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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:38 am 
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I've been playing Rage on 360.

It's quite fun, though I expected some RPG elements that haven't really turned up to be honest. It's quite fun, but way too easy. I'm playing it on the "Ultra Nightmare" difficulty and have had very few issues apart from right at the start when I was struggling to get used to the AR spraying in all directions. I'm not yet finished, so no spoilers please, but I remember when it came out that everyone and their mother disliked the ending.

I'm about 12 hours in I think, and I'm on the first of 3 disks still. So might be a long one. It's good fun though. I'm currently working through all the games I have backlogged (I tend to buy quite a few more games each year than I have time to play). This was quite a good pick. I think next will be The First Templar (or is it called Last Templar... I always forget), Dead Space 2 and Harry Potter 7 Part 2. Not sure of the order yet, probably Dead Space first as it is a loan from a pal. I have about... 80 games backlogged between DLC packs I have yet to play,games I haven't played and arcade games I haven't played. So I'm working on reducing that. I don't plan on buying a game this year (except maybe F1 2013) so as to reduce this as much as possible.

I finished Knight's Contract the other day, I'll say this for it. It is a deeply flawed game. In some ways I can see what they tried with making only specific attacks hit some enemies, but it made the game infuriating, especially if you don't realise this or have other magic attacks equipped. The game is basically a button basher, and while amusing, is not worth playing imo. If you saw it cheap and had nothing better to do, perhaps... but there are a lot of better games out there.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:15 pm 
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Can anyone recommend any good (split screen) co-op games for PS3? Me and my buddy get together occasionally to drink a few beers and play some games, and so far we've enjoyed Dead Nation and Borderlands the best, but are now looking for some new games to play.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:42 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
Can anyone recommend any good (split screen) co-op games for PS3? Me and my buddy get together occasionally to drink a few beers and play some games, and so far we've enjoyed Dead Nation and Borderlands the best, but are now looking for some new games to play.


I play most games on 360, but I figure if the 360 split screen was good, the same is probably true for the PS3. as far as I know, all games I mention will be multiplat so should be okay.

Coop games I have enjoyed:
Resident Evil 5 - This is great fun in coop. I'm replaying it currently with my coop buddy. It's fun when you can get it so it is hard, but not too hard.
Army of Two: 40th Day - I enjoyed this game a lot, though I think a lot of people disliked it. I found it a pleasant enough shooter (third person mostly) with some fun gun customisation.
Far Cry 3 - coop in this is quite fun. It's one of the games that works really well for having one person make noise and attract attention and the other go flank. I played it with system link and 2 TVs, so I'm not sure how it works on a single console, or even if it does. This is also a great SP game.
Call of Duty - MW2, MW3, Blops and Blops 2 (probably W@W also) have couch coop. MW2 and MW3 have Special Ops which are GREAT. I think MW2 is the best of them for cooping Special Ops, it is much more fun than MW3s imo.
F.3.A.R (Fear 3) - Coop campaign is quite fun, it's slightly unique in so much as the two characters are very different. Hard to jump in story-wise, I didn't really get what was happening.
Kane & Lynch - The first one is quite fun, the second one is pretty horrible.
Left 4 Dead 2 - I recommend this, with the DLC pack that gives all maps from the first game. It's good ol' zombie killing fun and has more variety than L4D alone. Definitely get the DLC packs! (I'm fairly sure this is a multiplat but haven't checked. It's valve though, so probably is).
Portal 2 - haven't played the coop yet, but the game itself is quite fun.
Rage - linking in to my above chat, this has a couch coop. I think its quite a fun game.
Splinter Cell: Conviction - This is quite different. You can shoot through a fair whack of coop but mostly you need stealth. I found it fun, but if your partner sucks it is a pain in the pickle.
The First Templar - it's a fun enough hack'n'slash, and has couch coop.


Downloadable Games:
Unbound Saga - great fun side scrolling beat em up. Loved it. Very silly.
Warhammer 40k: Kill Team - bizareely better than the Space Marine game tbh. Twin stick shooter, great fun though it is relatively short.

I think that is about all the coop games I have played on this generation, though I'll have missed some somewhere. I'm a big fan of coop still, and dislike the move toward everything always being online instead of splitscreen. Anyway, hopefully those suggestions are all on PS3 also. I don't really know any of the PS3 exclusive ones so someone might be able to give you a better list.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:49 pm 
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mac_d wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Can anyone recommend any good (split screen) co-op games for PS3? Me and my buddy get together occasionally to drink a few beers and play some games, and so far we've enjoyed Dead Nation and Borderlands the best, but are now looking for some new games to play.


I play most games on 360, but I figure if the 360 split screen was good, the same is probably true for the PS3. as far as I know, all games I mention will be multiplat so should be okay.

