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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:56 am 
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What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:43 am 
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specdecible wrote:
What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

Di Resta's racing career would be in tatters.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:07 am 
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Laura23 wrote:
specdecible wrote:
What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

Di Resta's racing career would be in tatters.

What about Karthikyans?

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 4:43 am 
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Although I do believe Narain could do better if given a half decent car I still believe Kobayashi would do better than him. I dont know what people on here are talking about Mallya having fianancial trouble. One of his companies Kingfisher Airlines is in trouble not Force India. FI is half owned be Sahara. They just raised 50 m to build a new wind tunnel. Thats hardly a small amount and building a new wind tunnel hardly speaks financial trouble. If he was he would have continued using the Airbus wind tunnel that they are currently using. However any team will welcome more money esp if its coming from TATA, it will give them more finance to finish the wind tunnel to get Up the grid faster

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Last edited by Race2win on Mon Feb 11, 2013 4:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 4:52 am 
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specdecible wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
specdecible wrote:
What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

Di Resta's racing career would be in tatters.

What about Karthikyans?


At this rate, he would pip Bianchi for the Ferrari drive.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:06 am 
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I've thought about it for a bit and now believe Karthikeyan deserves a car further up the pack.

With his experience of being the slowest driver on the track, and slowing everyone else down as well, he should be highly considered for the role of the 2013 Safety Car driver.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:22 am 
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infi24r wrote:
Adaemus wrote:
NetWorKzz wrote:
NO EFFING WAY THIS HAPPENS!

You can't pass on the current list of candidates Koba/Sutil/Bianchi .... NK...REALLY?! Oh well, not like I was rooting for FI anyways, don't like Di Resta one bit..


There seems to be a lot of this about, and for the life of me I can't see what the lad's done wrong.
:-|

Its his attitude, he complains constantly and feels he is deserving of a better drive only without the results to back it


Every time I've paid any attention he's got the best result he could have with the car underneath him. There are plenty of drivers who have flattered to deceive over the years, Trulli, Sutil, Heidfeld, but none of them receive the same level of hatred - and Sutil even stabbed a guy!

To be honest I think it just proves that this is more of a popularity contest than a sport sometimes, people just try and come up with ways to justify their disliking of someone. He may have the personality of a boiled cabbage but he seems like a decent, honest guy. Yes he believes he deserves better, but what do you think the rest of the lower half of the grid think? That they're at their 'level'? F1 is about being the best...and you're never going to be the best if you don't believe in yourself.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:56 am 
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Adaemus wrote:
infi24r wrote:
Adaemus wrote:
NetWorKzz wrote:
NO EFFING WAY THIS HAPPENS!

You can't pass on the current list of candidates Koba/Sutil/Bianchi .... NK...REALLY?! Oh well, not like I was rooting for FI anyways, don't like Di Resta one bit..


There seems to be a lot of this about, and for the life of me I can't see what the lad's done wrong.
:-|

Its his attitude, he complains constantly and feels he is deserving of a better drive only without the results to back it


Every time I've paid any attention he's got the best result he could have with the car underneath him. There are plenty of drivers who have flattered to deceive over the years, Trulli, Sutil, Heidfeld, but none of them receive the same level of hatred - and Sutil even stabbed a guy!

To be honest I think it just proves that this is more of a popularity contest than a sport sometimes, people just try and come up with ways to justify their disliking of someone. He may have the personality of a boiled cabbage but he seems like a decent, honest guy. Yes he believes he deserves better, but what do you think the rest of the lower half of the grid think? That they're at their 'level'? F1 is about being the best...and you're never going to be the best if you don't believe in yourself.


Looking at the list of drivers who don't have a seat for 2013 but had one in 2012 or 2011:
2012: Schumacher, De La Rosa, Glock, Kovalainen, Kobayashi, Petrov, Senna, d'Ambrosio
2011: Barrichello, Trulli, Liuzzi, Buemi, Alguersuari, Chandhok, Heidfeld, Sutil (?)
Except maybe for Chandhok I really don't see anyone Narain betters on that list
If Narian deserves a shot in a better car I want Monteiro back too.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:06 am 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
AFCTUJacko wrote:
If this happens i will no longer watch F1.

The pay driver situation is becoming a joke. It's supposed to be the pinnacle of motorsports. The best teams, the best engineers, the best drivers. Not the best teams, the best engineers, and whichever drivers have the deepest pockets 8O

Pay drivers have existed in the sport since its creation. In fact, given that motor racing started out as a rich man's play sport most drivers were originally 'pay drivers'

Pay drivers today are far more talented - they are backed by sponsors, and the sponsors won't just back anyone. Maldonado may be bankrolled by Venezuela but that means he is the best driver from Venezuela. The same goes for Perez and Mexico. Michael Schumacher started out as a pay driver, given that Vettel was part of the Red Bull program it could be argued he is a pay driver, it just happens that his sponsor owns the team rather than sponsoring it.

