planetf1.com

This.

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Me Like - Button, Hamilton, Webber, Rosberg
Over rated, over paid - Räikkönen, Alonso, Vettel. Schumacher
Disappointing - Massa, Kobayashi
I may be wrong about - Alonso

My sentiments exactly

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PF1 Pick 10
Aus13: 2nd
Chi13: 3rd

Yeah Trulli was the most modern pointless, Ascari incorrect and Panis wasn't pointless. They guessed Lauda, R. Schumacher and Irvine - only Lauda was correct but scored 3.

I went with Maurice Trintignant, Panis and Patrese - Patrese was Pointless

Scheckter and G. Villeneuve were both pointless as was what should be the defacto standard answer for Pointless F1 questions - Denny Hulme

2011 was only made interesting by teams not having a clue how the Pirellis would wear for the first half of the season.
2008 was made interesting by a wet dry race, which is uncommon in Monaco and the only one in 15 years.
2005 was nothing to write home about. Kimi won from pole and Fred burned his tyres out. Pretty much it.
2004 had a crash at the start and the two incidents in the tunnel but was otherwise processional.
2001 A rare good afternoon for Jaguar but the race was a dull Ferrari 1-2.
2000 Schumacher was way out in front then his exhaust cracked. Boring.
1998 Wurz crashed, Schumacher had a damaged suspension, DC's engine blew. Nothing all that exciting.
1997 Wet race, they're always fairly entertaining. It's not a Monaco thing.
1996 As above.

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I remember when this website was all fields.

I love Monaco. Yes the race can be dull at times but the circuit is totally unique and is the most challenging race on the calendar for the drivers. It has also thrown up some really cracking races over the years, precisely because the layout means that anything can happen.

Appart from Valencia and Singapore?

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I remember when this website was all fields.

Well I've seen quite a lot of overtaking in Valencia and Singapore in 2012.
But in Monaco...the big heads-up were pilots crashing in the barriers, but nowadays even that don't happen so often anymore. Last couple of races were rather boring.

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Olivier Panis fan.
...and also Jenson Button fan.

That's sort of my point. It's not unique anymore. Valencia and Singapore both offer the same challenges of close barriers and little margin forever, however they allow room for overtaking. Monaco you can spend an entire race taking the inside line into the chicane and nobody will get past, so long as you don't mess up your braking.

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I remember when this website was all fields.

I love it, look forward to it every year.

It's worth it just to see F1 cars through Casino & the swimming pool & a few other places on the circuit.

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Get your facts right first, then you can distort them as you please. Mark Twain.

So what races do you find exciting that is not because of tyres/rain/crashing/leader retirements? Or what races do you find exciting because of the track? Im amazed if you really did not get any enjoyment out of any of those races.

Also in a lot of those races - 05 and 00 for example a lot of the excitement was caused by events lower down the field.

Monaco is unique. The slowest, shortest, most narrow(this is very important and unique feature!), the highest downforce track in F1 calendar. Beside that it has many elevation changes, you actually see buildings and yachts around track and it has a tunnel. Valencia is street track only because it's in the middle of the city, has barriers, but I think it doesn't use any public roads at all. Singapore is similar to Monaco, but it looks nothing like Monaco and it doesn't have tunnel

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Any old sap can pull teeth from a dead crocodile.
It takes a man to pull teeth from a live one.

IMO prior to last year the races were very exciting. But sice last year because you need to nurse the tyres it become a little boring and it'll probably be the same this year too. Like Balbari says

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PF1 Pick 10
Aus13: 2nd
Chi13: 3rd

It's a great circuit to drive on in F1 games.

It doesn't provide the greatest racing, but the one thing I love about the circuit is that it's barely changed since the 1950s - the circuit Mark Webber won on in 2012 is pretty much the same circuit that the likes of Fangio and Clark drove round. How many other circuits can you say that about - Monza probably comes closest.

To take my favourite circuit, Spa. Raikonnen and Webber overtaking Schumacher on the way in to Eau Rouge. Hakkinen hunting down Schumacher and passing around the outside of Zonta. The fact that you need suncream and an umbrella within the same half hour on a regular basis. Challenging high speed corners like Pouhon, Eau Rouge and Blanchimont.

There are no difficult corners in Monaco, just chances to knock the wheels off if you cock it up, which drivers rarely do these days. It's historically seen as the jewell in the crown but recently it's been by Webber twice, DC twice, Trulli and Panis. Good drivers but hardly greats. It's not the be all and end all in terms of driver skill.

