy. I sincerely hope that it is the Massa we see to start 2013, and if it is, he can compete for the WDC... Alonso or not.

Ferrari are not idiots, they recognize that the WCC can only be won with both cars scoring big points... so there won't be any sabotaging of Massa's car for the benefit of Alonso, no matter what some may want to think.
;)

With the fact that Massa was able to beat Alonso towards the end of the season i was hoping that issues regarding his injury could be finally put to bed but it seems that if Alonso continues to dominate him it will always be there

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