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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:24 pm 
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So we all have read the comments made by Fred about Lewis being the best and strongest driver. He also believes
Lewis can win Multiple races with Mercedes this year.

I for one will agree with him.

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Last edited by a.rellum on Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:48 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:28 pm 
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Yes because he's going to call the rookie that beat him a little bit fairy cakes :uhoh: :uhoh:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:28 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:41 pm 
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He's fully correct and he knows full well, far better than any of, so if Alonso says it a Multiple F1 champion who has also been Hamilton's team mate, then it's surely true.

Of course there's going to be allot of bitter forumer's on here, but why not just show respect to Alonso and Hamilton for what they are, two of the best three drivers on the grid who both have great respect for each other.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:51 pm 
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The drivers all know who is really good, and respect each other; but the PR is sometimes misleading and stirred up by the media who earn money and sales from contraversy.

Lauda once said that it did not matter who he was fighting for the lead with, any one of about five or six drivers, all were difficult to beat. He mentioned Reutemann, Peterson,Andretti, Scheckter,Hunt always, and Regazzoni sometimes. Obviously all were in competitive cars.

Today I reckon Hamilton and Alonso would also name a few drivers who would be tough to beat when racing at the front. Not only 'veterans' Vettel, Webber, Button, Raikkonen, Massa (late 2012), but new boys Maldonado and Perez too.

Let's hope the 2013 Mercedes is fast enough for Lewis and Nico to go for it. And that McLaren and Ferrari are still good.

Alonso and Hamilton know each other's skills well, so it is good to hear mutual praise.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:59 pm 
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Context.
Autosport wrote:
"I do not know who will be my main opponent for this season, he who has the best team, with the best year in terms of preparation, luck, testing, all of these factors, will help a driver or team to come on top of others," he said at Ferrari's Wrooom media event at Madonna di Campiglio on Thursday.

"But as for strongest opponent, who is strongest driver? My answer is Hamilton. It was true last year, it was true this year.

"The strongest driver? It is a personal opinion, not political, not to make people think something. Who is the strongest opponent, the strongest driver on grid? Who is the one you have to keep an eye on? It is Hamilton - and it will still be Hamilton next year."

When asked why he did not think Vettel was the strongest driver after winning a third consecutive driver's championship, Alonso said: "I am not saying he is not the strongest driver.

"In 2011, there was a fantastic performance from him. It is true the car was much in front of everybody, they [Red Bull] were first and second consistently, and when the car is good you tend to relax in some races.

"But I remember difficult races in 2011 with wet/dry conditions, and he did not do any single mistake. So for sure in these three years there were moments when he was better than anybody else and he deserved these three championships.".


Its too bad the strongest driver doesn't win championships, the strongest competitor does, as proven by the last..I dunno...5 years at least. ;)

Nando sounds a little confused though. You can't say one driver IS the strongest driver, and then a minute later state that you are not saying a different driver isn't the strongest driver. And driving off the road in Canada in front of JB probably qualifies as a mistake in a wet/dry race in 2011. Proof that even drivers in the sport go by their impressions, and not necessarily facts eh?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:08 pm 
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F1Thomas wrote:
He's fully correct and he knows full well, far better than any of, so if Alonso says it a Multiple F1 champion who has also been Hamilton's team mate, then it's surely true.

Of course there's going to be allot of bitter forumer's on here, but why not just show respect to Alonso and Hamilton for what they are, two of the best three drivers on the grid who both have great respect for each other.



How would Alonso know how good Vettel actually is though? He's been team mates with Hammy so he knows exactly what's there and he's not going to say the guy that beat him was fairy cakes. That would be daft He hasn't been team mates with Seb so unless Marks been sneaking out the data how can he know how good or not Vettel actually is?

Likewise about winning races in the Merc. Who knows what they bring next year. Unless he has someone giving him Data from Brackley for all he knows the Merc could take HRTs place.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:10 pm 
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Did Alonso really say this? 8O It's not like he's said anything like this ever before...


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:11 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
He's fully correct and he knows full well, far better than any of, so if Alonso says it a Multiple F1 champion who has also been Hamilton's team mate, then it's surely true.

Of course there's going to be allot of bitter forumer's on here, but why not just show respect to Alonso and Hamilton for what they are, two of the best three drivers on the grid who both have great respect for each other.