The talent in Formula 1 is closer than it has ever been, and that is comparing the current backmarkers against one of the most talent rich group of front runners in the sport's history.

The pay driver system is often vindicated by results. And I agree the least talented pay drivers of today are probably of a higher standard than they used to be. But there is still a worrying trend. Pay drivers used to be a means to an end for a struggling team, these days they're part of the business model of established midfield teams, and even top teams aren't above it. The likes of Williams and Sauber seem tied to pay drivers now for survivial, and now this rumour about FI. The smaller teams live hand to mouth depending on who they can put in the car, almost regardless of talent (NK is a joke IMO). And it's no secret Ferrari dumped Raikkonen for Alonso for the Santander money (they could have had him without it a couple of seasons earlier, but Todt chose Raikkonen). I assuem that's about a cherry on top of their budget, and running Alonso is hardly a penalty! But the money was key all the same. McLaren took on Perez weeks after Dennis suggested the team were not as financially healthy as once they were. Good as Perez is, I can't believe he was first choice as Hamilton's replacement, surely there's a long term Mexican commercial plan in the works there.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:54 am 
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specdecible wrote:
What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

Wouldn't happen in a million years.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 11:55 am 
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Adaemus wrote:
infi24r wrote:
Adaemus wrote:
NetWorKzz wrote:
NO EFFING WAY THIS HAPPENS!

You can't pass on the current list of candidates Koba/Sutil/Bianchi .... NK...REALLY?! Oh well, not like I was rooting for FI anyways, don't like Di Resta one bit..


There seems to be a lot of this about, and for the life of me I can't see what the lad's done wrong.
:-|

Its his attitude, he complains constantly and feels he is deserving of a better drive only without the results to back it


Every time I've paid any attention he's got the best result he could have with the car underneath him. There are plenty of drivers who have flattered to deceive over the years, Trulli, Sutil, Heidfeld, but none of them receive the same level of hatred - and Sutil even stabbed a guy!

To be honest I think it just proves that this is more of a popularity contest than a sport sometimes, people just try and come up with ways to justify their disliking of someone. He may have the personality of a boiled cabbage but he seems like a decent, honest guy. Yes he believes he deserves better, but what do you think the rest of the lower half of the grid think? That they're at their 'level'? F1 is about being the best...and you're never going to be the best if you don't believe in yourself.


Really? On what planet you are on? Definitely not Planet F1. ;) ;)

Look how much hate SUtil got in old threads. And Same with Heidfeld. But in case of Heidfeld there were some supporters of him or his talent, but large group was still justifying his sacking in the way it all happened. Same with Trulli. All these guys got plenty derogatory posts here in new as well as old PF1 :-P


P.S : Some drivers come off friendly on TV, Some come as nice, cool and exciting in interviews, some drivers who lot of people hate due to on track behaviour are actually nice in person, some driver have that natural aura, some are just that good. And then there are few drivers like the one on this list and likes of PDR. Who are not exactly golden property as far as PR or on screen / track value goes.
Frankly I knew nothing about this guy before he came to F1. And the first interview I saw of him, he was very confident, almost smug / overconfident sounding for a guy who has not raced before. But I though, maybe he is that good, lets wait and watch. That first set of interviews actually generated lot of expectations. Regardless the facts, how you present yourself in public does create certain results. Had he actually done something special, something eye catching, lot of people would not have questioned his talent. Hulk had bad start to season, but in both season he drove he had at least that 1 impressive drive or show that caught everyone's eye. That matters a lot, and he comes off very friendly and nice chap on TV and also in person when interacting with fans. (Had chance to meet him at Force India's Goa event before).
Nothing wrong in driver being confident, but then things like this do happen where -ve image is created in media and amongst fans when performances dont come.


Last edited by funkymonkey on Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:01 pm 
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funkymonkey wrote:
Adaemus wrote:

Every time I've paid any attention he's got the best result he could have with the car underneath him. There are plenty of drivers who have flattered to deceive over the years, Trulli, Sutil, Heidfeld, but none of them receive the same level of hatred - and Sutil even stabbed a guy!

To be honest I think it just proves that this is more of a popularity contest than a sport sometimes, people just try and come up with ways to justify their disliking of someone. He may have the personality of a boiled cabbage but he seems like a decent, honest guy. Yes he believes he deserves better, but what do you think the rest of the lower half of the grid think? That they're at their 'level'? F1 is about being the best...and you're never going to be the best if you don't believe in yourself.


Really? On what planet you are on? Definitely not Planet F1. ;) ;)

Look how much hate SUtil got in old threads. And Same with Heidfeld. But in case of Heidfeld there were some supporters of him or his talent, but large group was still justifying his sacking in the way it all happened. Same with Trulli. All these guys got plenty derogatory posts here in new as well as old PF1 :-P


:lol: Fair enough!

