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 Post subject: Force India in Trouble?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 10:46 am 
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http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/force ... is-430830/

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an.18 (GMM) Force India "is in crisis" and it is possible the Silverstone based team "could collapse".

That is the claim of the Italiaracing magazine, who correctly reported some years ago that Pirelli would become the sport's new tyre supplier.
Now, the Italian publication is reporting from sources that Vijay Mallya - Force India's embattled owner who has lost his billionaire status - is experiencing "severe economic difficulties with his companies".

Mallya's troubles with Kingfisher, his grounded Indian airline, are well known, but the 57-year-old also controls United Breweries, and F1 team Force India.

Italiaracing claims that, in recent days, F1 chief executive Bernie Ecclestone has "activated a plan to save the (Force India) team."

The sources mentioned the possibility of a return to F1 for Colin Kolles, the team boss who in the wake of the Silverstone based team Jordan's demise some years ago led the subsequent incarnations Spyker and Midland, and finally Force India.

As head of HRT, Kolles left F1 at the end of 2011, a year before the Spanish team's collapse under new management.

Italiaracing also mentioned the former Renault chief and well-known Ecclestone ally Flavio Briatore, who has been out of F1 since the 'crashgate' scandal.


No idea how reliable this is, but interesting none the less.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:09 am 
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If they are then I can see two pay drivers there next year if they are indeed saved.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:21 am 
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How much money does Diresta bring with him, as currently he's the only driver who has a contract and I wonder how much the buy out clause is to terminate that contract.

Is Kobayashi still collecting for a race seat?

Out of interest how much money would a driver need to bring with them to get a seat at FI?


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:22 am 
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If Bernie's plan could be activated, it seems like the team could survive and maybe come out ahead if it can be dis-entangled from Mallya.

Given the solid 2012 with advancements that seemed to have been made and the team's board OK'ing the 50-mil pound investment program, it seems Force India F1 team should be a healthy structure for someone to swoop in and take over unlike the HRT mess.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:24 am 
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Didn't Bernie want to lose another team though, bringing it down to a "more manageable" 10 teams? He might not want to help them.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:30 am 
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stevey wrote:
How much money does Diresta bring with him, as currently he's the only driver who has a contract and I wonder how much the buy out clause is to terminate that contract.




I don't think anything now. Last I read he was getting paid Half a Mill a year.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:43 pm 
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It would be a shame to see them go, but didnt i read on here at the end of last year they got something like $50m injection of cash from somewhere ??
if they cant continue thou as someone has said it would be a good team for someone to buy if they are looking to get into F1..... come on Mr Richards..


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:46 pm 
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I think the article has now been deleted.

Edit: I mean the original source at Italia Racing.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:12 pm 
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I'd been wondering why they still haven't announced a second driver.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:48 pm 
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fieldstvl wrote:
I think the article has now been deleted.

Edit: I mean the original source at Italia Racing.

I read article at Yallaf1 website and it too has disappeared :S...
This one is still around:
http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns24709.html


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:52 pm 
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A2jdl wrote:
It would be a shame to see them go, but didnt i read on here at the end of last year they got something like $50m injection of cash from somewhere ??
if they cant continue thou as someone has said it would be a good team for someone to buy if they are looking to get into F1..... come on Mr Richards..


Yeah they made quite a big deal about that, I don't think they will collapse, people love to speculate on Vijay and FI.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:54 pm 
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I've read that Maldonando brings a personal sponsorship of 20milion to Williams, is this true? If so then Force India might do a rethink on both their drivers and simply pay off Diresta's contract of 0.5 mil


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:28 pm 
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stevey wrote:
How much money does Diresta bring with him, as currently he's the only driver who has a contract and I wonder how much the buy out clause is to terminate that contract.

Is Kobayashi still collecting for a race seat?

Out of interest how much money would a driver need to bring with them to get a seat at FI?

I would imagine that di Resta brings no money with him

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:33 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
stevey wrote:
How much money does Diresta bring with him, as currently he's the only driver who has a contract and I wonder how much the buy out clause is to terminate that contract.

Is Kobayashi still collecting for a race seat?

Out of interest how much money would a driver need to bring with them to get a seat at FI?

I would imagine that di Resta brings no money with him

He doesn't. His wage is minuscule too. The main reason he was stuck in the FI in the first place was down to Mercedes, not Mallya. If he gets the Ferrari engines and Bernie's chance then I can see Di Resta being dropped like a stone for Senna's cash and Bianchi.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:35 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
stevey wrote:
How much money does Diresta bring with him, as currently he's the only driver who has a contract and I wonder how much the buy out clause is to terminate that contract.

Is Kobayashi still collecting for a race seat?

Out of interest how much money would a driver need to bring with them to get a seat at FI?