Coop games I have enjoyed:
Resident Evil 5 - This is great fun in coop. I'm replaying it currently with my coop buddy. It's fun when you can get it so it is hard, but not too hard.
Army of Two: 40th Day - I enjoyed this game a lot, though I think a lot of people disliked it. I found it a pleasant enough shooter (third person mostly) with some fun gun customisation.
Far Cry 3 - coop in this is quite fun. It's one of the games that works really well for having one person make noise and attract attention and the other go flank. I played it with system link and 2 TVs, so I'm not sure how it works on a single console, or even if it does. This is also a great SP game.
Call of Duty - MW2, MW3, Blops and Blops 2 (probably W@W also) have couch coop. MW2 and MW3 have Special Ops which are GREAT. I think MW2 is the best of them for cooping Special Ops, it is much more fun than MW3s imo.
F.3.A.R (Fear 3) - Coop campaign is quite fun, it's slightly unique in so much as the two characters are very different. Hard to jump in story-wise, I didn't really get what was happening.
Kane & Lynch - The first one is quite fun, the second one is pretty horrible.
Left 4 Dead 2 - I recommend this, with the DLC pack that gives all maps from the first game. It's good ol' zombie killing fun and has more variety than L4D alone. Definitely get the DLC packs! (I'm fairly sure this is a multiplat but haven't checked. It's valve though, so probably is).
Portal 2 - haven't played the coop yet, but the game itself is quite fun.
Rage - linking in to my above chat, this has a couch coop. I think its quite a fun game.
Splinter Cell: Conviction - This is quite different. You can shoot through a fair whack of coop but mostly you need stealth. I found it fun, but if your partner sucks it is a pain in the pickle.
The First Templar - it's a fun enough hack'n'slash, and has couch coop.


Downloadable Games:
Unbound Saga - great fun side scrolling beat em up. Loved it. Very silly.
Warhammer 40k: Kill Team - bizareely better than the Space Marine game tbh. Twin stick shooter, great fun though it is relatively short.

I think that is about all the coop games I have played on this generation, though I'll have missed some somewhere. I'm a big fan of coop still, and dislike the move toward everything always being online instead of splitscreen. Anyway, hopefully those suggestions are all on PS3 also. I don't really know any of the PS3 exclusive ones so someone might be able to give you a better list.


One I'll add is Mass Effect 3. Might not be for everyone, but I enjoy the co-op in it, it's pretty fun. Though I haven't played it enough to say if its repetetive or long-term entertainment or anything. I used to play Halo 1-3 with a group of mates at weekends with the old split screen and link up systems, I think we had 16 of us all crammed into a garage playing it once, that was great fun. I miss my youth...

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 1:35 pm 
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jammin78 wrote:

One I'll add is Mass Effect 3. Might not be for everyone, but I enjoy the co-op in it, it's pretty fun. Though I haven't played it enough to say if its repetetive or long-term entertainment or anything. I used to play Halo 1-3 with a group of mates at weekends with the old split screen and link up systems, I think we had 16 of us all crammed into a garage playing it once, that was great fun. I miss my youth...


I'm about as big a Mass Effect 3 fan as there is, but I didn't think there was a split-screen option which was requested? If does, let me know how to do it as it would be useful as I really dig the online bits of that game. And the offline bits too. I love Mass Effect.

As for Halo, I remember doing 8 player Team Slayer using a system link. Done on like a 20inch TV. We've been sop spoiled by bigger TVs now I don't think I could do that. I remember playing Goldeneye on a Tv that was probably smaller than my screen if I was playing a 4player game now. Damn good fun though. That team slayer game is historical, everyonew how as there remembers it still/


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:05 pm 
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mac_d wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Can anyone recommend any good (split screen) co-op games for PS3? Me and my buddy get together occasionally to drink a few beers and play some games, and so far we've enjoyed Dead Nation and Borderlands the best, but are now looking for some new games to play.


I play most games on 360, but I figure if the 360 split screen was good, the same is probably true for the PS3. as far as I know, all games I mention will be multiplat so should be okay.

Coop games I have enjoyed:
Resident Evil 5 - This is great fun in coop. I'm replaying it currently with my coop buddy. It's fun when you can get it so it is hard, but not too hard.
Army of Two: 40th Day - I enjoyed this game a lot, though I think a lot of people disliked it. I found it a pleasant enough shooter (third person mostly) with some fun gun customisation.
Far Cry 3 - coop in this is quite fun. It's one of the games that works really well for having one person make noise and attract attention and the other go flank. I played it with system link and 2 TVs, so I'm not sure how it works on a single console, or even if it does. This is also a great SP game.
Call of Duty - MW2, MW3, Blops and Blops 2 (probably W@W also) have couch coop. MW2 and MW3 have Special Ops which are GREAT. I think MW2 is the best of them for cooping Special Ops, it is much more fun than MW3s imo.
F.3.A.R (Fear 3) - Coop campaign is quite fun, it's slightly unique in so much as the two characters are very different. Hard to jump in story-wise, I didn't really get what was happening.
Kane & Lynch - The first one is quite fun, the second one is pretty horrible.
Left 4 Dead 2 - I recommend this, with the DLC pack that gives all maps from the first game. It's good ol' zombie killing fun and has more variety than L4D alone. Definitely get the DLC packs! (I'm fairly sure this is a multiplat but haven't checked. It's valve though, so probably is).
Portal 2 - haven't played the coop yet, but the game itself is quite fun.
Rage - linking in to my above chat, this has a couch coop. I think its quite a fun game.
Splinter Cell: Conviction - This is quite different. You can shoot through a fair whack of coop but mostly you need stealth. I found it fun, but if your partner sucks it is a pain in the pickle.
The First Templar - it's a fun enough hack'n'slash, and has couch coop.


Downloadable Games:
Unbound Saga - great fun side scrolling beat em up. Loved it. Very silly.
Warhammer 40k: Kill Team - bizareely better than the Space Marine game tbh. Twin stick shooter, great fun though it is relatively short.

I think that is about all the coop games I have played on this generation, though I'll have missed some somewhere. I'm a big fan of coop still, and dislike the move toward everything always being online instead of splitscreen. Anyway, hopefully those suggestions are all on PS3 also. I don't really know any of the PS3 exclusive ones so someone might be able to give you a better list.

