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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:12 am 
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xECKSx58 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXATzDBDjgo


I keep forgetting that Crashtor drives for Lotus now. Lotus could make video gold by putting together a clip of Maldo and RoGro squaring off in a Demolition Derby arena.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 7:42 am 
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xECKSx58 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXATzDBDjgo


The video is completely wrong, there is no way in hell that a Venezuelan has tea instead of coffee for breakfast.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 1:34 pm 
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Lotus reaches mileage limit in first run of its 2014 Formula 1 car
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/112470


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:04 pm 
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McPrancingBull wrote:
Uffman wrote:
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Neatly placed Autosport magazine I see hahaha

Too late :uhoh: :-(( :lol:

Good spot, i guess they feel a bit vindicated now in missing the test

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:10 pm 
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SmoothRide wrote:
xECKSx58 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXATzDBDjgo


I keep forgetting that Crashtor drives for Lotus now. Lotus could make video gold by putting together a clip of Maldo and RoGro squaring off in a Demolition Derby arena.

They only need to find some GP2 clips

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:58 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
xECKSx58 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXATzDBDjgo


I keep forgetting that Crashtor drives for Lotus now. Lotus could make video gold by putting together a clip of Maldo and RoGro squaring off in a Demolition Derby arena.

They only need to find some GP2 clips


They already did a photo on there Twitter account when he signed!! :lol:

https://twitter.com/Lotus_F1Team/status ... 1109471233


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 5:38 pm 
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/26122651

Not much in the way of detail from the BBC but it appears that Lutus ran its 'promotional' test at the weekend with no issues. Renaut appear to be reasonably confident that it has ironed out the bugs encountered during the first test:

Quote:
Renault Sport said it fitted the car with developments aimed at fixing the problems experienced at the Jerez test. These included minor hardware changes, software bug fixes and calibration improvements.

The news will encourage world champions Red Bull, as well as Renault's other teams, Toro Rosso and Caterham.


Hopefully Red Bull et al will get some decent mileage in Bahrain.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 5:40 pm 
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They do very little running at full bananas in promo runs though. Lotus were using promo tyres too so they are still very much on the back foot.

A cold Jerez doing just 100km is very different from trying race distances in Bahrain.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 6:26 pm 
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I'm not entirely convinced about them having no issues. I read they only managed a single lap on the first day. Whether that's power plant or car I don't know


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:11 pm 
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If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:08 pm 
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mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Wow. That's a ridiculously hostile article.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:22 pm 
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mds wrote:
mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Wow. That's a ridiculously hostile article.

I think this is the worst article I've read in a while about F1. Ok the car could break down, but author sounds like he/she really wants to Lotus to be punished for that test.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:05 pm 
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dizlexik wrote:
mds wrote:
mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Wow. That's a ridiculously hostile article.

I think this is the worst article I've read in a while about F1. Ok the car could break down, but author sounds like he/she really wants to Lotus to be punished for that test.


Wonder if they wrote the same crap about the other teams that have had a promotional event. :)

edit: apparently they chose Hamilton as driver of the year last year. If there was any question left about their credibility...

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:10 pm 
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Well to be fair if it was supposed to be a promo test and no promo work went on then that is a rule break similar to what Mercedes did last year. You can't run full pelt in promo runs and you can't use anything but special promo tyres because you aren't supposed to learn much about your car during them. They aren't tests.

If Lotus turned it into a test of 100KM then I'm sure the other teams will be a little annoyed, the Merc and Ferrari ones anyway. If the test was run fairly then Lotus still will be on just as much of a back foot as they were two weeks ago and Renault still won't know how the engines are doing when running at full speed.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:24 pm 
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mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Pretty misleading article, saying they did hardly any running, but then saying they did about 20 laps.

100km allowed distance / 4.4km per lap = 22.7 laps, seems like they pretty much did the distance.