I would imagine that di Resta brings no money with him

He doesn't. His wage is minuscule too. The main reason he was stuck in the FI in the first place was down to Mercedes, not Mallya. If he gets the Ferrari engines and Bernie's chance then I can see Di Resta being dropped like a stone for Senna's cash and Bianchi.

This. I get the feeling you may be on the money there Laura.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:48 pm 
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di resta dropping after all the talk about him 100% in a FI 2013 . that would be a story!

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:02 pm 
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RebellionLola wrote:
di resta dropping after all the talk about him 100% in a FI 2013 . that would be a story!

Indeed! : P


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:18 pm 
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I'm not too surprised that they are in trouble. There was some financial problems early last year and the only reason they were saved was due to a sponsorship deal worth a fair amount of cash.

It's odd isnt it. We've gone from having 2 Indian drivers clambering for a seat, and a team with Indian markings, to no Indian drivers and if we're not careful, no Indian team. It would make the Indian GP's efforts a bit wasted. Maybe this is why Bernie has stepped in to 'fix' things.

Would be very interesting if Di Resta was dropped. Not that anyone would really care about loosing him though.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:25 pm 
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A quick Google search with "Joe Saward" and "Vijay Mallya" helps to highlight a lot of the issues Force India have had.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:25 pm 
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Just seen this

Parc Fermé ‏@PFF1
#F1 Colin Kolles, former team principal of Force India, is behind a plan to take over the team as Vijay Mallya is in financial trouble.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:28 pm 
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fieldstvl wrote:
A quick Google search with "Joe Saward" and "Vijay Mallya" helps to highlight a lot of the issues Force India have had.



When it comes to Joe and VJ there is some sort of history there and he hyper boles everything up . Like when he said VJ would be arrested for going to the Indian GP :uhoh: :uhoh:

He's not the most unbiased person when it comes to FI. He's also on Caterhams board.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:01 pm 
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GuyverF1 wrote:
Just seen this

Parc Fermé ‏@PFF1
#F1 Colin Kolles, former team principal of Force India, is behind a plan to take over the team as Vijay Mallya is in financial trouble.

Sounds like they are looking to sell up. Bye bye VJ...

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:07 pm 
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Though the articles and Yalla and Motorsport have disappeared, those about Mallya/Kingfisher haven't from business sites, so I don't think its all unfounded rumor IMO.

It does seem as though the FI team could at the very least be on the market to raise money to pay back taxes that Mallya/Kingfisher don't have the money to pay, as well as the back pay to the company's employees.

Lenders have asked Mallya/Kingfisher to infuse the company with a lot of money toward its debts before moving forward with a plan to finance a revival of the airline. Those meetings were today, so I'm not surprised that 'rumors' would be leaked about the team's future.

Given the situation, if FI were to go a pay driver or dual pay driver route under Mallya's ownership this year, its possible not much of it would be funneled back into the team and instead go toward Kingfisher debt or financing Mallya's lifestyle. Seems like Hulk can be very glad he moved to Sauber, and Di Resta may wish he had a seat with any other team for 2013 and not just that McLaren seat.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:14 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
GuyverF1 wrote:
Just seen this

Parc Fermé ‏@PFF1
#F1 Colin Kolles, former team principal of Force India, is behind a plan to take over the team as Vijay Mallya is in financial trouble.

Sounds like they are looking to sell up. Bye bye VJ...


The Deputy team priciple (Can't remember his name) has denied all the rumours and says they haven't talked to anyone.


http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/forc ... 06201.html

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:16 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
GuyverF1 wrote:
Just seen this

Parc Fermé ‏@PFF1
#F1 Colin Kolles, former team principal of Force India, is behind a plan to take over the team as Vijay Mallya is in financial trouble.

Sounds like they are looking to sell up. Bye bye VJ...


The Deputy team priciple (Can't remember his name) has denied all the rumours and says they haven't talked to anyone.


http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/forc ... 06201.html

They would though.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:20 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
GuyverF1 wrote:
Just seen this

Parc Fermé ‏@PFF1
#F1 Colin Kolles, former team principal of Force India, is behind a plan to take over the team as Vijay Mallya is in financial trouble.

Sounds like they are looking to sell up. Bye bye VJ...


The Deputy team priciple (Can't remember his name) has denied all the rumours and says they haven't talked to anyone.


http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/forc ... 06201.html

They would though.



Catch 22 then ain't it. They say nothing it snowballs. They deny it and "They would though" .

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:38 pm 
Fine. Time for Jordan Mugen Honda to return then...

http://imageshack.us/a/img189/7138/jordan1e.jpg

Ok, I know it's not gonna happen but I really miss some of the old teams like Jordan, Benetton or Ligier...