Thanks mac, I’m sure we’ll find something from this list! I have some experience from single player in RE5 and MW2, and L4D2 I’ve played online on the PC. RE5 was just awful on the PC but I bet it’s much better on a console as it was developed for one.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:08 pm 
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mac_d wrote:
jammin78 wrote:

One I'll add is Mass Effect 3. Might not be for everyone, but I enjoy the co-op in it, it's pretty fun. Though I haven't played it enough to say if its repetetive or long-term entertainment or anything. I used to play Halo 1-3 with a group of mates at weekends with the old split screen and link up systems, I think we had 16 of us all crammed into a garage playing it once, that was great fun. I miss my youth...


I'm about as big a Mass Effect 3 fan as there is, but I didn't think there was a split-screen option which was requested? If does, let me know how to do it as it would be useful as I really dig the online bits of that game. And the offline bits too. I love Mass Effect.

As for Halo, I remember doing 8 player Team Slayer using a system link. Done on like a 20inch TV. We've been sop spoiled by bigger TVs now I don't think I could do that. I remember playing Goldeneye on a Tv that was probably smaller than my screen if I was playing a 4player game now. Damn good fun though. That team slayer game is historical, everyonew how as there remembers it still/

Actually yeah I don't recall seeing the split screen option for ME3... I presumed there was one, though turns out there isn't. My apologies, I clearly haven't played it for too long! I'll go ahead and say Killzone 3 then in it's place, I loved the multiplayer on that.

Yep it was small TVs for me too, funny looking back. I got the Halo CE Anniversary game and it had the option to put the original graphics back on, so I did that, on my old TV and was just like "wow... I didn't realise how bare and featureless the textures were." I just took for granted that it must have been ridiculously detailed because I was so impressed with it first time around, amazing to see how far the scales of quality have come since Goldeneye, then the likes of Halo etc. Makes you wonder how impressive games will be in another ten years.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:15 pm 
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jammin78 wrote:

Yep it was small TVs for me too, funny looking back. I got the Halo CE Anniversary game and it had the option to put the original graphics back on, so I did that, on my old TV and was just like "wow... I didn't realise how bare and featureless the textures were." I just took for granted that it must have been ridiculously detailed because I was so impressed with it first time around, amazing to see how far the scales of quality have come since Goldeneye, then the likes of Halo etc. Makes you wonder how impressive games will be in another ten years.


The texture thing got me too! It's also funny for Half Life 2, which on Xbox used the system pretty much to it's fullest. I got Orange Box on 360 and the difference was astounding. Halo looked so good at the time it's odd to have it look poor comparitively. I find it odd that Mario Kart 64 aged so much worse than Mario 64 did. I guess part of that is use of 2D sprites in Mario Kart 64. Still, funny.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 4:09 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
mac_d wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Can anyone recommend any good (split screen) co-op games for PS3? Me and my buddy get together occasionally to drink a few beers and play some games, and so far we've enjoyed Dead Nation and Borderlands the best, but are now looking for some new games to play.


I play most games on 360, but I figure if the 360 split screen was good, the same is probably true for the PS3. as far as I know, all games I mention will be multiplat so should be okay.

Coop games I have enjoyed:
Resident Evil 5 - This is great fun in coop. I'm replaying it currently with my coop buddy. It's fun when you can get it so it is hard, but not too hard.
Army of Two: 40th Day - I enjoyed this game a lot, though I think a lot of people disliked it. I found it a pleasant enough shooter (third person mostly) with some fun gun customisation.
Far Cry 3 - coop in this is quite fun. It's one of the games that works really well for having one person make noise and attract attention and the other go flank. I played it with system link and 2 TVs, so I'm not sure how it works on a single console, or even if it does. This is also a great SP game.
Call of Duty - MW2, MW3, Blops and Blops 2 (probably W@W also) have couch coop. MW2 and MW3 have Special Ops which are GREAT. I think MW2 is the best of them for cooping Special Ops, it is much more fun than MW3s imo.
F.3.A.R (Fear 3) - Coop campaign is quite fun, it's slightly unique in so much as the two characters are very different. Hard to jump in story-wise, I didn't really get what was happening.
Kane & Lynch - The first one is quite fun, the second one is pretty horrible.
Left 4 Dead 2 - I recommend this, with the DLC pack that gives all maps from the first game. It's good ol' zombie killing fun and has more variety than L4D alone. Definitely get the DLC packs! (I'm fairly sure this is a multiplat but haven't checked. It's valve though, so probably is).
Portal 2 - haven't played the coop yet, but the game itself is quite fun.
Rage - linking in to my above chat, this has a couch coop. I think its quite a fun game.
Splinter Cell: Conviction - This is quite different. You can shoot through a fair whack of coop but mostly you need stealth. I found it fun, but if your partner sucks it is a pain in the pickle.
The First Templar - it's a fun enough hack'n'slash, and has couch coop.


Downloadable Games:
Unbound Saga - great fun side scrolling beat em up. Loved it. Very silly.
Warhammer 40k: Kill Team - bizareely better than the Space Marine game tbh. Twin stick shooter, great fun though it is relatively short.

I think that is about all the coop games I have played on this generation, though I'll have missed some somewhere. I'm a big fan of coop still, and dislike the move toward everything always being online instead of splitscreen. Anyway, hopefully those suggestions are all on PS3 also. I don't really know any of the PS3 exclusive ones so someone might be able to give you a better list.

Thanks mac, I’m sure we’ll find something from this list! I have some experience from single player in RE5 and MW2, and L4D2 I’ve played online on the PC. RE5 was just awful on the PC but I bet it’s much better on a console as it was developed for one.