I guess I'm just sticking up for Di Resta because nobody else seemed to be. I don't have an opinion on his personality particularly, I don't know him, but it seems unfair that it's that which people are judging him on, not his driving.

He well and truly deserves his place on the grid in my opinion, more so than quite a few others that have secure seats.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:04 pm 
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Balibari wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
AFCTUJacko wrote:
If this happens i will no longer watch F1.

The pay driver situation is becoming a joke. It's supposed to be the pinnacle of motorsports. The best teams, the best engineers, the best drivers. Not the best teams, the best engineers, and whichever drivers have the deepest pockets 8O

Pay drivers have existed in the sport since its creation. In fact, given that motor racing started out as a rich man's play sport most drivers were originally 'pay drivers'

Pay drivers today are far more talented - they are backed by sponsors, and the sponsors won't just back anyone. Maldonado may be bankrolled by Venezuela but that means he is the best driver from Venezuela. The same goes for Perez and Mexico. Michael Schumacher started out as a pay driver, given that Vettel was part of the Red Bull program it could be argued he is a pay driver, it just happens that his sponsor owns the team rather than sponsoring it.

The talent in Formula 1 is closer than it has ever been, and that is comparing the current backmarkers against one of the most talent rich group of front runners in the sport's history.

The pay driver system is often vindicated by results. And I agree the least talented pay drivers of today are probably of a higher standard than they used to be. But there is still a worrying trend. Pay drivers used to be a means to an end for a struggling team, these days they're part of the business model of established midfield teams, and even top teams aren't above it. The likes of Williams and Sauber seem tied to pay drivers now for survivial, and now this rumour about FI. The smaller teams live hand to mouth depending on who they can put in the car, almost regardless of talent (NK is a joke IMO). And it's no secret Ferrari dumped Raikkonen for Alonso for the Santander money (they could have had him without it a couple of seasons earlier, but Todt chose Raikkonen). I assuem that's about a cherry on top of their budget, and running Alonso is hardly a penalty! But the money was key all the same. McLaren took on Perez weeks after Dennis suggested the team were not as financially healthy as once they were. Good as Perez is, I can't believe he was first choice as Hamilton's replacement, surely there's a long term Mexican commercial plan in the works there.

It needs to be put in perspective that in 1992, when Williams was the fastest team with one of the biggest budgets (if not the biggest) in the sport it was operating on a smaller budget than the backmarkers operate on today. Williams had access to the best sponsors and ran a cheaper operation. The smaller teams had smaller budgets still.

Today, the operating budgets of F1 teams make F1 of 20 years ago look like an amateur sport. They need to generate as much income as possible, and whether that is through drivers paying for a seat or signing drivers who attract high paying sponsors then that is what has to be done.

However, there is a certain degree of scorn towards pay drivers, as if it's like grabbing any old chump off of the street and putting him in a Formula 1 car. This simply isn't the case, even the worst pay driver like Karthikeyan is a very talented driver. He might not be the next Schumacher, but he is certainly not a bad driver by any stretch of the imagination. He's just the worst when compared to the highly talented field he is in.

Until we end up with a situation where a Hamilton, Vettel or Alonso loses his seat to a Karthikeyan we have nothing to worry about. Yes, drivers like Kovalainen and Kobayashi have lost their seats - but this were never grade A drivers, they were never going to win championships. Kovalainen finished 7th in the same car as the WDC and only managed to win a single race which he inherited through attrition. Kobayashi was a fun, fan favourite, but he was put in the shade by Perez who most would not consider to be in the Vettel league either.

So long as the best drivers are getting seats and the best teams are operating at least one top drawer driver then we should not start worrying. Formula 1 is a very expensive sport, and the pay drivers are still excellent drivers, even if some are not in the Alonso league.

But if we had 22 Alonsos on the grid, then presumably the ones driving the Marussias and the Caterhams would be getting scorn from the fans.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:10 pm 
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RickM wrote:
The only reason I'd ever like to see NK in F1 again is for his grin...he always looks so happy...




...Other than that, he has no place in F1 - ever.

I'd rather see Karun Chandhock back - he never even got a chance really. Had half a season in the first HRT, then 1 friday practice in the Team Lotus that ended with him in the wall without completing a corner, let alone a lap.

I think he had more one practice session with Team Lotus and was quite a bit of the pace

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:16 pm 
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specdecible wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
specdecible wrote:
What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

Di Resta's racing career would be in tatters.

What about Karthikyans?

What if the sun didn't shine?

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:32 pm 
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specdecible wrote:
Laura23 wrote:
specdecible wrote:
What if Karthikyan beats Di Resta?

Di Resta's racing career would be in tatters.

What about Karthikyans?


after that, Karthikyan to Red Bull for 2014 instead of Webber.... 8)


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