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:01 pm 
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I wonder if Sky would buy it. They seem to want to get as many arms and legs into F1 as possible, and what better way than owning their own team :P

Sky Sports F1 Team (HD)

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:10 pm 
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RickM wrote:
I wonder if Sky would buy it. They seem to want to get as many arms and legs into F1 as possible, and what better way than owning their own team :P

Sky Sports F1 Team (HD)

They wouldn't be allowed to. Be a conflict of interest I'd imagine. Sky F1 would turn into the Sky F1 Team Show, only their drivers would get interviewed, wouldn't be allowed to bad mouth the team etc. I'd understand that but I doubt it'll ever be approved. Besides Sky are more likely to sponsor a team than own one, far less risky, easy to get out quick if it goes tits up.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:12 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
RickM wrote:
I wonder if Sky would buy it. They seem to want to get as many arms and legs into F1 as possible, and what better way than owning their own team :P

Sky Sports F1 Team (HD)

They wouldn't be allowed to. Be a conflict of interest I'd imagine. Sky F1 would turn into the Sky F1 Team Show, only their drivers would get interviewed, wouldn't be allowed to bad mouth the team etc. I'd understand that but I doubt it'll ever be approved. Besides Sky are more likely to sponsor a team than own one, far less risky, easy to get out quick if it goes tits up.


Even if they sponsored a team i think it would ruin their coverage, like you said interviewing the drivers and never saying a bad word about that team, unless they kept it unbiased of coarse.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:18 pm 
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Didn't SKY sponsor McLaren towards the end of the year?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:36 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
Didn't SKY sponsor McLaren towards the end of the year?

Nope. SKY Brazil sponsor Red Bull at certain races.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:50 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
fieldstvl wrote:
A quick Google search with "Joe Saward" and "Vijay Mallya" helps to highlight a lot of the issues Force India have had.



When it comes to Joe and VJ there is some sort of history there and he hyper boles everything up . Like when he said VJ would be arrested for going to the Indian GP :uhoh: :uhoh:

He's not the most unbiased person when it comes to FI. He's also on Caterhams board.


Oh he's biased about most things... that's what keeps me going to his blog and the occasional 'audience with...' event :)

I think his issue with VM might be due to his close friendship with Tonio Liuzzi. Rather than printing lies about VM, though, I think he's just very aggressive with the truth, whereas he might not be with, for example, Caterham ;)


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:50 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Didn't SKY sponsor McLaren towards the end of the year?

Nope. SKY Brazil sponsor Red Bull at certain races.



I know that but I'm pretty sure someone had the Sky F1 channel logos on the inside of the rear wing end plates.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:16 pm 
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stevey wrote:
I've read that Maldonando brings a personal sponsorship of 20milion to Williams, is this true? If so then Force India might do a rethink on both their drivers and simply pay off Diresta's contract of 0.5 mil

If I remember correctly, I believe the correct figure was $29 million. There was an official Williams document showing the exact amount on here but Don't know where to look.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:02 pm 
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the incubus wrote:
stevey wrote:
I've read that Maldonando brings a personal sponsorship of 20milion to Williams, is this true? If so then Force India might do a rethink on both their drivers and simply pay off Diresta's contract of 0.5 mil

If I remember correctly, I believe the correct figure was $29 million. There was an official Williams document showing the exact amount on here but Don't know where to look.

I think this may be what you meant: http://alekboyd.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/f1-contract-pdvsa-and-williams.html


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:09 pm 
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RickM wrote:
I'm not too surprised that they are in trouble. There was some financial problems early last year and the only reason they were saved was due to a sponsorship deal worth a fair amount of cash.

It's odd isnt it. We've gone from having 2 Indian drivers clambering for a seat, and a team with Indian markings, to no Indian drivers and if we're not careful, no Indian team. It would make the Indian GP's efforts a bit wasted. Maybe this is why Bernie has stepped in to 'fix' things.

Would be very interesting if Di Resta was dropped. Not that anyone would really care about loosing him though.


And Bernie should step in.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:10 pm 
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Johnston wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Didn't SKY sponsor McLaren towards the end of the year?

Nope. SKY Brazil sponsor Red Bull at certain races.



I know that but I'm pretty sure someone had the Sky F1 channel logos on the inside of the rear wing end plates.

Yeah they did - on the inside of the rear wing was a Sky F1 HD advert

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:15 pm 
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RickM wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
Johnston wrote:
Didn't SKY sponsor McLaren towards the end of the year?

Nope. SKY Brazil sponsor Red Bull at certain races.



I know that but I'm pretty sure someone had the Sky F1 channel logos on the inside of the rear wing end plates.

Yeah they did - on the inside of the rear wing was a Sky F1 HD advert


Too bad you needed to have Sky F1 to see it.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:18 pm 
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greenwizard13 wrote:
Fine. Time for Jordan Mugen Honda to return then...

http://imageshack.us/a/img189/7138/jordan1e.jpg

Ok, I know it's not gonna happen but I really miss some of the old teams like Jordan, Benetton or Ligier...

Don't show that image to Eddie. He would be quite insulted, like I am.

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