When i was an undergraduate, i use to play Pro Evolution soccer with with my mates, always a good craic!

I think Fifa is now the preferred football game, but thats normally good fun with a few drinks

The first game i owned on the PS3 was Rainbow 6, Las Vegas (or something along the lines of that name)
Me and a mate of mine played that until 6am in the morning, so hooked! (it was only a tenner (£10) but hours of entertainment)


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:40 pm 
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vikz22 wrote:

When i was an undergraduate, i use to play Pro Evolution soccer with with my mates, always a good craic!

I think Fifa is now the preferred football game, but thats normally good fun with a few drinks

The first game i owned on the PS3 was Rainbow 6, Las Vegas (or something along the lines of that name)
Me and a mate of mine played that until 6am in the morning, so hooked! (it was only a tenner (£10) but hours of entertainment)


Pro Evo hasn't really changed much since PES6 so it's been overtaken by FIFA. Both are great fun with mates though. R6Vs are pretty good as well, because you can't go in all guns blazing, every single time.

There are some fun multiplayer games for PS3, but a lot of them aren't co-op. Like Marvel vs Capcom 3, London 2012, Unreal Tournament 3 (which I assume is multiplayer because the 360 version is), Resistance: Fall of Man (remains one of my favourite FPS of all time, was gutted when they took out the co-op story mode for the sequel)


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 4:22 pm 
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I thought RB6:Vegas was pretty awful.

I liked RB6 "back in the day" but Vegas was just not up to scratch. Some levels were good, a lot were mediocre and commonly they were pretty piss-poor. I appreciate what they were trying, and did like the gun choices. I always gravitate to strong, single shot assault rifles in games though. Lacks some of the final stopping power but easier to use than a Sniper. And some of the SMGs were just almighty.

You know, I've probably been a little harsh calling it awful. It was okay. I just thought the two I had on xbox were better, but this may be a case of bad memory.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:40 pm 
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You people should try out Super Hexagon. You try to keep a triangle from hitting closing walls. It's a difficult but addictive game. :] (and frustrating too :x )

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:59 pm 
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I finished Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2 last night.

I don't know if it an age thing, but they have done way downhill in my book. The ones I've played recently (5,6,7-1 and 7-2) have been okay, but my goodness they were short. If you pay £40 for a game (which, might I say I didn't, I got them all for less than £10 each) you'd expect it to be a bit longer than this. Admittedly, the change in tone is similar to the change in tone from the early books to later books. Anyway, fun enough but short. The most pleasant aspect was at the end it showed bits from the 8 games, in a "Thanks for playing" montage. Found that quite pleasant.

Not sure what I'll start tomorrow evening, might try and get back into Dead Space 2 / Portal 2 or maybe start something new altogether. Backlog slowly being reduced. I really need to play some of the many, many arcade games I have on my hard drive doing nothing.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:01 pm 
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RaisinChips wrote:
You people should try out Super Hexagon. You try to keep a triangle from hitting closing walls. It's a difficult but addictive game. :] (and frustrating too :x )

OMG I played Hexxagon in the early nineties, don't know if it's the same game but... I got hooked on it.

http://www.jugarjuegos.com/juegos/flash/hexxagon/


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:25 pm 
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chican wrote:
RaisinChips wrote:
You people should try out Super Hexagon. You try to keep a triangle from hitting closing walls. It's a difficult but addictive game. :] (and frustrating too :x )

OMG I played Hexxagon in the early nineties, don't know if it's the same game but... I got hooked on it.

http://www.jugarjuegos.com/juegos/flash/hexxagon/


The answer is no it's not the same game.

Hexxagon - is about capturing the board

Super Hexagon - is about avoiding the rapidly closing in lines...
http://superhexagon.com/

:D :D :D


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:43 pm 
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chican wrote:
RaisinChips wrote:
You people should try out Super Hexagon. You try to keep a triangle from hitting closing walls. It's a difficult but addictive game. :] (and frustrating too :x )

OMG I played Hexxagon in the early nineties, don't know if it's the same game but... I got hooked on it.

http://www.jugarjuegos.com/juegos/flash/hexxagon/


When I opened that site my antivirus got a bit paranoid.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:58 pm 
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I just bought Skyrim Oblivion for a fiver y/day (hopefully should be here in the next few days).
has anyone played it before, and is it any good?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:24 pm 
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MrMuttley wrote:
chican wrote:
RaisinChips wrote:
You people should try out Super Hexagon. You try to keep a triangle from hitting closing walls. It's a difficult but addictive game. :] (and frustrating too :x )

OMG I played Hexxagon in the early nineties, don't know if it's the same game but... I got hooked on it.

http://www.jugarjuegos.com/juegos/flash/hexxagon/


When I opened that site my antivirus got a bit paranoid.
Well, it's an on-line flash app, so your antivirus attitude is somewhat comprehensible. If you want to try it without antiviruses alarms you'd better google it as abandonware and see if it's downloadable. It's worth it =D


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:43 pm 
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vikz22 wrote:
I just bought Skyrim Oblivion for a fiver y/day (hopefully should be here in the next few days).
has anyone played it before, and is it any good?


Skyrim and Oblivion are two different games from the Elderscrolls series. However, you can't go far wrong given they are two of the best games I have played. I actually think Oblivion was better however. But either way you are looking at an absolutely top level game.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:52 pm 
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mac_d wrote:
vikz22 wrote:
I just bought Skyrim Oblivion for a fiver y/day (hopefully should be here in the next few days).
has anyone played it before, and is it any good?