I doubt that the laps were at speed though. Bahrain test will be interesting.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:36 pm 
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I agree the article was hostile, but looking past that it seems the Lotus only ran one lap on Friday, which points to them having issues, too. It's corroborated on the BBC but unfortunately neither says what the Friday issues were down to, i.e. Renault or Lotus


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:36 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Well to be fair if it was supposed to be a promo test and no promo work went on then that is a rule break similar to what Mercedes did last year. You can't run full pelt in promo runs and you can't use anything but special promo tyres because you aren't supposed to learn much about your car during them. They aren't tests.


So Laura, a few questions:
1) Who says they did no promo work?
2) Who says they ran full pelt?
3) Who says they didn't use the promo tyres?
4) Who says they did more than they are allowed to?

They'll be smart enough to comply to the restrictions for PE's. If they did comply, then by no means it comes even close to what Mercedes did last year.

Quote:
If Lotus turned it into a test of 100KM then I'm sure the other teams will be a little annoyed, the Merc and Ferrari ones anyway.


Why would the Merc ones, especially Merc themselves, be annoyed? Mercedes did a PE themselves! Are we to believe that was solely a pure PE?

Let's not be naive here.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:38 pm 
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stringy wrote:
mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Pretty misleading article, saying they did hardly any running, but then saying they did about 20 laps.

100km allowed distance / 4.4km per lap = 22.7 laps, seems like they pretty much did the distance.

I doubt that the laps were at speed though. Bahrain test will be interesting.

How does it work with the 2 day limit?
Is it 100km in total split over 2 days? Or 100km allowed each day?

I have no idea.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:41 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
Well to be fair if it was supposed to be a promo test and no promo work went on then that is a rule break similar to what Mercedes did last year. You can't run full pelt in promo runs and you can't use anything but special promo tyres because you aren't supposed to learn much about your car during them. They aren't tests.

If Lotus turned it into a test of 100KM then I'm sure the other teams will be a little annoyed, the Merc and Ferrari ones anyway. If the test was run fairly then Lotus still will be on just as much of a back foot as they were two weeks ago and Renault still won't know how the engines are doing when running at full speed.

It's not novel idea. Ferrari did that too long time ago. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/84881

Ferrari posted video from Alonso helmet camera and avoided any sanctions iirc, despite many teams complaints. Now all Lotus needs to do is to show short video, picture or whatever that would look like promotional material from that test.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:45 pm 
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It would be so much easier if the FIA just outlawed any kind of running outside official test days and have a couple of proper mid season tests instead.

Promo work should be done using old chassis only.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:53 pm 
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mcdo wrote:
stringy wrote:
mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Pretty misleading article, saying they did hardly any running, but then saying they did about 20 laps.

100km allowed distance / 4.4km per lap = 22.7 laps, seems like they pretty much did the distance.

I doubt that the laps were at speed though. Bahrain test will be interesting.

How does it work with the 2 day limit?
Is it 100km in total split over 2 days? Or 100km allowed each day?


The Sporting Regulations stipulate that a PE (Promotional Event) may not exceed 100km in length.
The Sporting Regulations also stipulate that the competitor needs to communicate 72 hours in advance, among other info, "the date(s) and intended duration of the test".

If you ask me, the article on GP247 is wrong. According to the above a PE may span 2 (or more) days as long as they don't surpass 100km of running.

So that's probably why they only ran 1 lap on Friday and about 20 on Saturday: one installation lap, studying on it, then get it together for Saturday, then complete the maximum mileage.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:54 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
I agree the article was hostile, but looking past that it seems the Lotus only ran one lap on Friday, which points to them having issues, too. It's corroborated on the BBC but unfortunately neither says what the Friday issues were down to, i.e. Renault or Lotus


See my previous reply: a PE can span 2 days, as long as they don't surpass 100km.
This is logical: Lotus probably didn't want to use up both of their PE's in what was essentially a shakedown & engine test.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:55 pm 
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Laura23 wrote:
It would be so much easier if the FIA just outlawed any kind of running outside official test days and have a couple of proper mid season tests instead.