How would Alonso know how good Vettel actually is though? He's been team mates with Hammy so he knows exactly what's there and he's not going to say the guy that beat him was fairy cakes. That would be daft He hasn't been team mates with Seb so unless Marks been sneaking out the data how can he know how good or not Vettel actually is?

Likewise about winning races in the Merc. Who knows what they bring next year. Unless he has someone giving him Data from Brackley for all he knows the Merc could take HRTs place.

Alonso was like...

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:14 pm 
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Bitterness, is the only word to some replies.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:16 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:

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"Pedro Mate, I told you to go to Red Bull and send the Data to Ferrari"

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:27 pm 
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F1Thomas wrote:
Bitterness, is the only word to some replies.


No, it's realism.
It's pretty logical that you're going to name the only driver in recent years to have beaten you in the same machinery as being the best.

It's pretty naive to think otherwise.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:31 pm 
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I'm not bitter. I don't care who the best driver is, because Formula 1 isn't about being the best driver. You have to be the best competitor, and skill on track is only but a part of that. Why should anyone be bitter about Alonso expressing his opinion? We all do it all day long.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:34 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
ashley313 wrote:

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"Pedro Mate, I told you to go to Red Bull and send the Data to Ferrari"

"I tried to Fred, really, but they said they already have an old fogey and one is enough. We'll have to wait until Mark retires"

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:43 pm 
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F1Thomas wrote:
He's fully correct and he knows full well, far better than any of, so if Alonso says it a Multiple F1 champion who has also been Hamilton's team mate, then it's surely true.

Of course there's going to be allot of bitter forumer's on here, but why not just show respect to Alonso and Hamilton for what they are, two of the best three drivers on the grid who both have great respect for each other.

Alonso stated his opinion & he knows more about the other drivers skills than anyone here. There is also no reason to look for political motives or something like this
like Sigmund Freud said " Sometimes a cigar is only cigar."

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:46 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
There is also no reason to look for political motives or something like this


You really mean this? I mean, really?

Being beaten by a rookie in the same machinery is no motive at all to call him the best? No?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:52 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
I'm not bitter. I don't care who the best driver is, because Formula 1 isn't about being the best driver.


Yes you are :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:53 pm 
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Yes, Alonso clearly knows better than everyone. That's why he said Sebastian made no mistakes in 2011 in changing conditions :lol: We all imagined Canada.

Its fine if you agree with his opinion, but you can't claim he is more "in the know" than anybody else when he says things that are clearly wrong (in a factual way, not an opinion way), in the very same interview.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:55 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
Context.
Autosport wrote:
Its too bad the strongest driver doesn't win championships, the strongest competitor does, as proven by the last..I dunno...5 years at least. ;)

Nando sounds a little confused though. You can't say one driver IS the strongest driver, and then a minute later state that you are not saying a different driver isn't the strongest driver. And driving off the road in Canada in front of JB probably qualifies as a mistake in a wet/dry race in 2011. Proof that even drivers in the sport go by their impressions, and not necessarily facts eh?


Sebastian Vettel is a good driver profiting from a brilliant car, rather than a brilliant driver in his own right.
When the Red Bull isn't performing great Vettel is just another very good driver and rarely outperforms the car he is in.


Last edited by a.rellum on Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:57 pm 
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mds wrote:
Haribo wrote:
There is also no reason to look for political motives or something like this


You really mean this? I mean, really?

Being beaten by a rookie in the same machinery is no motive at all to call him the best? No?

What about mutual respekt for each other? They raced in the same team, they know the others strenghts

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:58 pm 
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a.rellum wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
I'm not bitter. I don't care who the best driver is, because Formula 1 isn't about being the best driver.


Yes you are :lol:

Why? How does anything Fernando Alonso says about other people affect my life? I don't even feel bitter about things that DO influence my life - there's stuff you can change yourself, and stuff you can't. No need to feel bitter about the former, just change it. No need to feel bitter about the latter, nothing you can do about it.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:59 pm 
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a.rellum wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
Context.
Autosport wrote:
Its too bad the strongest driver doesn't win championships, the strongest competitor does, as proven by the last..I dunno...5 years at least. ;)

Nando sounds a little confused though. You can't say one driver IS the strongest driver, and then a minute later state that you are not saying a different driver isn't the strongest driver. And driving off the road in Canada in front of JB probably qualifies as a mistake in a wet/dry race in 2011. Proof that even drivers in the sport go by their impressions, and not necessarily facts eh?