Skyrim and Oblivion are two different games from the Elderscrolls series. However, you can't go far wrong given they are two of the best games I have played. I actually think Oblivion was better however. But either way you are looking at an absolutely top level game.



thanks, shows how much i know about the game i bought :S,
can't wait for them to arrive!


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:05 pm 
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vikz22 wrote:


thanks, shows how much i know about the game i bought :S,
can't wait for them to arrive!


I've bought many games like that, where I thought I had bought something and confuddled it with something else. Like when I bought Eternal Sonata I was looking for Enchanted Arms. Very different games, both pretty odd.

Anyway, if it is Oblivion, I recommend getting the Shivering Isles DLC pack, it is a GREAT addition to the game. The other DLC packs for it are pretty mediocre, Knights of the Nine is pleasant enough but short and the others are very small add ons that might make life easier if you really want to get into item crafting and rapid levelling etc.

If it is Skyrim, most people would say you are in for more of a treat. I prefer Oblivion, though imo it's like a 9.5/10 vs a 9/10 and that probably makes too much of the gap. The game improves a lot of features but lacks some of the more charming little moments Oblivion had. the Dark Brotherhood in Oblivion was much, much more entertaining and you had some pretty whacky missions that Skyrim lacks. DLC packs... well Heathfire is pretty pointless. Dawnguard was reasonably interesting. i haven't played the latest pack (I do have it but not go round to it yet).


Planning on finishing dead Space 2 by the end of the weekend. I have knocked about 10-15 games off my backlog list this year already, might be able to buy a new game at the end of summer. (Not buying anything until I knock most of the list off)


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:27 pm 
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Is anyone on here getting an Ouya? I backed it on Kickstarter and it should be released in the next couple of months.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 7:15 pm 
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Just thought I would ask, anyone else on this forum got a Wii U?

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 8:57 pm 
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lol WiiU is for kidz! :P

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 9:33 pm 
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f1madman wrote:
lol WiiU is for kidz! :P

No it is not! =D


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 9:39 pm 
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f1madman wrote:
lol WiiU is for kidz! :P

That's a bad attitude for a gamer! Even games on the wii and wiiU aimed at kids can be challenging and fun, even if some people look down their nose at them!!! Please don't take this as a personal attack, but it's like PC sim racers looking down their nose at you cause you play Forza or Gran Turismo and their not 'proper' sims, or world of war craft players sneering cause you like Zelda!

Personally I think the wiiU is a great concept, being able to use the wii remote (which still works so much better in games than kinect or move even if it's not full body capture) having a normal controller, but with a touch screen. It's just waiting for developers to utilise it correctly. I've read people slagging it off as it's 'pointless', well of course it's pointless playing a port game like COD or assassin's creed, but when it gets used properly, it could be a handy tool. Imagine playing an RPG with all your're inventory available to hand or a detailed map in front of you? Very useful. Or possibly iPlayer, Netflix and the likes releasing apps so you could watch on the TV or take the controller anywhere in range to watch on that.

I don't have a wiiU myself, but that's just because I can't currently afford one. Also the wii I've got was bought a couple of months after release and is still working without a problem. I'm still using my release buy DS, my N64, SNES and NES are all working, whereas I'm on my 3rd xbox 360 now! You really can't fault Nintendo for reliability.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:25 pm 
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Robbo-92 wrote:
Just thought I would ask, anyone else on this forum got a Wii U?


I was thinking about getting one (won't be for a while now though, if ever).

The real issue I have with it is an odd one. It might be inconsequential really, but it takes a freakin' age to do anything on it! going from things in the menu etc takes a long time. Plus, almost everything currently on it that I would want is on 360 already, which I have so it is cheaper by a margin.

Wii was okay. The trouble was that it was weak graphically (graphic are important - not everything but important) and early on it had a severe lack of games. I got mine on release day. Zelda:Twilight Princess was amazing (and also on Gamecube). Metroid Prime 3, came later and was great. Resi 4 was a previous GC and other consoles games. Mario Kart Wii was the worst Mario Kart game I have played. Super Mario Galaxy was a rare gem, it was a truly breath-taking game. But that was pretty much all the big releases in the first year or so. Wii Sports was pretty good also though, the Bowling game was remarkably well made and great fun.

For balance, I'll add that I won't be buying a new Xbox or Playstation console for a while after release. PS4 (or whatever it ends up being called) will probably be insanely expensive. New Xbox I won't trust not to implode or explode or overheat. I'm an equal opportunity cynic...


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:40 pm 
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The new Xbox and PS4 are rumoured to both have DRM that locks a copy of a game to that system thus preventing people from selling their games and buying second hand. If true this is terrible news and I doubt I will be buying either and reverted back to PC gaming. While I usually buy new I can't support this.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:53 pm 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
The new Xbox and PS4 are rumoured to both have DRM that locks a copy of a game to that system thus preventing people from selling their games and buying second hand. If true this is terrible news and I doubt I will be buying either and reverted back to PC gaming. While I usually buy new I can't support this.



That would be truly bad news, as a lot of the PS3 games i have are second hand. Also i share a lot of my games and vice versa so it will be mega lame if the next generation of consoles won't facilitate that.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:58 pm 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
The new Xbox and PS4 are rumoured to both have DRM that locks a copy of a game to that system thus preventing people from selling their games and buying second hand. If true this is terrible news and I doubt I will be buying either and reverted back to PC gaming. While I usually buy new I can't support this.