Promo work should be done using old chassis only.

This is almost exactly what FIA actually did. Previously teams were allowed to conduct 10 days of promo running, now only 2 days, but more testing is allowed instead.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:52 pm 
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"Promo days" need to be 'fixed'. I.e 2 days pre-season where ALL teams have the option of taking part in that 2 day run. Then 2 days mid-summer.

It's way too easy for teams to pass off these 'filming days' and using them for testing.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:02 pm 
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RickM wrote:
"Promo days" need to be 'fixed'. I.e 2 days pre-season where ALL teams have the option of taking part in that 2 day run. Then 2 days mid-summer.

It's way too easy for teams to pass off these 'filming days' and using them for testing.

Pretty much this. If they were forced to use two year old chassis then it should solve most problems as well. After all stick some newer bits of body work on it and the new paint scheme and who from Joe Bloggs would actually notice the difference? Thats why the use showcars at demo runs after all. They should use showcars in promo filming too. They don't really need to do promo filming mid season either tbh, get it all done pre season and out of the way. That way there can't be disputes mid season a la Mercedes in 2013.

If two people on a forum can work that out you'd think the FIA could.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:04 am 
Laura23 wrote:
It would be so much easier if the FIA just outlawed any kind of running outside official test days and have a couple of proper mid season tests instead.

Promo work should be done using old chassis only.


Lets make an advert with a year old car that is now 12 months old and by the time we edit it and air it will be 18 months out of date and looks nothing like our current car.

Force India, Mercedes, Williams and Renault all done these days. Every single team uses there run throughout the year. Its not a problem, you are just creating one. Its 20 laps running on tyres that are nothing like the race tyres with only one car these days.

Lets be grateful for promo runs;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrgBMDlyePc


Last edited by lamo on Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:16 am 
RickM wrote:
"Promo days" need to be 'fixed'. I.e 2 days pre-season where ALL teams have the option of taking part in that 2 day run. Then 2 days mid-summer.

It's way too easy for teams to pass off these 'filming days' and using them for testing.


A lot of the filming, they are following a road car that has a camera man filming the car behind. You can not do that with lots of cars on track.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:23 am 
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lamo wrote:
RickM wrote:
"Promo days" need to be 'fixed'. I.e 2 days pre-season where ALL teams have the option of taking part in that 2 day run. Then 2 days mid-summer.

It's way too easy for teams to pass off these 'filming days' and using them for testing.


A lot of the filming, they are following a road car that has a camera man filming the car behind. You can not do that with lots of cars on track.

Designate hours to teams then.
As for them using an old chassis, like I said stick some newer panels on and most people won't notice. After all when the film an ad with a company such as Santander they aren't going for the hard core fans. They are going for the general public. They won't care how accurate the car is as long as it's obviously an F1 car.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:36 am 
Laura23 wrote:
lamo wrote:
RickM wrote:
"Promo days" need to be 'fixed'. I.e 2 days pre-season where ALL teams have the option of taking part in that 2 day run. Then 2 days mid-summer.

It's way too easy for teams to pass off these 'filming days' and using them for testing.


A lot of the filming, they are following a road car that has a camera man filming the car behind. You can not do that with lots of cars on track.

Designate hours to teams then.
As for them using an old chassis, like I said stick some newer panels on and most people won't notice. After all when the film an ad with a company such as Santander they aren't going for the hard core fans. They are going for the general public. They won't care how accurate the car is as long as it's obviously an F1 car.


I think most would notice between this years and last years Ferrari.

Its all beside the point anyway, its 16 laps running on promo tyres at Silverstone. Every team gets to do it and every team uses it in the same way. I mean seriously.

Do you want the teams allocation of straight line testing banned too?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:46 am 
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lamo wrote:
RickM wrote:
"Promo days" need to be 'fixed'. I.e 2 days pre-season where ALL teams have the option of taking part in that 2 day run. Then 2 days mid-summer.

It's way too easy for teams to pass off these 'filming days' and using them for testing.