Sebastian Vettel is a good driver profiting from a brilliant car, rather than a brilliant driver in his own right.
When the Red Bull isn't performing great Vettel is just another very good driver and rarely outperforms the car he is in.



You mean like Hammy in '09 Alonso in '08 '09 '11?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:00 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
mds wrote:
Haribo wrote:
There is also no reason to look for political motives or something like this


You really mean this? I mean, really?

Being beaten by a rookie in the same machinery is no motive at all to call him the best? No?

What about mutual respekt for each other? They raced in the same team, they know the others strenghts


Well, that could be. It even could "also" be, next to what I said.
But I think you would have to be very naive to dismiss what I said as impossible (and you did so in your first post).


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:05 pm 
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There is no such thing as outperforming a car, only a teammate.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:50 pm 
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Lately they seem to praise one another a lot. They seem to have put the past behind them (well, for a while now). Maybe the forum should too.


As for Alonso's motives, I think it is a win-win-win situation. He obviously trully believes this, as many people do, as I regard Hammy highly too. He also makes it easier on himself praising the rookie who beat him. It may also serve as mind games for Vetter. In the end of the day, he was asked and he answered. Simple as that

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:05 pm 
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F1Thomas wrote:
He's fully correct and he knows full well, far better than any of, so if Alonso says it a Multiple F1 champion who has also been Hamilton's team mate, then it's surely true.

Of course there's going to be allot of bitter forumer's on here, but why not just show respect to Alonso and Hamilton for what they are, two of the best three drivers on the grid who both have great respect for each other.

Dude you don't have to have a pop at the entire forum every time you post. If a lot of us annoy you so much don't come here FGS.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:13 pm 
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mds wrote:
F1Thomas wrote:
Bitterness, is the only word to some replies.


No, it's realism.
It's pretty logical that you're going to name the only driver in recent years to have beaten you in the same machinery as being the best.

It's pretty naive to think otherwise.


That logic certainly does not hold for Lewis after being beaten in points by Jenson in 2011, he stated numerous times in 2012 Alonso was the best driver (although I am not sure if he was including himself in that, the same as Alonso probably is not including himself).

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:28 pm 
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Well, I would really like to see THAT quotes in this post in any source. If you find it thanks.
Im wrong getting the idea that he said that Hamilton is the strongest driver as opponent, no including himself? I got that idea when I read it in Spanish. But, you know, translations...

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:39 pm 
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But why does this comment from Alonso " the most complete driver" ( whatever that means )
Get so many people up in arms ? He's said it often enough for a good two years running and he clearly believes that Lewis is his biggest threat on track .
Alonso is considered by many as the cream of the current crop . Like him or not this is widely accepted , it is said that not only is he " complete " in his race craft but uses his " intelligence " on track and within the team hence the no 1 status .

What do the journalists and some fans want him to say about Vettel , he clearly does not think that Vettel is a better driver than Lewis or himself he thinks Vettel is good enough but ultimately the dominance is the Red Bull .

Now for all who keep chanting the mantra of ... he's only saying it because Lewis beat him as a rookie .
I am sure that no driver on the grid would feel any embarrassment at having been beaten at some point by Lewis such is his undoubted speed and skill .

I'm sure by the same token that as a rookie, Lewis was elated at being able to match the 2xWDC Alonso and has since proven, on numerous occasions, that 2007 was no fluke .

Alonso has nothing to be ashamed of because he is a damn good driver and he and the world of F1 knows it . It's not politics its not embarrassment it's his belief based on his experience and his feelings when he hears "Lewis is on the march" and he's two seconds behind you .


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:39 pm 
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SchumieRules wrote:
Lately they seem to praise one another a lot. They seem to have put the past behind them (well, for a while now). Maybe the forum should too.


As for Alonso's motives, I think it is a win-win-win situation. He obviously trully believes this, as many people do, as I regard Hammy highly too. He also makes it easier on himself praising the rookie who beat him. It may also serve as mind games for Vetter. In the end of the day, he was asked and he answered. Simple as that

This,i don't get why it seems to bother people alot that Alonso has this opinion...maybe he really does feel that Hamilton is his strongest rival,who exactly is anyone to tell him otherwise lol :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:43 pm 
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SchumieRules wrote:
Lately they seem to praise one another a lot. They seem to have put the past behind them (well, for a while now). Maybe the forum should too.