I've read that too. I'm undecided on what I think of it though.
How would games rentals work? (Edit: I guess some kind of online verification PIN and a timer).
And regarding PC gaming, I assume that if you buy something from Steam that you can't sell it on after playing it, which is the most popular way of buying PC games(?). So what would you gain by going to the PC side? And if more and more people are buying Xbox Arcade games and downloads, which are locked to the console, does it really matter all that much about physical discs?
How does MS or Sony make money from locking games to individual consoles? Is this not them responding to pressure from games makers and publishers et al, who are the biggest losers of the second hand game trade?
Unless most of the above is completely wrong, I support this from the point of view of the makers. But I'll miss buying things for 99p on eBay.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:52 am 
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bbobeckyj wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
The new Xbox and PS4 are rumoured to both have DRM that locks a copy of a game to that system thus preventing people from selling their games and buying second hand. If true this is terrible news and I doubt I will be buying either and reverted back to PC gaming. While I usually buy new I can't support this.

I've read that too. I'm undecided on what I think of it though.
How would games rentals work? (Edit: I guess some kind of online verification PIN and a timer).
And regarding PC gaming, I assume that if you buy something from Steam that you can't sell it on after playing it, which is the most popular way of buying PC games(?). So what would you gain by going to the PC side? And if more and more people are buying Xbox Arcade games and downloads, which are locked to the console, does it really matter all that much about physical discs?
How does MS or Sony make money from locking games to individual consoles? Is this not them responding to pressure from games makers and publishers et al, who are the biggest losers of the second hand game trade?
Unless most of the above is completely wrong, I support this from the point of view of the makers. But I'll miss buying things for 99p on eBay.

Yes, but digitally downloaded games are a fraction of the cost of console games and you can play them on any machine you sign in on with your Steam account. Console games are extremely expensive to begin with. It's clearly a move designed to try and extract more money from the gamer, however I do not think it has been thought through. While games purchased second hand do represent money that does not go to the publisher for that particular copy it is forgetting that the players who buy new and sell on recuperate money from the second hand game. So assuming a player buys a game for $60 and sells it for $30 that has only cost him $30. If he can't sell his games then he will only be able to buy half as many games, and the players who buy second hand can't afford to buy new.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:56 am 
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I've also read that games are going download only on the new xbox (not read about the Sony yet). At the moment a downloaded game on xbox is locked to your gamer tag, so you can download it on any machine your logged onto but it can still only be played using your profile. Hopefully they'll keep it thus way. On the wii any downloaded games can only be played on the console they were downloaded onto, which is annoying as I've got 2 wii's st 2 different places and can only play the games on 1 of them.

What really annoys me with xbox download games though is the price. They're currently advertising fable 3 for download at £29.99 but you can buy it new for under £15 in shops, I only paid £35 buying it on release ages ago.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:11 am 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Yes, but digitally downloaded games are a fraction of the cost of console games and you can play them on any machine you sign in on with your Steam account. Console games are extremely expensive to begin with. It's clearly a move designed to try and extract more money from the gamer, however I do not think it has been thought through. While games purchased second hand do represent money that does not go to the publisher for that particular copy it is forgetting that the players who buy new and sell on recuperate money from the second hand game. So assuming a player buys a game for $60 and sells it for $30 that has only cost him $30. If he can't sell his games then he will only be able to buy half as many games, and the players who buy second hand can't afford to buy new.


But if they change the up front price to reflect the fact you can't sell it, it might be a decent compromise for all...

IE - Instead of charging $60 for the game, they charge $40.

They guy who would have bought 2nd hand would probably have paid that price, but the one who buys up front gets it cheaper. Thing is, the publishers make more money because originally, the guy buying 2nd hand wouldn't generate money for them, but if he is buying new, albeit at a cheaper price, they make the money not the shop...

Problem is, they are too greedy and claim games are too expensive to make...

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:16 am 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Yes, but digitally downloaded games are a fraction of the cost of console games and you can play them on any machine you sign in on with your Steam account. Console games are extremely expensive to begin with. It's clearly a move designed to try and extract more money from the gamer, however I do not think it has been thought through. While games purchased second hand do represent money that does not go to the publisher for that particular copy it is forgetting that the players who buy new and sell on recuperate money from the second hand game. So assuming a player buys a game for $60 and sells it for $30 that has only cost him $30. If he can't sell his games then he will only be able to buy half as many games, and the players who buy second hand can't afford to buy new.

All may be true, but missing a few bits.

There is a good reason that the console games cost more, the consoles are sold at a loss, even Nintendo are doing it this time with the WiiU.
Physical copies of PC games are a lot more expensive than the download copies, reflecting the costs of manufacturing and getting into retailers.
As already said any Xbox game can be played with the account it was downloaded with, not the actual machine.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:35 am 
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Can't wait to see the new Valve PC.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:55 am 
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bbobeckyj wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Yes, but digitally downloaded games are a fraction of the cost of console games and you can play them on any machine you sign in on with your Steam account. Console games are extremely expensive to begin with. It's clearly a move designed to try and extract more money from the gamer, however I do not think it has been thought through. While games purchased second hand do represent money that does not go to the publisher for that particular copy it is forgetting that the players who buy new and sell on recuperate money from the second hand game. So assuming a player buys a game for $60 and sells it for $30 that has only cost him $30. If he can't sell his games then he will only be able to buy half as many games, and the players who buy second hand can't afford to buy new.

All may be true, but missing a few bits.

There is a good reason that the console games cost more, the consoles are sold at a loss, even Nintendo are doing it this time with the WiiU.
Physical copies of PC games are a lot more expensive than the download copies, reflecting the costs of manufacturing and getting into retailers.
As already said any Xbox game can be played with the account it was downloaded with, not the actual machine.