A lot of the filming, they are following a road car that has a camera man filming the car behind. You can not do that with lots of cars on track.
But you could do it with last year's car as camera car (on promo tyres).

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:39 am 
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mds wrote:
mcdo wrote:
stringy wrote:
mcdo wrote:
If this article is to be believed they didn't do much running. And the little they did wasn't at speed.

http://grandprix247.com/2014/02/10/lotus-break-the-spirit-of-formula-1-sporting-regulations-as-e22-flops-at-jerez/


Pretty misleading article, saying they did hardly any running, but then saying they did about 20 laps.

100km allowed distance / 4.4km per lap = 22.7 laps, seems like they pretty much did the distance.

I doubt that the laps were at speed though. Bahrain test will be interesting.

How does it work with the 2 day limit?
Is it 100km in total split over 2 days? Or 100km allowed each day?


The Sporting Regulations stipulate that a PE (Promotional Event) may not exceed 100km in length.
The Sporting Regulations also stipulate that the competitor needs to communicate 72 hours in advance, among other info, "the date(s) and intended duration of the test".

If you ask me, the article on GP247 is wrong. According to the above a PE may span 2 (or more) days as long as they don't surpass 100km of running.

So that's probably why they only ran 1 lap on Friday and about 20 on Saturday: one installation lap, studying on it, then get it together for Saturday, then complete the maximum mileage.

Cool thanks. Ya going by that regulation it seems you could have the 100km spread over 10 days if you felt like, as long as you communicate it.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:20 pm 
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So can we assume that this test was planned before they even got to Jerez so that they could have two separate times to run the engine an therefore focus resources at two times rather than having just another team at the original Jerez test.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:28 pm 
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w1Y! wrote:
So can we assume that this test was planned before they even got to Jerez so that they could have two separate times to run the engine an therefore focus resources at two times rather than having just another team at the original Jerez test.

I don't think it was planned. Renault paid for this test, so it was rather Renault trying to fix engine. The filming days are nothing like proper test. 20 laps is nothing. Beside that I don't think anyone before Jerez could predict that Renault powered teams would be that bad there.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:36 pm 
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mds wrote:
Zoue wrote:
I agree the article was hostile, but looking past that it seems the Lotus only ran one lap on Friday, which points to them having issues, too. It's corroborated on the BBC but unfortunately neither says what the Friday issues were down to, i.e. Renault or Lotus


See my previous reply: a PE can span 2 days, as long as they don't surpass 100km.
This is logical: Lotus probably didn't want to use up both of their PE's in what was essentially a shakedown & engine test.
I'm no engineer but it seems really strange to me that they would do their installation lap on a separate day to actual running. At GPs now drivers will still do installation laps every day and indeed every practice session IIRC, whereas you'd think that they shouldn't need to after the first time. Happy for someone more knowledgeable to correct me but to me it implies things didn't go smoothly.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 2:51 pm 
Zoue wrote:
mds wrote:
Zoue wrote:
I agree the article was hostile, but looking past that it seems the Lotus only ran one lap on Friday, which points to them having issues, too. It's corroborated on the BBC but unfortunately neither says what the Friday issues were down to, i.e. Renault or Lotus


See my previous reply: a PE can span 2 days, as long as they don't surpass 100km.
This is logical: Lotus probably didn't want to use up both of their PE's in what was essentially a shakedown & engine test.
I'm no engineer but it seems really strange to me that they would do their installation lap on a separate day to actual running. At GPs now drivers will still do installation laps every day and indeed every practice session IIRC, whereas you'd think that they shouldn't need to after the first time. Happy for someone more knowledgeable to correct me but to me it implies things didn't go smoothly.


Its not really a standard installation lap. A normal installation lap is to check everything is still working and no leaks after the car has travelled the world in freight and possibly had some new parts added. They know everything worked before hand.

The first ever lap in an F1 car is much more than a standard installation lap, they do not know if its all even going to work together for that first ever run.


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