lamo wrote:
Letting 2 drivers fight for a title in a two horse race is different to this season. Whichever driver put in Bottas' season thus far has a weak hand and if it was Hamilton he would be even worse because he wouldn't even have the get out of jail free card of being new to the team and he is a 3x WDC and the expectation that comes with that.
If it was Hamilton we would be talking about 'when is he going to find his form again and will it be in time to turn his championship challenge around'. No way in hell would Hamilton accept being Bottas wingman after five races, no matter how many teams were competing at the top. And if Merc tried to pull that the next thing would be Hamilton is talking to Ferrari/Red Bull/Renault, no doubt about it. This isn't a comment on Hamilton, rather the way 'elite' (and by elite I mean 'successful') drivers operate. Can you imagine Senna or Prost supporting another driver's title challenge while they could mathematically win it.
lamo wrote:
It all depends on what is meant by support, but if Bottas had performed better in 4 out of 5 races and was 50 points ahead then surely you back him for the title. But if he is ahead that often it usually sorts itself out. Massa was not supposed to be the title challenger in 2008 but it sorted itself out because he was just better than Kimi and as it turns out Kimi only let him by once in China as Kimi was usually always behind.
Well this is true, for all the cant about team orders, how often are they actually used? Because most often the faster driver will be in front. I guess that's why instances of team orders are so memorable, because they really don't happen all that often and certainly not as often as is perceived.
lamo wrote:
Look what happened to Kimi too, he was the star driver signed by Ferrari. Didn't live up to expectations and was paid not to drive for them, something that hasn't happened ever before. They were looking to remove him from the team 18 months after signing him in mid 2008.
Incredibly, as the reigning WDC!
lamo wrote:
If Bottas came in and was clearly better then Hamilton would go the way of Kimi and wouldn't be getting 20m a year, F1 would have its new star. F1 is sink or swim for me, if you aren't quick enough you don't last long and if you do last its in a reduced role ala Kimi now vs 2007.
I don't think anyone expected Bottas to come in and beat Lewis. The most likely scenario was probably Bottas would come in and perform at about the same level as Rosberg. I think ultimately that is what will happen, over the course of the year. The problem with that is that it's neither good enough to push Lewis into second, or reliably 'slow' enough to always qualify and race behind him - and thus not cause the team and Lewis problems with having to issue team orders now and then.
lamo wrote:
Vettel, who did lose to Ricciardo but its not like Ricciardo was miles quicker was kind of fortunate to get the Ferrari seat when he did. If Ricciardo did the same to Vettel in 2015 then no way do Ferrari sign Vettel for big money. They would have signed Ricciardo. I for one, really want to see Ricciardo vs Vettel part II, hopefully at Ferrari.
I agree, no doubt Vettel signed at the right time. But if anything Vettel's bad year should be taken as a clear indicator that drivers aren't always 'on it' all the time. It could be that Vettel, after four years on the trot knew he wasn't going to win again and he just 'gave up'. Or, you know, his eye was off the ball, and that's when things fall apart and the same could be said for the team, maybe they were just exhausted collectively from their success and when it became clear that things had changed their heads dropped and they started losing that winning focus. Ricciardo was new to the team and ready to seize his big chance, it's not difficult to see how a motivated guy could outperform a 'superstar' driver in those circumstances.
Signing Ricciardo would presumably have been a mistake, given their relative performances this year... but I don't subscribe to the view that you can compare drivers in different teams and I certainly don't derive from this that Max would annihilate Vettel in the same car (as some might).