But that's not entirely reflective of reality, it's the argument given. On Xbox Live the digital download versions of games are the same price, or more expensive, than buying a new physical version. Buying in Steam is much cheaper than buying a physical copy of a game. The manufacturing costs of the consoles go down as the platform matures, the tech in the PS3 and Xbox is now 7 years old, the processors for smart phones announced this year are more powerful than them. At launch a games console is less powerful than the top PC, buying a PC of the same power would be similar in cost - I mean, we're looking at £500 for the new PS4. I bought a laptop with the fastest (at the time) i7 graphics cards, one of the fastest mobile GPUs, 16GB of 1600MHz RAM, a 15inch, 1080p screen, a Blu ray writer for £1100 in May last year, and that's a laptop where the cost for specs is high, a PC of equivalent specs would be much less.

Also, to address this issue Valve has launched the Steambox. A low cost, living room based PC. And while the specs may be lower than either the PS4 or Xbox 720 the specs are higher than the PS3 and Xbox 360 which can only be fully exploited for power by the richest game developers. While the argument "we don't need graphics better than this" has been around since the original Quake there is now a different, much more valid graphics related argument. For the PS2 generation of consoles small teams of developers could compete against the larger developers for graphics fidelity. On the current generation, in order to render Master Chief's nipple or Marcus Fenix's butt crack it requires a team of programmers and artists. While the smaller teams can compete in the brains and talent department, in order to get the most of the hardware it requires huge teams just due to the sheer manpower.

So, while people will always be insatiable for better graphics, the current generation is already proving that the number of developers with the resources available to produce the content is shrinking, and the next generation will have an even bigger divide. As a result, for the smaller developers, it doesn't matter if they develop for the PS3 or PS4, Xbox 360 or Xbox 720, or Steambox or even consoles like the Ouya or native nVidia Shield. Or even the iPad or equivalent tablets. A quick look at Infinity Blade on the iPad shows graphics that smaller developers can't match on the PS3, it even features technology on the iPad version of the Unreal engine that Epic hasn't put on its console version of the engine.

So while a Steambox might not be able to get the most out of Halo 6 or Modern Warfare 5, it would be able to run them at lower settings (still a better quality than Halo 4 or Modern warfare 3) and those titles will be few and far between. The games from the smaller developers won't be much better than their previous generation titles, because even if they do license a modern game engine they won't have the resources to develop the artwork for it.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:25 pm 
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Right the concept of the PS4 and xbox 3 pre-owned lockout I take issue with. I will be showing my rejection of this concept with my wallet.


There are a great many snaggles with it, but most of all, videogame stores are not like CD/DVD etc stores. If I go to HMV now (the two near me are still open) I can get a copy of the White Album, a copy of Schindler's List without much bother. If I go to a GAME store, am I likely to find a copy of Gears of War that is not pre-owned? Furthermore, I went on Game's website - I can't even get a new copy of Gears of War or Gears of War 2 on there. So if you lock out pre-owned purchases then you lock out a great deal of late uptake user base. And while I suspect someone is thinking "download it from Xbox Live or PSN" for this kind of issue, both those services are hilariously over-priced. New games are int he region of £50, when you can get it for £40 or less in pretty much any retail outlet. The price drops are much slower than real world drops. Sales are pretty rare (with the exception of Steam, their DD network is far better run imo) and basically this boils down to holding a gun to our wallets. If we want a game and didn't get it within 6 months or a year afetr release, we have to pay over the odds for it. I have around 200 xbox 360 games, 15 Wii games and 2 PS3 games. I'd expect that about 5% of those were actually bought pre-owned. The ones that were, I could not buy else where. Going down this path will lead me to not buying videogames anymore.

However, I will admit there are possible upsides. Developers and Publishers are always crying about losing money to pre-owned games (I don't see how this really affects them more than any other industry). If they stop pre-owned games, they should be able to reduce prices due to selling more? Except I would be willing to bet on the fact that they will not. What will happen is they'll just blame piracy, which is something I have to think has dropped on consoles. I remember nearly everyone had their Playstation "chipped" now, if you did the equivalent to a 360 or Ps4 it would lock you out. (PC is another issue - Though I absolutely do not pirate videogames so not an area I know much about at all). If sales go up, either game budgets go up or prices come down. But they won't the only thing going up will be sales and profits for EA, Activision, Ubisoft and all the rest.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:05 pm 
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mac_d wrote:
Right the concept of the PS4 and xbox 3 pre-owned lockout I take issue with. I will be showing my rejection of this concept with my wallet.


There are a great many snaggles with it, but most of all, videogame stores are not like CD/DVD etc stores. If I go to HMV now (the two near me are still open) I can get a copy of the White Album, a copy of Schindler's List without much bother. If I go to a GAME store, am I likely to find a copy of Gears of War that is not pre-owned? Furthermore, I went on Game's website - I can't even get a new copy of Gears of War or Gears of War 2 on there. So if you lock out pre-owned purchases then you lock out a great deal of late uptake user base. And while I suspect someone is thinking "download it from Xbox Live or PSN" for this kind of issue, both those services are hilariously over-priced. New games are int he region of £50, when you can get it for £40 or less in pretty much any retail outlet. The price drops are much slower than real world drops. Sales are pretty rare (with the exception of Steam, their DD network is far better run imo) and basically this boils down to holding a gun to our wallets. If we want a game and didn't get it within 6 months or a year afetr release, we have to pay over the odds for it. I have around 200 xbox 360 games, 15 Wii games and 2 PS3 games. I'd expect that about 5% of those were actually bought pre-owned. The ones that were, I could not buy else where. Going down this path will lead me to not buying videogames anymore.