Spa seperates the Elite from the rest. Looks at the winners. Coulthard is the only none WC to win the race since 1984 (I'm not including Massa). For the last 3 decades it has been dominated by the likes of Schumacher, Senna, Raikkonen, Hill, Prost and Hamilton.

There are many other races I enjoy regularly but Spa was just the most striking. At Monaco one gets the impression the race is over after turn 1 bar a few minor incidents lower down the field. I'm sorry I don't sit around hoping for technical failures to make a race exciting. I was a big DC fan in his day but I found Monaco 2000 dull appart from a brief 30 second period when I realised Michael was in trouble

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I remember when this website was all fields.

Saying an F1 track is unique because it is narrow is like saying a Miss World contestant is unique because she looks like Ian Dowie. Yes, it is unique but that doesn't mean good. Narrow just means one line through every corner and overtaking is vitrually impossible.

Going racing without a tunnel is like going paintballing without a banjo. It means naff all appart from slightly obscured and dingy camera shots of a small segment of the track.

I'm not sure what the appeal of racing on public roads is either. The idea of a load of French people being stuck in traffic jams for a week is amusing but doesn't contribute much to the race. Unless your idea of a good race is seeing the words, "bus lane" written accross the track.

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I remember when this website was all fields.

Spa is a superb track and I would not argue that Monaco is better than Spa but it does provide a different challenge. Whilst there are no difficult corners per say the general theory is that the best drivers can gain more times in the slow corners than the quick ones.

I love Monaco and the racing it provides and you don't. That's fine they are two opposing opinions. But you can't say Monaco is shit like it's a fact because to most people it isn't for a variety of reasons.

Singapore and Valencia are not comparable to Monaco in my view. Yes they are all urban circuits with barriers lining the track but that is where the similarities end. Monaco presents a far greater challenge to the drivers in terms of driving precision, concentration and endurance.

Put it this way. Valencia and Singapore both comply with the FIA's regulations on track safety or they would never have made it onto the calendar. Monaco does not by a long shot and requires special dispensation to be on the calendar. It's up to you whether you want to interpret this as an indication that the place is outdated and totally unsuitable for staging an F1 race, or as an measure of the unique challenge that it presents. Personally I prefer the latter.


Even if I do disagree, this cracked me up

Fair enough, I'm not denying anyone their opinion. I'm just giving mine. Just going back to a point I made about Spa, sorry everyone I know this is off topic a bit but;

The 1984 race was actually at Zolder. Collins, Brook, Gurney, Coulthard and Rodriguez are the only 5 drivers in history to have won at Spa and failed to be a WDC. I know Spa has changed a lot over the years but still, wow.

45 races at Spa and 40 of them were won by world champions.

I'm done now mods, back on topic everyone.

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I remember when this website was all fields.

Indeed, it is pretty much the same circuit used for the first GP there in 1929.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seqYJ9azUbw

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Get your facts right first, then you can distort them as you please. Mark Twain.

That there exist other street races doesn't make Monaco redundant. Cramped pit facilities, no straights to speak of and a complete lack overtaking spots make Monaco redundant. But here is a street circuit whose character sets it apart even from other street circuits - not to mention the generic strip of stultifying tarmac that passes for a grand prix track these days.

Monaco is like an Alfa Romeo

Maybe Pirelli can come up with special Monaco tyres (as SS and softs are too durable even for there) so we can see some racing, albeit artificial.

i'd rather see a precession than artificial overtakes where tyres fall off unexpectedly, i think my stance on these tyres is well known, and in my opinion the racing these tyres and DRS is providing is a joke (although i do think that the DRS in monaco is the right distance and in the right place). I cant remember the last time a DRS overtake was even remotely exiting other than Hamilton of Schumi in 2011. i feel i am gettting off subject with my moaning about DRS so maybe i should wrap up, but that is just how i personally feel

I like that comparision.

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PF1 Pick 10
Aus13: 2nd
Chi13: 3rd

Do you not think they cars they drove have a lot to do with that? Since 1984 I would say Raikkonen and Hill are the only drivers to win at Spa in a car that wasn't a front runner.

Monaco provides more opprtunites to drivers in lesser cars. I personally find it enjoyable to see something different for a change.

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"I am a believer, but I start each Grand Prix with 195 liters of fuel behind me," he explains. "I don't rely entirely on God, I rely on Prost."

Spa's a great track alright, but you get sick and tired of being rainned on after going for 5 years. You go Monaco once and I guarantee you'll be back. You don't even need a race ticket, just watch it in one of the Bars, meet drivers inbetween sessions, go out at night to a proper bar instead of some shite man made tent that you get at most tracks in the 'middle of nowhere'. Monaco, Singapore and Abu Dhabi are where it's at.