As for Alonso's motives, I think it is a win-win-win situation. He obviously trully believes this, as many people do, as I regard Hammy highly too. He also makes it easier on himself praising the rookie who beat him. It may also serve as mind games for Vetter. In the end of the day, he was asked and he answered. Simple as that

it's Alonsos opinion, like some say Senna was the best & others say Prost was the best
In the end ist subjective

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:05 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
There is no such thing as outperforming a car, only a teammate.


If you had a car that was the 5th quickest you could still fight for podiums however, which is more than just outperforming your team mate Maybe not outperforming the car but putting it where it shouldn't be in relation to its competitors. As were talking about Hamilton Bahrain 09 instantly springs to mind. Or Schumacher throughout the 1997 season.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:09 pm 
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Haribo wrote:
SchumieRules wrote:
Lately they seem to praise one another a lot. They seem to have put the past behind them (well, for a while now). Maybe the forum should too.


As for Alonso's motives, I think it is a win-win-win situation. He obviously trully believes this, as many people do, as I regard Hammy highly too. He also makes it easier on himself praising the rookie who beat him. It may also serve as mind games for Vetter. In the end of the day, he was asked and he answered. Simple as that

it's Alonsos opinion, like some say Senna was the best & others say Prost was the best
In the end ist subjective

It does make you larf ! How he get asked a question answers it and some people think he is playing mind games. They need to get a grip.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:30 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
ashley313 wrote:
There is no such thing as outperforming a car, only a teammate.


If you had a car that was the 5th quickest you could still fight for podiums however, which is more than just outperforming your team mate Maybe not outperforming the car but putting it where it shouldn't be in relation to its competitors. As were talking about Hamilton Bahrain 09 instantly springs to mind. Or Schumacher throughout the 1997 season.

That's not outperforming your car, its out driving and/or out strategizing your opponents, or capitalizing on their mistakes or misfortune. Has nothing to do with getting more from a car than the car has to offer.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:35 pm 
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Alonso: "Hamilton the best driver on the grid...

... to fight for a second place with me." ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:50 pm 
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ashley313 wrote:
That's not outperforming your car, its out driving and/or out strategizing your opponents, or capitalizing on their mistakes or misfortune. Has nothing to do with getting more from a car than the car has to offer.


:thumbup: :thumbup:
Exactly. I don't even know what people mean by "outperforming a car." A driver--no matter how good--can't make a machine do anything it wasn't built to do.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:52 pm 
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About his opinion on drivers here's something on topic, form just few days ago.

https://twitter.com/alo_oficial/status/290834623779450880


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:55 pm 
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K__rr wrote:
About his opinion on drivers here's something on topic, form just few days ago.

https://twitter.com/alo_oficial/status/290834623779450880

Kubica isn't on the grid though and it's unlikely he ever will be again in a racing capacity.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:20 am 
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If you accept Alonso's statement, fine enough. But you also have to accept part of the interview that mentions Vettel.

Quote:
Although he appeared to overlook Vettel with his initial response, Alonso went on to explain that the Red Bull driver deserves all of the success he has enjoyed in recent years and believes the German will remain extremely difficult to beat.

"I am not saying he is not the strongest driver," he said, when asked why Vettel was not ranked as his biggest rival ahead of the upcoming season. "In 2011, there were fantastic performances from him. It is true the car was far in front of everybody, they (Red Bull) were first and second consistently, and when the car is good you tend to relax in some races.

"But I remember difficult races in 2011 with wet to dry conditions, and he did not make a single mistake. So for sure in these past three years there were moments when he was better than anybody else and he deserved these three championships."

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/289412/alonso-hamilton-is-the-strongest-driver/


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:41 am 
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ashley313 wrote:
There is no such thing as outperforming a car, only a teammate.


Right, ok, anyone who thinks that there is any human being that can make any car go faster than it is possible to is a moron.

However, I don't believe that is what most are suggesting when referring to a driver's outperforming of a car. Quite often we'll hear respected pundits use the "outperforming" phrase, often coupled with something like "he was putting that car in places it doesn't belong". Brundle often speaks this way.

Far from suggesting that the laws of physics were being defied, I think this is simply suggesting that whoever is being referred to is driving that car faster or better than the vast majority of other drivers are able to.


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