However, I will admit there are possible upsides. Developers and Publishers are always crying about losing money to pre-owned games (I don't see how this really affects them more than any other industry). If they stop pre-owned games, they should be able to reduce prices due to selling more? Except I would be willing to bet on the fact that they will not. What will happen is they'll just blame piracy, which is something I have to think has dropped on consoles. I remember nearly everyone had their Playstation "chipped" now, if you did the equivalent to a 360 or Ps4 it would lock you out. (PC is another issue - Though I absolutely do not pirate videogames so not an area I know much about at all). If sales go up, either game budgets go up or prices come down. But they won't the only thing going up will be sales and profits for EA, Activision, Ubisoft and all the rest.

As an industry the Triple A part of games industry is representative of the worst excesses of capitalism. Those at the top have a license to print money, everyone else goes bankrupt. While the individual designers and creators of the game may have a passion for what they are doing, those in control only care about squeezing as much money as they can from gamers.

Look at Dead Space 3, a triple A title costing as much as any other full price triple A game. But what have Electronic Arts decided to do? They've also added Freemium, pay to play elements to it. So whereas before you either had a game you played a price to play, or a game you played for free but paid to get the full experience Electronic Arts have realise they can charge the full price to sell you an incomplete version of the game and then keep making money off the player in micro transactions in order to get the full experience.

And this isn't like DLC, where you pay more for additional missions etc, to extend the life of the game, this is money generating scheme built in to a full price game. I mean, you can argue to takes balls to attempt that - and given the popularity of the Dead Space franchise I expect they will make a lot of money off it because fanboys leak money from their wallets but whereas Freemium games can justify it on the basis that you get the game for free and you then support the game by paying for the premium content a Triple A game that people have paid $60 and sold millionso f copies has already generated a ton of income that all they are doing is sucking money from other areas. And it's not like the stuff they are charging for costs much to develop - it's like the stupid Xbox avatar clothes you can buy for $2 - the cost is virtually zero. You can justify spending $60 for a Triple A game because it costs tens of millions of dollars to develop. But they sell millionso f titles and get that cost back and more from the sales. When they make $2 for a virtual hat that is just $2 extra profit (as any development costs of the hat would have been covered during hte developement of the game) it's just squeezing more and more money from people.

And that is why I do not trust anything the game sellers have to say on the issue when it comes to their pricing models, about second hand games, etc... While the developers and designs are for the most part passionate about what they do the publishers have realised the money making potential of the industry and are exploiting gamers for every last penny they can extract. They are not interested in making things better - in fact, they would actively make things worse if it was more profitable.

Kickstarter has shown that better games can be developed for a fraction of the price of what the Triple A industry claims - and it's not just indy developers. Peter Molyneux financed a game through it with a budget of £450,000 (ended up raising £526,000) - the makers of Elite are doing a new Elite for just over £1 million. These are both going to be Triple A quality games and potentially better than had they been interfered with by publishers. You would get a copy of the game with a minimum sponsorship level of £15 - which is half the price of a brand new PC game, and a third of the cost of a brand new console game.

And on the issue of the "we sell the hardware at a loss" - Ouya developed their games console on a Kickstarter budget of only $8.5 million. That's MILLION, not billion. Yes, it is less powerful than the PS3 and 360 (although it is debatable it might be closer than people think) but when they announced it many people in the industry said it would never happen because it would be impossible to develop a games console for such little money. However, developers received their hardware at the beginning of the year and the kickstarter backers are set to get their hardware in the next couple of months. The terms and conditions of Ouya's marketplace states that all developers must offer a 'free version' of their game (this can just be a demo).

I see this as a positive - because while those at the top of the games industry are attempting to bleed the games community dry of money, these kickstarter projects (and it seems games are the most popular kickstarter projects) are showing that gamers have had enough of that, are tired of being sold clone paint by numbers games and are taking matters into their own hands.

I am far more excited by Ouya, Steambox than I am about the next generation of Xbox or Playstation. It's a shame, because I have loved playing games on my 360, but if Sony and Microsoft think that locking a copy of a game to a console is either an ethical business move, or even one that makes business sense, then they have lost touch with their industry.

As people have pointed out, DVDs, Blurays, CDs are not locked to devices and have long had a second hand market. Games are no different. What if you want to lend a copy to a friend? Well that would also be impossible - I'm going to assume the games would be locked to your account rather than console (so if you owned more than one console you could play it on more than one machine that you own, or if your console breaks etc...) It should also be mentioned this DRM requires an always on Internet connection - so if your Interrnet connection is down (or you don't have one) you can't play games!

The stupid thing is that there are already ways that games publishers can make buying new more attractive than second hand. For example, free DLC download codes with new copies of the game. So when you buy a game, you can download the DLC for free, but if you resell it the DLC code has expired so a second hand buyer would have to pay for it. But no, let's stop the second hand industry - because what the games industry needs is less people playing games.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:44 pm 
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If I were a game creator, I'd like as many people as possible playing my games, I wouldn't like charging unnecessary high prices at all.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:09 pm 
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@ Alien - :thumbup: I wholly agree on every front.

Also, kickstarter is great. I put in a couple of quid for the Defense Grid Kickstarter for more levels. I can't recall if they got enough to merit the level editor that I want oh so much. But it is a smart system for games where there is a smallish but dedicated fanbase. And it ends up being about as expensive or cheaper than getting the game itself would be. Big fan of kickstarter. And yes, the gaming industry seems to only be successful on a small "cheap" scale and a massive multi-million dollar scale.


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