You can't generalise that someone who likes Monaco isn't a proper racing fan, but there is more than just going to a race, for the racing, it's an overall experience.

One thing about Monaco is undeniable: when media speak about retired or vintage drivers, they will most probably mark and emphasize the victory achieved in Monaco.

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The end is near

Maybe you're right about Valencia but not Singapore... Races there pretty much always get close to the 2 hour limit, it's hot, it's humid, drivers have to deal with racng under lights, a real challenge, probably more so than Monaco. Yeah there's a few bigger run-offs there but they are still close to wall for a large amount of the time and the fact that there are chances for overtaking mean even more concentration is required.
Singapore > Monaco > Valencia

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"Braver than a bullfighter with no knickers on!"

Give 'em hell Dani!

British Driver Supporter (and Daniel Ricciardo)

Don't forget '06 where MS was demoted and then passed most of the field.

That is a good point, I was thinking more along the lines of the circuit layout. Certainly the heat and humidity give Singapore that extra challenge that Monaco doesn't have, but what makes Monaco so demanding for the drivers is the bumpy surface and lack of straights between corners means that the drivers take one hell of a pounding and have no respite throughout the entire race. Singapore has a smoother track surface and few nice straights to give the drivers a chance to catch their breath. It's impossible for me to judge whether the heat and humidity of Singapore or the relentless battering of Monaco present a greater challenge, only the drivers can tell us that.

Fair enough, I think Singapore is known for being pretty bumpy too though. It's held on proper streets like Monaco as opposed to the purpose built stuff like Valencia.

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"Braver than a bullfighter with no knickers on!"

Give 'em hell Dani!

British Driver Supporter (and Daniel Ricciardo)

How many slow motion replays did sky do at the chicane turn 10,11 where the cars were clipping the curb. Boring

Monaco is not held on proper streets Streets use the circuit. When there is no race, they allow public traffic there.

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Any old sap can pull teeth from a dead crocodile.
It takes a man to pull teeth from a live one.

As much as my head knows Monaco is usually a dull race, my heart loves it because it is Monaco. I think it's one of those divisive races whereby most people will either feel the same way as I do, and require no explanation beyond that, or not be a fan of the race and struggle to understand/appreciate that particular point of view.

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Currently cheering for: Felipe Massa; Nico Hulkenberg; Romain Grosjean; Felipe Nasr. Oh, and of course, the Toronto Maple Leafs

I have only been watching F1 a full six seasons. So maybe the new hasn't worn off for me so I voted Hell Yea. It's about tradition, danger, prestige, honor, and pure speed. Ask the old timers about the honor. Ask Hugo Chavez, DC, Lewis Hamilton, and the crown prince about the prestige. Ask Sergio Perez and Vitaly Petrov about the danger. So I guess that leaves the tradition for the fans. What do you guys think vote it up.

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Turnabout is Fair Play. I think. I may have heard that somewhere.

It's not a favorite for me, but I don't mind it. I wouldn't want more like it. In a calender of 18-20 races, I figure there's room for 1 like it. And I'd rather watch it than some of the newer circuits with no atmosphere where its impossible not to notice that the cars are cruising past section of stands after section of stands with no one in them, covered by tarps, and I can't help but wonder why in the heck are they having a race there. At least Monaco is something that stirs passion among the drivers and interest among the spectators.

What helps make it interesting for me is that its a race I don't watch like I watch most races, where I'm watching driver vs. driver or car vs. car, but rather watch it as driver vs. circuit and driver vs. car. Whereas its usually another driver ready to make a driver pay for a mistake, there its the circuit that will make them pay for a mis-step. So at least for me, there is that battle to watch which makes it watchable.

If it disappeared from the calender I would miss it, whereas there are at least 5 others on the 2013 calender that could be replaced and I wouldn't mind at all.

I disagree most of F1's tracks that have character are narrow.

Wide+rightangles=boring and soulless.

No they aren't. Narrow just makes overtaking very difficult. I'd agree that Tilke has gone too far in the oppostie direction, you could 3 point turn a submarine in turn 1 at Texas for example, but I do not want narrow tracks.

Monaco is one of the worst circuits there is for right angles.

St Devote - Right angle
Turn 2 - Nice wide curve, probably the only decent one on there IMO
Casino - Right angle
Mirabeau - Right angle
Lowes - Hairpin
Turn 6 - Right angle
Turn 7 - Right angle
Chicane - 2 Right angles
Tabac - Right angle
Swimming pool - Chicane
Rascasse - 2 right angles in quick succession
A. Nogues - Right angle

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I remember when this website was all fields.